Glenn interviews 2012 contender Rick Santorum

Rick Santorum threw his name onto the GOP contender list earlier this week, and Glenn interviewed the former Senator on radio this morning.

While introducing Santorum, Glenn said that the potential candidate was on a short list of people that in his mind would be good choices for President in 2012. “ I think he is one of the bravest men out there,” Glenn said.

After listening to the remarks the President about entitlements are what makes America great, Santorum said, “In 2008 America was looking for a President that they could believe in and after experiencing Barack Obama, America that realized that they need a President that believes in them.”

“ I always say that in America we are different and I talk about my grandfather coming to this country, you know, leaving Mussolini's Italy, leaving a good job, leaving security, leaving stability because he wanted freedom more than anything else and the DNA of Americans is different. We value freedom more than anything else and the people that are running this country now don't. They value control and security and this dependency,” he added.

Surprisingly, Glenn played Allen Simpson remarks about Santorum and asked for a response. Simpson had recently said, “We have homophobes in our party. That's disgusting to me. We're all human beings. We're all God's children. Now, if they're going to get off in that stuff -- Santorum has said some cruel things, cruel, cruel things about homosexuals. Ask him about it. See if he agrees to the cruelness of his remarks, years ago. Foul.”

Santorum’s response? “There were no cruel, cruel remarks. All I can ponder is that Allen Simpson is talking about a comment that I made which I paraphrase almost word for word, but paraphrase a Supreme Court Justice on a case calls Lawrence versus Texas, before that case came out which had to do with, as you know, a Supreme Court case on the issue of sodomy and I said that if you have -- if the Supreme Court case is the legal standard to say that consensual sexual activity is now a Constitutional right, then we open up the gates for all sorts of consensual acts.”

Santorum continued, “And unfortunately folks like Allen Simpson saw that as homophobic. It's not homophobic. It's a legal argument. In fact, that's exactly what's happening. We went from Lawrence versus Texas to now a Constitutional right to same sex marriage and they're going into a Constitutional right to polyamorous relationships. This is the slippery slope that we're heading down.”

Glenn also asked Santorum about his views on the Middle East chaos and the debt ceiling. Santorum agreed with many of Glenn’s theories on what could happen in the Middle East in the coming months and years, including a caliphate made up of Turkey, Egypt, and Iran. “I've been writing about it for the last four years and as you know, because I was on your program in 2006, I was talking about those exact same things,” Santorum said.

“I was considered, well, like you are just suggesting, crazy for suggesting that I talk about Hugo Chavez, I talked about the relationship between Venezuela and Iran. I talked about jihadist training camps in central and South America. That is all factually correct. That is, in fact, going on. There is no question that there are elements in the Middle East that would like to establish a caliphate and that, yes, Sunni and Shia are working together. Socialists and Islamists and jihadists are working together,” Santorum added.

“Barack Obama's favorability ratings in the country of Israel is in single digits. So, the people in Israel believe that we've changed allegiances but unfortunately, as you know, Glenn, it's not just Israel. It's anybody that's a friend of the United States we turn our back to routinely,” he said.

“The debt ceiling. Do we vote to extend the debt ceiling?” Glenn asked.

“The only reason you vote to extend the debt ceiling is you get substantial concessions out of this administration on programs that have a meaningful change in the reduction of the deficit and to me, first and foremost, would be Obamacare. I think we have to draw a line,” Santorum said.

Glenn responded, “If you don't pass the debt ceiling, if you don't lift it, the country, the whole world, can go into a tailspin. Do you not believe that or do you think that it's best to do that? “

“Well, first, there's certainly things you can do in passing legislation to actually make that our debts are paid and that what suffers is government programs in the sense of instead of having our credit worthiness affected, what you do is you affect the operations of government instead of our ability to pay our debt. There's still money coming in, enough money coming in to pay our debits if we prioritize how we use those expenditures and so I don't buy off on this, you know, we're going to fall off a cliff. We're going to fall off a cliff if we don't start doing something to deal with this debt and this is an opportunity for us to draw the line in the sand and put their backs to the wall on something that they really want.”

