‘This Dangerous Book’: Hobby Lobby Founder, Wife Share Story Behind Bible Museum

Hobby Lobby president Steve Green and his wife, Jackie Green, shared their passion for the Bible as a sacred text and a crucial part of history on today’s show, discussing their new book, “This Dangerous Book: How the Bible Has Shaped Our World and Why It Still Matters Today.”

The Green family is backing the privately funded Museum of the Bible, which recently opened in Washington, D.C. just a couple of blocks from the National Mall. Entry to the museum and its Bible Garden is free.

Glenn shared a quote from one of his kids, who asked why a museum about the Bible was in Washington, D.C., where it doesn’t seem likely that many people would want to see it.

“I said, ‘I think that’s the point,’” Glenn said.

“It was the right place for us to be,” Steve Green added.

This article provided courtesy of TheBlaze.

GLENN: You know, most families don't impact people over multiple generations as much as this family has impacted our world in one and two generations.

Steve and Jackie green join us. They're the founding family of the museum of the Bible in Washington, DC. And the author of this dangerous book. How the Bible shaped our world. And why it still matters today.

Steve and Jackie, welcome.

STEVE: Thank you, Glenn. It's good to be here.

GLENN: So I was just in Hobby Lobby over the weekend. And we were talking as a family. And one of my older children was there. And we were talking about the museum of the Bible. And they -- and she said, how did this all begin, Dad? How did this -- how did this happen?

And I said, well, I know Hobby Lobby started with, you know, frames in a garage. And the family just kind of grew up in it.

But Steve and Jackie, how did the Bible part of it start?

STEVE: Well, for me, it started in my home. My parents grew up in a Christian home. My grandfather was a minister himself. My dad's dad. And, you know, my parents took us to church and taught us to love God's word. And follow his ways in our lives. And in our family. And so we -- we just -- that was part of our life. And my wife was the same. She grew up in a Christian home as well. And the Bible just being a part of our life from when we were born.

GLENN: So, Jackie, you guys have a remarkable family. And you have seen what money usually does to a family. I just read a book.

I can't remember the name of it. But it was about Jay Paul Getty and his family. And how the money just destroyed them.

What is it that keeps your family on the track?

JACKIE: Well, I think that, first of all, I would just say, you know, God helps us to realize and remember that everything we have, we've given to him. And he gave to us. And we just give it back to him.

And so our blessings come from above. And there's great joy in realizing that, you know, we don't really have all the ownership. That it really belongs to God.

So being a family of faith, thankfully, we -- we have a family that everyone has embraced their own faith. And embraces the teachings of the Bible for themselves. And I think that's paramount in where we are today.

GLENN: Do you think you could have done -- do you guys think you could have accomplished, just as a family, I don't even mean business, just as a family, do you guys think you could have accomplished what you accomplished if you lived in New York City?

JACKIE: I don't know. I mean, I think God can do anything anywhere. But it would be -- we would have different challenges, of course. We live in a great part of the country, in the Bible Belt. And, you know, it's a great place to raise a family and to, you know, work hard and run a business.

GLENN: So we are -- you know, we were talking as we were walking through Hobby Lobby. And we were talking about the museum of the Bible. And my daughter said, why wouldn't they build it where people would want to go see it? I mean, it's in Washington, DC. Nobody wants the Bible.

And I said, I think that's the point.

What's the reaction that you guys have seen?

STEVE: Well, when we first started looking, we were actually looking in your town in Dallas. And then one opened up -- said, what if God does one in Dallas?

And when I looked up at the top two -- ten metros, the other two that stood out to me was New York City and Washington DC. And we did a survey. The survey showed, it would be best attended in DC, which really makes sense. Because that's the hub of museums in our country. Where museum goers go.

So we just feel like that God knew best. That ever that this facility we acquired was a great location. Just two blocks from one of the most attended museums in our country. And that it was the right place for us to be.

Some kind of chide us thinking that our intent is to impact politics. And, of course, I'm sitting here thinking, who isn't in this town to impact politics? And what would be wrong if that was our motive?

GLENN: Yeah.

STEVE: But it was really because this is where the best attended it -- a lot of visitors here are international, who will have an international impact. And we just think that our -- our legislators ought to know the foundation of our nation and its biblical roots. And, hopefully, they would come in and it would impact them as well.

GLENN: Are you surprised at the number of people in Washington that -- that -- they really have no clue as to our real heritage?

STEVE: Yeah. You know, I -- I think that that is a sad commentary not just here, but in our nation, is the lack of understanding of biblical influence that -- the Bible had on our Founders. And how that it shaped our nation, our freedoms, our economy, our government.

It just had a huge impact.

And I think we probably know it less today than ever, partly because we don't teach the Bible in our schools like we once did. And so there's a great need to educate America on the Bible's impact on our world.

