Senator Elizabeth Dole
GLENN: Is Elizabeth Dole on with us now? Let's go to Elizabeth Dole. Senator Dole, how are you?
SENATOR DOLE: Fine, how are you doing this morning?
GLENN: I'm doing good. I understand I made a mistake yesterday. I crossed two stories, you know, and how that happens, they said in Ghostbusters, whatever you do, don't cross the streams and that's exactly what happened to me. Did I make your phone ring yesterday unfortunately?
SENATOR DOLE: I think there were a few angry people.
SENATOR DOLE: Who said, she voted for this? And of course, I had been very much against the bailout.
GLENN: My apologies for that, and I wanted to make sure that we put you on the air right away to correct it. In fact, I want to give you a special number so you can call in to the studio. If anything -- it won't, but if anything like that -- I'm afraid of, you know, the whole Fairness Doctrine. So -- because we try to make our mistakes against congress very, very minimal. I'm going to give you a phone number so you can call in at any time if you want to call in.
SENATOR DOLE: Sure.
GLENN: I apologize for that. Okay. So you were against the Fairness Doctrine. Can you tell me, do you have any idea why John McCain decided to go for it with all of this pork in it?
SENATOR DOLE: Well, I can't speak for John but what I can tell you about John's background here is that John McCain back in 2003 -- and I had just joined the Senate. It was my first year in the Senate, and I came up with legislation along with two other members of the banking committee to push hard for a world class regulator of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and these entities spent millions, tens of millions of dollars. In fact, by the time it was finally passed, it took five years, it was passed in July of this year in the housing bill. They had spent $100 million lobbying against our bill, and John McCain had signed onto that bill, made a floor speech and literally most of what's going on right now, Glenn, it would have been prevented, if that bill to rein in Fannie and Freddie, to have a world class regulator with oversight to take care of the excesses and to make sure what they were doing with their portfolios and overseeing new products and so on, if that legislation had passed, all of this could have been prevented or most of it. So that really infuriates me.
GLENN: I can't -- I don't know, honestly I don't know how people sleep at night one way or another if you work in Washington, how you sleep with somebody just making stuff up whole and just saying, "Oh, no, it's this guy's fault." When I see Barney Frank and I see Chris Dodd and I see these guys on television, blood shoots out of my eyes because I can't believe -- how do they sleep at night?
SENATOR DOLE: I know, and I have to tell you that in April 2005 we were having a committee hearing, banking committee on Fannie and Freddie and Chuck Schumer said they're doing a very, very good job. Now, that's the same Chuck Schumer who is spending -- he's committed almost $10 million to run ugly, mean, untruthful ads against me in North Carolina. He's trying to buy North Carolina.
GLENN: Chuck Schumer is?
SENATOR DOLE: Chuck Schumer.
GLENN: Why is Chuck Schumer involved?
SENATOR DOLE: Chuck Schumer is the chairman of the Democratic senatorial campaign committee and so he is sending all of this money in. Can you imagine having $10 million coming in against you in ugly, mean spirited ads? So that's taking place, George Soros, moveon.org, you know, altogether it comes to about $10 million.
GLENN: Senator Dole, you --
SENATOR DOLE: Same Chuck Schumer who sat there and said that Fannie and Freddie were doing just great when we were trying so hard to get legislation to rein them in and to make sure that we were protecting people.
GLENN: What do you -- I mean, you have to go home at night and just look at the state of our country and look at the absolute left wing. These aren't Democrats. These are left wing, some of them, Marxist in their philosophy and see what's coming our way and know that your race could be the tipping point for even a filibuster.
SENATOR DOLE: That's right.
GLENN: What is coming our way if we don't even have a filibuster?
SENATOR DOLE: I know, and you look at what's going to happen here. They sweetened this bill with $150 billion more when it went back over to the House side. So it's now like at, you know, not just 700 but $850 billion in order to get the House votes. But Chuck Schumer's trying to do, and this goes back to your point, he's trying to get to 60 votes. And why do you want 60 votes? Because then you are filibuster-proof. In other words, you can't -- the other side can't stop things from going through. They have got the votes to push back and so you get tax increases and you get judges making law from the bench.
GLENN: Oh, you'll erase -- and I know this probably didn't work in your favor yesterday because of my mistake, but you'll erase talk radio, you will erase -- the Fairness Doctrine will be gone. There will be no one left to stand up against anything.
SENATOR DOLE: Right.
GLENN: The only two times we've had this, if I'm not mistaken, was the New Deal and then the Great Society. Those are the only two times this has happened.
SENATOR DOLE: Well, you know, there are 23 of us running and there are only 12 on the other side. So you can see how they are going after trying to get that 60, and no question. Even if you get 57, 58, you know, you are close enough if you can pick up a person here or two and it just means you can't fight back on anything. It just goes rolling through and excuse me, but all hell breaks through, you know?
GLENN: Do you mean holding on for just a second? I've got a network break. I'd like to come back and talk about what happened, you know, during this bill. Was there anybody outraged when they started sweetening it? Was there anybody that said, oh, my gosh, now this is even, now this is even worse.
SENATOR DOLE: Well, there were -- I made suggestions as to, there were 200 economists who said there are better ways to do this. We can get this done. But we need to just stay here and get it done right because it's too important to the country.
GLENN: Do you mind, could you hang on for just a second?
SENATOR DOLE: I can do just a couple more minutes but I've got a 10:00 that I have to travel to.
GLENN: If you don't mind, we'll take a quick three minute break and then we'll come right back with you.
GLENN: Senator Dole, I know you're pressed for time. If we just cover one question here before you have to run and that is, where does this congress stop? We've done the bailout bill. We're talking now about taking on commercial paper, we're talking about, you know, bailing out now student loans, credit cards, everything else. Where do they stop?
SENATOR DOLE: Well, you know, we tried very hard through providing legislation for the secretary of education so that more liquidity could be provided. Literally billions of dollars was permitted for me to ensure that student loans were not impacted. A lot of work took place earlier on that. The thing that gets me is these 200 or more economists say, you know, there are other ways to do this that could be so much more effective like providing secured loans or establishing a loan guarantee program or providing a significant and immediate tax credit for purchasing a home, you know, the mark-to-market accounting, to suspend that for a period of time. So I had a whole list of suggestions for, hey, let's do this a different way.
GLENN: Was anybody listening at all?
SENATOR DOLE: At that point, you know, of course the House of Representatives was very much concerned but then you get all these added goodies, this $150 billion added to the $700 billion and everyone's in a hurry and, you know, something as important as this, as much as I wanted to be in North Carolina, stay there, get it done right, it's too important for the future of America.
GLENN: Senator Dole, we wish you luck and we'll talk to you again.
SENATOR DOLE: Thank you. I look forward to it. Thank you. Bye now.