Full Transcript of Interviews Below:

GLENN: Senator Rick Santorum announced that he is taking the next step in a possible run for President in 2012.

PAT: Yeah.

GLENN: Rick Santorum is, I believe, Pat's candidate. He said he's going to vote for Rick Santorum if he runs.

PAT: Uh-huh, uh-huh.

GLENN: I think Rick is on a very short list of about three people for me. I think he is one of the bravest men out there. He said damn the torpedoes in his last election. I'm going to say what is true and they said that's going to kill you in the polls and it did and he said I don't care.

PAT: I don't think Rick said the D word. I don't think he said that. I don't think he would swear that way.

GLENN: He also is -- he is very outspoken on issues of life and what has been happening in the Middle East. He's one of the very few that have gotten this from the very beginning. Welcome to the program, Rick Santorum. How are you, sir?

SANTORUM: I am doing great. Thank you and I appreciate the compliments and the endorsements and I would say "damn" because it's a historical quote.

Glenn: Okay. All right. Let me give the -- let me give you a couple of thing. First I want to start with the President's speech yesterday and I want you to listen to this, especially the last line where he talks about a great country. I don't know if you've picked this up yet, but I would like to hear your comments. Listen to what he's saying about all of these programs and what it means about our country.

PRESIDENT OBAMA: We recognize that no matter how responsible MRI we live our lives, hard times or bad luck, a crippling illness or a layoff may strike any one of us. There but for the grace of God go I, we say to ourselves. And so we contribute to programs like Medicaid and Social Security which guarantee us healthcare and a measure of basic income after a lifetime of hard work. Unemployment insurance which protects us against unexpected job loss and Medicaid which provides care for millions of seniors in nursing homes, poor children, those with disabilities.

GLENN: Listen to this.

PRESIDENT OBAMA: We're a better country because of these commitments. I'll go further. We would not be a great country without those commitments.

SANTORUM: So, prior to 1965 America was not a great country?

PAT: Had you, uh-huh,

SANTORUM: There you go. That kind of sums it up right there, doesn't it?

GLENN: It does.

SANTORUM: I said something when I announced last night and to me this sort of sums up what we've been through these last couple of years. I said, you know, in 2008 America was looking for a President that they could believe in and after experiencing Barack Obama, America that realized that they need a President that believes in them.

GLENN: Can I -- Rick, can I tell you something? This was in the Huffington Post where they're trying to convince Hillary Clinton to run in 2012 and I wanted to bring up your phrase that you said last night because listen to what the Huffington Post said. For Democrats it's no longer change we can believe in but a candidate we can believe in. Again, it's the exact opposite.

SANTORUM: It's the exact -- they're looking for -- this is -- you say this all the time, Glenn, but it really is looking for someone to be the paternalistic -- here's a bunch of folks that fought against the paternalistic system in America and that's what they're looking for. They're looking for the savior, they're looking for the king. I always say that in America we are different and I talk about my grandfather coming to this country, you know, leaving Mussolini's Italy, leaving a good job, leaving security, leaving stability because he wanted freedom more than anything else and the DNA of Americans is different. We value freedom more than anything else and the people that are running this country now don't. They value control and security and this dependency and it is -- it is the fundamental question of our time, are we a society, are we a society that's going to go back to the principles that made this country the greatest country in the history of the world which is simply this, that America, the whole purpose of America, is for you to be free to pursue your dreams. That is -- it's not to create a great government, it's not to create a great economy, it's not to create anything except the ability for you to provide for yourself and the people that you love and to serve the God that you love. Those -- that's what America is all about and we trust people to do that and when people do that, America, the whole society, becomes a great society.