GLENN: So how do you -- how do you do that with -- I mean, even Christopher Hitchens, you know, who was a huge atheist, he said, if you want to understand western culture, you must understand the Bible. You won't understand Shakespeare if you haven't read the Bible.

You know, it is the cornerstone. And he said that it should be taught as -- as literary in a literary class.

But you're not going to get that now. How do we make this shift?

STEVE: Well, and he's not the only -- even Richard Dawkins in his book, The God Delusion, says something very similar. He said to be culturally literate, you need to know it. And he lists over 100 examples of phrases just in our everyday language that comes from the Bible. Good Samaritan, eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth, and so forth.

GLENN: Yeah.

STEVE: So even they recognize to be educated in our world, you need to know this book, because it's had such an impact. And that's one of the reasons why we've taken the position in the museum of not espousing our faith. We're just teaching the facts of the book because we are interested in having a curriculum to educate students in our schools about the Bible, in a nonsectarian way, not espousing faith, just teaching the facts of this book.

Because we agree with Christopher Hitchens, that it ought to be a part of our educational system.

GLENN: You -- the name of the book that you guys have just put out is this dangerous book.

And I look at what's happening in the Middle East. People won't recognize that the group of people that are probably rivalling the first century, that are under attack now, more than anybody else, are Christians. And it is for that dangerous book.

They seem to -- I know you guys travel all over the world. The people I have met in the Middle East, have a very different view of their responsibility as a Christian, to that book and to those words and to their faith, than I think most Americans do.

STEVE: Yeah. In our nation, it is just easy. And I think that as a society starts down a path of persecuting Christians, it really separates those that are serious about their faith and those that are just pretending. And it's easy to pretend, to have a faith and attend church from time to time. But there are parts of our world where it's a life and death situation if a person wants to follow the principles of this book.

And part of why we called it this dangerous book. We talk about those that have given their life, because of their life for this book. And it's no different today. I understand there's probably more people that are suffering for their faith today than ever before. Because it's a challenging world. And there are people that love this book. And there are people that hate it. And it shows up in our news from time to time.

STU: Jackie, you talk a lot in the book about something I think Christians have a difficult time with, as I think everybody does, which is tithing and giving -- giving your money away. And it's not just about being charitable. It's also about leading with the charity. Giving that money away first. Giving the money to God first. Can you talk about that a little bit?

JACKIE: Well, yeah, sure. I think as a family, that we -- as I mentioned earlier, we do feel like our blessings come from God. And when you can -- when you realize that, when you know that in your heart, it makes it a lot easier to understand it. We also -- you know, we're taught in the Bible to give to the -- to take care of the widow, the orphan, and to help those in need. And feed the hungry. And, you know, clothing.

And that sort of thing. And I think that when you embrace the principles taught in the Bible, it becomes much easier to do that. Recognizing everything we do comes from God. And we share some of that. We share some of our personal experiences with the Bible, in our book. And we look at the impact of the Bible and its influence in our world, in our culture, every day. All around us.

And then, you know, we feel like it's important for people to understand and be encouraged to read the Bible and learn more about it. Because it's the best-selling book of all time. Consistently, year after year.

STU: More than Harry Potter. That's confirmed.

GLENN: Listen to this. This is in the book. I love this. Let's see. Da Vinci Code. C.S. Lewis. Lion, Witch, and the Wardrobe. Estimated about 80 million each.

Don Quixote, 150 million. Catcher in the Rye, 65 million. Black Beauty, 50 million. Harry Potter, 100 million, along with The Little Princess, 100 million. Tolkien, Lord of the Rings, 150 million copies. The Bible is estimated to be 5 billion copies. Five billion.

STU: It seems like it deserves a museum. It really does.

JACKIE: We think.

STEVE: Well, and some have said, why now? And, of course, more times, you get the question, why hasn't this been done before? I think we have the best material of any museum here in DC because this book has impacted our world unlike anything else.

So its story needs to be told, and that's why we wanted to tell it, in a state-of-the-art, first class museum.

GLENN: And I appreciate the book that you guys have just put out too, because it talks about your personal life. I'm fascinated by how grounded your family is. And you talk about -- you know, you talk about the adoption in your family and -- and just a lot of stuff that I can really relate to. And I appreciate you sharing the personal side as well. Thank you so much. God bless, guys.

STEVE: Well, and one of those is just that we feel like it was providential. And our Founders in this nation felt the same thing, time and time again. They just felt like God was in the middle of it. And we feel that with this museum and our adoption, and those are some of the stories that we share.

GLENN: Thank you, guys. God bless you. Have a good holiday.

Stop trying to be right and think of the children

Mario Tama/Getty Images

All the outrage this week has mainly focused on one thing: the evil Trump administration and its minions who delight in taking children from their illegal immigrant parents and throwing them all in dungeons. Separate dungeons, mind you.

