GLENN: I want to come back to that "Glenn Beck, you’re a flip-flopper" on the death penalty because I’ve got a lot to say on that in many different directions. We’ll do that, but I have Alan Gura on the phone. This is the guy who argued the Heller case with the Supreme Court. Allen, congratulations.

GURA: Thank you so much. Great to be here.

GLENN: This has to be quite a banner day for you.

GURA: It’s a fantastic day. It’s a great day for the Constitution, it’s a great day for me personally, of course, but it’s really not about me. It’s really about the Second Amendment and the global rights and it’s a great victory for all Americans.

GLENN: Oh, come on. You know you closed your office door at one point and you went, yes. Did you have a sleepless night last night?

GURA: No, I slept very well. Got to court early and just it was fantastic to be there in the courtroom and listen to Justice Scalia read what I thought was a fantastic opinion.

GLENN: Now, because I know I haven’t heard that you’re an arrogant guy. So I don’t think that comes from arrogance. Was it just that you just felt comfortable with what you did? You just, you felt comfortable that the decision was going to come your way or you just let it —

GURA: We had a very, very strong case and it’s also out of my hands by that point. I mean, there’s been nothing for me to do, you know, and we did our best and all we had to do was just wait and get a decision.

GLENN: Was there any point in the case where you said, this is it, I got it, this is it?

GURA: Today, this morning when we got the decision. You never really know. You can’t assume that you’re going to win things like this. But when we heard the decision, of course, we knew and now it’s great.

GLENN: No, but I mean when you had the case — there was never a point when you were putting the case together, preparing it or arguing it that you thought, this is it; I mean, I’ve got the case, I really think this will do it?

GURA: Well, I felt that from day one this is a winner. This was always a very strong case. The law was clearly unconstitutional. The Second Amendment, a lot’s been written about it and, of course, more today but if you look at the history, if you look at the text, no matter how you slice it, it comes down to individual rights. So I’ve always felt that we were right in a powerful case and that we deserved to win. Of course, a lot of things happen on the way and so I was never really certain that we would actually prevail. There can be all kinds of procedural bumps along the road and we had some in our case. And sometimes courts won’t always get it right. But today the Court got it right and I’m gratified.

GLENN: Give me a sense of historically where this case is going to go down. Is this as big as Roe versus Wade?


GURA: Well, I’m not sure I can rank different cases. Certainly it’s a landmark case. This is one of the all-time important cases because this is a case that tells Americans that a part of the Bill of Rights is in effect and is authorable. It tells us we do have a right. It’s not every day the Supreme Court confirms against a great weight of opposition by government and other forces, that we do actually have a right that we can exercise as a constitutional matter. So it’s profound.

GLENN: Now, will you go and take on any other gun rights? Will you take on Chicago or New York City or are you saying, well, I’m going to move on to something else now?

GURA: Oh, I definitely expect to lead the fight in Chicago and other places as well. You’ll see more from me in this. I’m not — this is not the end for me, and it’s not the end for the Second Amendment. It’s important for people to understand. The Second Amendment is a normal part of the Bill of Rights, and like other parts of the Bill of Rights, like the First Amendment or the Fourth Amendment, it’s going to take time. It’s going to take an endless amount of time. There will be cases that come up to the system and some of them will be successful and some of them will not, but that’s the way our system works. We’re not going to have one case that for all time determines what the Second Amendment means in all contexts.

GLENN: If you were on the other side or you were Chicago or you were New York or whatever, who do you think is sitting back today saying, oh, boy, this is going to mean real trouble for me because I’m on the fence, I mean, you know, I’m a city that has a law or a state or something that I’m probably the lowest hanging fruit?

GURA: Well, I think certainly Chicago has to start thinking about what its laws look like. You know, the people who favor gun prohibition. The gun prohibition movement ended today. It’s very important to understand. The government cannot ban guns and it cannot regulate guns out of existence. There’s always going to be a role for the politicians, for government to play in regulating firearms and we’re not going to see background checks go away and we’re not going to see felon possession laws go away. But when the government regulates guns, it’s going to have to remember there are individual rights and they are going to have to respect that and if they don’t respect it, then we’ll have more days like today where the courts will step in and safeguard our liberties.

GLENN: So today when Michael Bloomberg is eating lunch and he’s got indigestion, it’s really your name that’s giving him the indigestion today.

GURA: Well, I don’t know. I mean, I wouldn’t wish indigestion on Mayor Bloomberg.

GLENN: I would. Let me. Let me. Let me.

GURA: Okay.

GLENN: I wish him indigestion, I do. All right, Allen, congratulations and thanks so much for talking to us.

GURA: Well, thank you so much. Thanks for having me.

GLENN: You bet. Bye-bye.

GURA: Bye.

GLENN: Amazing to be able to talk to somebody who just made history with the Second Amendment.