GLENN: All right. So, let me -- and I've never said this phrase before and meant it literally and I feel like I do now every time I say it. Let me play devil's advocate and say, well, a lot of people can't live their dream because the wealthiest 1% have all of the money, they control the money, they are getting richer and richer and let's even -- let's even let the chips fall where they may. The banks and the government and the Fed are going to inflate our money. They're not going to be able to get ahead while the rich, like George Soros or the Coke brothers, are able to continue to compile wealth. So, it means nothing, anyway, Rick Santorum.

SANTORUM: Well, the bottom line is what you're talking about is what's happened over the last 100 years is government has gotten more and more involved in the thing and it's put their finger on the scale and it's done just that. Crony capitalism, which is -- look. I was in Congress for 16 years. The lobbyists for all of the companies, some of whom you just mentioned, didn't come to Congress and say create a level playing field for us to compete. No, they didn't do that. They said we need this to help our business and so they went in and lobbied and, you know, you have an entire structure of government right now that is all about special interest savers for one group or another. We need to get back -- and that's one of the things I love about what Paul Ryan has suggested. We need to get back and get back to simpler tax code, get rid of all of these incentives and get rid of all of these things that tip the scales in favor of who has the most powerful lobbyists in Washington DC and if we do that, if we create that level playing field, we can have an America that allows people to prosper.

One of the things I was most proud of in my time in Congress was not my Chamber of Commerce rating or my big business rating. It was for the National Association of Small Businessmen. Those are the small business guys who actually are in Washington DC that say, Please, just create a level playing field, give us a chance to compete and we'll do just fine.

GLENN: Rick, I'm going to throw you a curve ball here. Allen Simpson talked about you the other day in the most flattering terms. I want to play what Allen Simpson said about you and Republicans like you and have you respond.

SIMPSON: I don't know, but if we're going to get into social issues, we won the governorship -- and I saw them saying that they've seen Christie. I mean, I saw him a few weeks ago. He is quite awesome, but we won a governorship there in New Jersey, one in Virginia by not talking about social issues. Who the hell is for abortion? I don't know anybody running around with a sign that says have an abortion, they're wonderful. They're hideous, but they're a deeply intimate and personal decision and I don't think men legislators should even vote on the issue. Then you've got homosexuality. You've got don't ask, don't tell. We have homophobes in our party. That's disgusting to me. We're all human beings. We're all God's children. Now, if they're going to get off in that stuff -- Santorum has said some cruel things, cruel, cruel things about homosexuals. Ask him about it. See if he agrees to the cruelness of his remarks, years ago. Foul. Now, you know --

GLENN: Okay. Stop.

PAT: What is that?

GLENN: The cruel, cruel remarks.

PAT: Cruel, cruel remarks. I don't think I've ever said that.

SANTORUM: There were no cruel, cruel remarks. All I can ponder is that Allen Simpson is talking about a comment that I made which I paraphrase almost word for word, but paraphrase a Supreme Court justice on a case calls Lawrence versus Texas, before that case came out which had to do with, as you know, a Supreme Court case on the issue of sodomy and I said that if you have -- if the Supreme Court case is the legal standard to say that sexual -- consensual sexual activity is now a Constitutional right, then we open up the gates for all sorts of consensual acts.

PAT: Okay.

SANTORUM: And that is, by the way, what Justice Windsor White, appointed by John Kennedy, said and that's what they said they were not going to allow that standard. I said the same thing.

PAT: Oh, geez.

SANTORUM: And unfortunately folks like Allen Simpson saw that as homophobic. It's not homophobic. It's a legal argument. In fact, that's exactly what's happening. We went from Lawrence versus Texas to now a Constitutional right to same sex marriage and they're going into a Constitutional right to polyamorous relationships. This is the slippery slope that we're heading down.

GLENN: Polyamorous relationships. Polyamorous. That is the most incredible --

SANTORUM: That's the term.

GLENN: Don't use polyamorous. (Laughter.) Geez. One last --

SANTORUM: I said it.