That makes for a nice, easy storyline, but the reality is less convenient. Most Americans seem to agree that separating children from their parents — even if their parents entered the US illegally — is a bad thing. But what if that mom and dad you're trying to keep the kids with aren't really the kids' parents? Believe it or not, fraud happens.

RELATED: Where were Rachel Maddow's tears for immigrant children in 2014?

While there are plenty of heartbreaking stories of parents simply seeking a chance for a better life for their children in the US, there are also corrupt, abusive human traffickers who profit from the illegal immigration trade. And sorting all of this out is no easy task.

This week, the Department of Homeland Security said that since October 2017, more than 300 children have arrived at the border with adults claiming to be their parents who turned out not to be relatives. 90 of these fraud cases came from the Rio Grande Valley sector alone.

In 2017, DHS reported 46 causes of fraudulent family claims. But there have already been 191 fraud cases in 2018.

Shouldn't we be concerned about any child that is smuggled by a human trafficker?

When Homeland Security Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen pointed out this 315 percent increase, the New York Times was quick to give these family fraud cases "context" by noting they make up less than one percent of the total number of illegal immigrant families apprehended at the southern border. Their implication was that Nielsen was exaggerating the numbers. Even if the number of fraud cases at the border was only 0.001 percent, shouldn't we be concerned about any child that is smuggled by a human trafficker?

This is the most infuriating part of this whole conversation this week (if you can call it a "conversation") — that both sides have an angle to defend. And while everyone's busy yelling and making their case, children are being abused.

What if we just tried, for two seconds, to love having mercy more than we love having to be right all the time?

Remember when cartoons were happy things? Each panel took you on a tiny journey, carrying you to an unexplored place. In Understanding Comics, Scott McCloud writes:

The comics creator asks us to join in a silent dance of the seen and the unseen. The visible and the invisible. This dance is unique to comics. No other artform gives so much to its audience while asking so much from them as well. This is why I think it's a mistake to see comics as a mere hybrid of the graphic arts and prose fiction. What happens between . . . panels is a kind of magic only comics can create.

When that magic is manipulated or politicized, it often devolves the artform into a baseless thing. Yesterday, Occupy Wall Street published the perfect example of low-brow deviation of the artform: A six-panel approach at satire, which imitates the instructions-panel found in the netted cubbyhole behind seats on airplanes. The cartoon is a critique of the recent news about immigrant children being separated from their parents after crossing the border. It is a step-by-step guide to murdering US Immigrations and Customs Enforcement agents.

RELATED: Cultural appropriation has jumped the shark, and everyone is noticing

The first panel shows a man shoving an infant into a cage meant for Pomeranians. The following five panels feature instructions, and include pictures of a cartoonish murder.

The panels read as follows:

  1. If an ICE agent tries to take your child at the border, don't panic.
  2. Pull your child away as quickly as possibly by force.
  3. Gently tell your child to close his/her eyes and ears so they won't witness what you are about to do.
  4. Grab the ICE agent from behind and push your knife into his chest with an upward thrust, causing the agent's sternum to break.
  5. Reach into his chest and pull out his still beating heart.
  6. Hold his bloody heart out for all other agents to see, and tell them that the same fate awaits them if they f--- with your child again.

Violent comics are nothing new. But most of the time, they remain in the realms of invented worlds — in other words, not in our own, with reference to actual people, let alone federal agents.

The mainstream media made a game of crying racism with every cartoon depiction of Obama during his presidency, as well as during his tenure as Senator, when the New Yorker, of all things, faced scrutiny for depicting him in "Muslim clothing." Life was a minefield for political cartoonists during the Obama era.

Chris Hondros/Getty Images

This year, we saw the leftist outrage regarding The Simpsons character Apu — a cartoon representation of a highly-respected, though cartoonishly-depicted, character on a cartoon show composed of cartoonishly-depicted characters.

We all remember Charlie Hebdo, which, like many outlets that have used cartoon satire to criticize Islam, faced the wrath and ire of people unable to see even the tamest representation of the prophet, Muhammad.

Interesting, isn't it? Occupy Wall Street publishes a cartoon that advocates murdering federal agents, and critics are told to lighten up. Meanwhile, the merest depiction of Muhammad has resulted in riots throughout the world, murder and terror on an unprecedented scale.

The intersection of Islam and comics is complex enough to have its own three-hour show, so we'll leave it at that, for now. Although, it is worth mentioning the commentary by satirical website The Onion, which featured a highly offensive cartoon of all the major religious figures except Muhammad. It noted:

Following the publication of the image above, in which the most cherished figures from multiple religious faiths were depicted engaging in a lascivious sex act of considerable depravity, no one was murdered, beaten, or had their lives threatened.