GLENN: One last -- one last question for you and, that is, the Middle East. I have been mocked and ridiculed for saying that there are those in the Middle East that want a caliphate that begins with Turkey, Egypt and Iran even though it's Sunni and Shia. They're working together for the first time. They're working together with socialists and communists, even though they don't have the same point of view on things, and they are destabilizing the Middle East. Iran wants to have control of a caliphate. They're talking about the return of the 12th Imam. Whether you believe it or not, that is an important development. I have also said that Iran has its hooks down in Central America, there are terrorists here in America and they are laying in wait for a Islamic extremist regime, they want Sharia law all over the globe. That's crazy, Rick

SANTORUM: I don't disagree with anything you just said. In fact, I've been writing about it for the last four years and as you know, because I was on your program in 2006, I was talking about those exact same things. I was considered, well, like you are just suggesting, crazy for suggesting that I talk about Hugo Chavez, I talked about the relationship between Venezuela and Iran. I talked about jihadist training camps in central and South America. That is all factually correct. That is, in fact, going on. There is no question that there are elements in the Middle East that would like to establish a caliphate and that, yes, Sunni and Shia are working together. Socialists and Islamists and jihadists are working together. Why? Because the enemy of my enemy is my friend and the United States is the enemy. Western civilization is the enemy. It's not because we have economically repressed them. It's not because we have invaded militarily. It's because of who we are. They object to western civilization. They object to the foundations of our society. They believe that they are evil and they believe that they are doing us a favor by concurring us and converting us to their view of the world.

GLENN: Is the country on the wrong side with Israel? Not the country. Is our administration and is our foreign policy -- have we changed our alliances, do you believe, or are in the midst of changing our alliances?

SANTORUM: Well, let's just look at what the Israelis say. Barack Obama's favorability ratings in the country of Israel is in single digits. So, the people in Israel believe that we've changed allegiances but unfortunately, as you know, Glenn, it's not just Israel. It's anybody that's a friend of the United States we turn our back to routinely. We believe that our job is to show to our enemies that we really, really don't -- aren't going to be good allies, that we're going to embrace them and warm-up to them and, as a result of warming up to them, that they're not going to be mean to us, they're not going to attack us, and one way of showing that is to stiff our allies on a continual basis and certainly nobody has been stiffed more in the last two years than Israel.

GLENN: Okay. I know I keep saying this is the last question, but I just thought of another one I have to ask you. The debt ceiling. Do we vote to extend the debt ceiling?

SANTORUM: No. Look. The only reason you vote to extend the debt ceiling is you get substantial concessions out of this administration on programs that have a meaningful change in the reduction of the deficit and to me, first and foremost, would be Obamacare. I think we have to -- we have to draw a line. This is the reason I objected to what was going on the last few weeks with the continued resolution. We're fighting over $10 billion, $20 billion. We've got to fight over -- we've got to fight over principles that matter for the future of our country.

GLENN: But when -- if you don't pass the debt ceiling, if you don't lift it, the country, the whole world, can go into a tailspin. Do you not believe that or do you think that it's best to do that?

SANTORUM: Well, first, there's certainly things you can do in passing legislation to actually make that our debts are paid and that what suffers is government programs in the sense of instead of having our credit worthiness affected, what you do is you affect the operations of government instead of our ability to pay our debt. There's still money coming in, enough money coming in to pay our debits if we prioritize how we use those expenditures and so I don't buy off on this, you know, we're going to fall off a cliff. We're going to fall off a cliff if we don't start doing something to deal with this debt and this is an opportunity for us to draw the line in the sand and put their backs to the wall on something that they really want.

GLENN: Rick Santorum, thank you so much, sir.

SANTORUM: Keep up the great work. I'm a big fan and a big listener. I appreciate it.

GLENN: Well, likewise. Thank you very much, Rick. We'll talk again. I think this guy -- and I said this in 2006. I think he's a Winston Churchill.

I think we can all agree, both on the Left and the Right, that children who have been caught up in illegal immigration is an awful situation. But apparently what no one can agree on is when it matters to them. This past weekend, it suddenly — and even a little magically — began to matter to the Left. Seemingly out of nowhere, they all collectively realized this was a problem and all rushed to blame the Trump administration.

RELATED: These 3 things need to happen before we can fix our border problem

Here's Rachel Maddow yesterday:

I seem to remember getting mocked by the Left for showing emotion on TV, but I'll give her a pass here. This is an emotional situation. But this is what I can't give her a pass on: where the heck was this outrage and emotion back in 2014? Because the same situation going on today — that stuff Maddow and the rest of the Left have only just now woken up to — was going on back in July 2014! And it was arguably worse back then.

I practically begged and pleaded for people to wake up to what was going on. We had to shed light on how our immigration system was being manipulated by people breaking our laws, and they were using kids as pawns to get it done. But unlike the gusto the Left is using now to report this story, let's take a look at what Rachel Maddow thought was more important back in 2014.

On July 1, 2014, Maddow opened her show with a riveting monologue on how President Obama was hosting a World Cup viewing party. That's hard-hitting stuff right there.

On July 2, 2014, Maddow actually acknowledged kids were at the border, but she referenced Health and Human Services only briefly and completely rushed through what was actually happening to these kids. She made a vague statement about a "policy" stating where kids were being taken after their arrival. She also blamed Congress for not acting.

See any difference in reporting there from today? That "policy" she referenced has suddenly become Trump's "new" policy, and it isn't Congress's fault… it's all on the President.

She goes on throughout the week.

On July 7, 2014, her top story was something on the Koch brothers. Immigration was only briefly mentioned at the end of the show. This trend continued all the way through the week. I went to the border on July 19. Did she cover it? Nope. In fact, she didn't mention kids at the border for the rest of the month. NOT AT ALL.

Do you care about immigrant kids who have been caught in the middle of a broken immigration system or not?

Make up your minds. Is this an important issue or not? Do you care about immigrant kids who have been caught in the middle of a broken immigration system or not? Do you even care to fix it, or is this what it looks like — just another phony, addicted-to-outrage political stunt?

UPDATE: Here's how this discussion went on radio. Watch the video below.

Glenn gives Rachel Maddow the benefit of the doubt

Rachel Maddow broke down in tears live on her MSNBC show over border crisis.

Progressives think the Obamas are a gift to the world. But their gift is apparently more of the metaphorical kind. It doesn't extend to helpful, tangible things like saving taxpayers money. Illinois has approved $224 million to pay for street and transportation upgrades around the planned site of the Obama Presidential Center. The catch is that Illinois taxpayers will have to cover $200 million of that cost. For a presidential museum.

Eight years of multiplying the national debt wasn't enough for Barack Obama. Old fleecing habits die hard. What's another $200 million here and there, especially for something as important as an Obama tribute center?

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That's all well and good except Illinois can't even fund its pension system. The state has a $137 billion funding shortfall. That means every person in Illinois owes $11,000 for pensions, and there is no plan to fix the mess. Unless Illinois progressives have discovered a new kind of math, this doesn't really add up. You can't fund pensions, but you're going to figure out a way to milk the public for another $200 million to help cover the cost of a library?

It's hard to imagine who in their right mind would think this will be money well spent. Well, except for maybe Chicago Mayor and former Obama Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel who said, "The state's… investment in infrastructure improvements near the Obama Center on the South Side of Chicago is money well spent."

Some presidential overreach lasts longer than others.

The spending has already been signed into law, even though the Obama library has not received construction approval yet. Part of the holdup is that the proposed site is on public land in historic Jackson Park. That doesn't seem very progressive of the Obamas, but, you know, for certain presidents, you go above and beyond. It's just what you do. Some presidential overreach lasts longer than others.