Of course, Occupy Wall Street is free to publish any cartoon they like. Freedom of speech, and so on—although there have been several instances in which violent cartoons were ruled to have violated the "yelling fire in a crowded theater" limitation of the First Amendment.

Posting it to Twitter is another issue — this is surely in violation of Twitter's violent content policy, but something tells me nothing will come of it. It's a funny world, isn't it? A screenshot of a receipt from Chick-fil-A causes outrage but a cartoon advocating murder gets crickets.

RELATED: Twitter mob goes ballistic over Father's Day photo of Caitlyn Jenner. Who cares?

In Understanding Comics, Scott McCloud concludes that, "Today the possibilities for comics are — as they've always been — endless. Comics offers . . . range and versatility, with all the potential imagery of film and painting plus the intimacy of the written word. And all that's needed is the desire to be heard, the will to learn, and the ability to see."

Smile, and keep moving forward.

Crude and awful as the Occupy Wall Street comic is, the best thing we can do is nod and look elsewhere for the art that will open our eyes. Let the lunatics draw what they want, let them stew in their own flawed double standards. Otherwise, we're as shallow and empty as they are, and nothing good comes of that. Smile, and keep moving forward.

Things are getting better. Show the world how to hear, how to learn, how to see.

People should start listening to Nikki Haley

ANDREW CABALLERO-REYNOLDS/AFP/Getty Images

Okay. Let's take a vote. You know, an objective, quantifiable count. How many resolutions has the UN Human Rights Council adopted condemning dictatorships? Easy. Well. How do you define "dictatorship"?

Well, one metric is the UN Human Rights Council Condemnation. How many have the United Nations issued to China, with a body count higher than a professional Call of Duty player?

Zero.

How about Venezuela, where socialism is devouring its own in the cruelest, most unsettling ways imaginable?

Zero.

And Russia, home of unsettling cruelty and rampant censorship, murder and (actual) homophobia?

Zero.

Iraq? Zero. Turkey? Iraq? Zero. Cuba? Zero. Pakistan? Zero.

RELATED: Nikki Haley just dropped some serious verbal bombs on Russia at the UN

According to UN Human Rights Council Condemnations, 2006-2016, none of these nations is as dangerous as we'd imagined. Or, rather, none of them faced a single condemnation. Meanwhile, one country in particular has faced unbelievable scrutiny and fury — you'll never guess which country.

No, it's not Somalia. It's Israel. With 68 UN Human Rights Council Condemnations! In fact, the number of total United Nations condemnations against Israel outnumbers the total of condemnations against all other countries combined. The only country that comes close is Syria, with 15.

The Trump administration withdrew from the United Nations Human Rights Council on Tuesday in protest of what it perceives as an entrenched bias against Israel and a willingness to allow notorious human rights abusers as members.

In an address to the UN Security Council on Tuesday, Nikki Haley said:

Let's remember that the Hamas terrorist organization has been inciting violence for years, long before the United States decided to move our embassy. This is what is endangering the people of Gaza. Make no mistake, Hamas is pleased with the results from yesterday... No country in this chamber would act with more restraint than Israel has.

Maybe people should start listening to Haley. Hopefully, they will. Not likely, but there's no crime in remaining hopeful.

Here's a question unique to our times: "Should I tell my father 'Happy Father's Day,' even though he (she?) is now one of my mothers?"

Father's Day was four days ago, yes, but this story is just weird enough to report on. One enjoyable line to read was this gem from Hollywood Gossip: "Cait is a woman and a transgender icon, but she is also and will always be the father of her six children."

RELATED: If Bruce was never a he and always a she, who won the men's Olympic gold in 1976?

Imagine reading that to someone ten — even five — years ago. And, honestly, there's something nice about it. But the strangeness of its having ever been written overpowers any emotional impact it might bring.

"So lucky to have you," wrote Kylie Jenner, in the Instagram caption under pre-transition pictures of Bruce Jenner.

Look. I risk sounding like a tabloid by mere dint of having even mentioned this story, but the important element is the cultural sway that's occurring. The original story was that a band of disgruntled Twitter users got outraged about the supposed "transphobic" remarks by Jenner's daughter.

But, what we should be saying is, "who the hell cares?" Who cares what one Jenner says to another — and more importantly and on a far deeper level — who cares what some anonymous Twitter user has to say?

When are we going to stop playing into the hands of the Twitter mob?

When are we going to stop playing into the hands of the Twitter mob? Because, at the moment, they've got it pretty good. They have a nifty relationship with the mainstream media: One or two Twitter users get outraged by any given thing — in this case Jenner and supposed transphobia. In return, the mainstream media use the Twitter comment as a source.

Then, a larger Twitter audience points to the article itself as proof that there's some kind of systemic justice at play. It's a closed-market currency, where the negative feedback loop of proof and evidence is composed of faulty accusations. Isn't it a hell of a time to be alive?