Here's the thing about taxing the peasants so the king can build a fancy monument to himself – it's wrong. And completely unnecessary. The Obamas have the richest friends on the planet who could fund this project in their sleep. If the world simply must have a tricked-out Obama museum, then let private citizens take out their wallets voluntarily.

As the Mercury Museum proved this weekend, it is possible to build an exhibit with amazing artifacts that attracts a ton of visitors – and it cost taxpayers approximately zero dollars.

'The fool builds walls': China blasts Trump over tariffs

NICOLAS ASFOURI/AFP/Getty Images

I can picture it now: Thousands of years ago, Qin Shi Huang, the first emperor of China, standing before hordes of his followers, in the Qin Dynasty, with a bright red bamboo hat on, and chanting, "Build that wall!"

It took a couple centuries to build the thing, but it got built. And it has been carefully maintained over the last 2,000 years, but, today, the Great Wall of China is so massive that astronauts can see it during good weather conditions from the lower part of low Earth orbit. The wall boasts over 3,000 miles of towers and brick embankments, with over 1,200 miles of natural defensive barriers. It's worth mentioning that the Chinese government is also exceptionally good at imposing digital walls, so much so that China ranks worst in the world for internet freedom.

RELATED: Trump is following through on his campaign promises. Here are the top 10.

So it's a little strange to hear an editorial run by a major news network in China criticized President Trump for his proposal to build a large wall along the southern border of America.

"Following the path of expanding and opening up is China's best response to the trade dispute between China and the United States, and is also the responsibility that major countries should have to the world," the author wrote. "The wise man builds bridges, the fool builds walls."

Similarly, the Pope told reporters in 2016, "A person who thinks only about building walls, wherever they may be, and not building bridges, is not Christian. This is not the gospel."

Don't throw stones at people who want to build walls when you live in place surrounded by walls.

If you've been to the Vatican, you know that it is surrounded by enormous walls. The same goes for all the celebrities who live in heavily walled compounds—a safety measure—but who have also vehemently criticized President Trump's plans to build a wall.

You know the adage: "People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones at other people's glass houses." Perhaps the phrase needs an update: Don't throw stones at people who want to build walls when you live in place surrounded by walls.

An immaculate Nazi doctor hovers over newborn. He probes and sneers at it. "Take it away," he says. This is the very real process that Nazi doctors undertook during the era of Nazi Germany: Nazi eugenics, the studious, sterile search to find children who would define a pure breed for the German lineage. The Übermensch.

RELATED: Glenn responds to advocates of aborting Down syndrome babies: 'No better than Nazi Germans'

During a speech to a delegation of Italy's Family Association in Rome on Saturday, Pope Francis referred to this cruel Nazi practice, which he used as a comparison to the increasingly popular process throughout Europe of "ending" birth defects, by offering abortions to women who have babies with chromosomal defects.

Here are two passages from the Pope's remarks:

I have heard that it's fashionable, or at least usual, that when in the first months of pregnancy they do studies to see if the child is healthy or has something, the first offer is: let's send it away.

And:

I say this with pain. In the last century the whole world was scandalized about what the Nazis did to purify the race. Today we do the same, but now with white gloves.

When CNN got the quote, and it shocked them so much that they had to verify the quote with the Vatican—in other words, it didn't fit the usual narrative.

It didn't fit the usual narrative.

The Pope also addressed claims that he has dedicated himself to LGBTQ causes:

Today, it is hard to say this, we speak of "diversified" families: different types of families. It is true that the word "family" is an analogical word, because we speak of the "family" of stars, family" of trees, "family" of animals ... it is an analogical word. But the human family in the image of God, man and woman, is the only one. It is the only one. A man and woman can be non-believers: but if they love each other and unite in marriage, they are in the image of God even if they don't believe.

The media have largely seen Pope Francis as the cool Pope, as the Obama of Catholicism. It'll be interesting to see how abruptly and severely that perspective changes.