The House of Representatives recently voted FOR an extension of FISA Section 702, which allows for the warrantless surveillance of American citizens in certain cases. But this wasn't a Democratic effort. 147 Republicans voted for it along with most of the Democrats. Glenn speaks with one of the Republicans who opposed the extension, Rep. Thomas Massie (R-KY), who believes Congress just "threw away the 4th Amendment." Rep. Massie explains the dirty tricks that the House used to pass the extension, including tying it to a defense package and giving legislators a "false choice" to either pass it or doom the world. So, is there any hope that this can be fixed?
Below is a rush transcript that may contain errorsGLENN: Thomas Massie, welcome to the program, sir. How are you?
MASSIE: Well, I've been better.
I am a little bit out of breath. I just ran from that vote that just threw away the Fourth Amendment to our Constitution. They passed the -- the extension of the foreign intelligence surveillance act.
GLENN: Oh, my gosh.
MASSIE: That's been used to spy on Americans. So it's misnamed.
GLENN: Was it even close?
MASSIE: It was close. In a way. We only needed one-third of the House to vote against it, to stop it.
See, I sit on the rules committee. Chip Roy sits on the rules committee. Ralph Norman sits on the Rules Committee. We have a blocking position and we said, you're not going to mash this thing together, with the funding for our military, and put it on the floor.
That's the swamp way of doing things. And we're done with that. So instead of bringing the bill through the rules committee, as most rules go.
They brought it on the floor, without going to the Rule Committee by suspending the rules.
Now, they can do that. But then they have to get a two-thirds majority vote. We needed 140 votes, roughly, out of the people who were present. To stop it.
GLENN: Yeah. Yeah. 118. I would assume most of them Republicans, but I hear there were some Democrats that were against this as well.
MASSIE: Yeah. We had 73 Republicans vote against this, and 45 Democrats vote against it.
GLENN: Listen to this, America.
Just 76, did you say? Republicans!
MASSIE: Republicans, yeah.
GLENN: That is insanity. What are these people thinking?
MASSIE: Well, Glenn, they put you in a skiff here. One of the secret realms without your phone, and they try to convince you that the world is going to end if they don't allow you to reauthorize this. But that's a false choice. We passed a reform to this, that would require the government to get a warrant.
Out of Jim Jordan's Judiciary Committee, another committee that Chip Roy and I sit on. And the Speaker, instead of bringing it to the floor, as a standalone bill, brought this -- this horrible thing, that as you said in your intro, we already know they've admitted. They've used it illegally on -- 250,000 times on Americans. They brought this same program back to the floor. And they say it's a four-month reauthorization.
GLENN: It's not.
MASSIE: But Mike Lee read the bill, points out, it may be a year of reauthorization. Because they will just reset the clock in January.
GLENN: I -- can you give me any hope for -- for the republic?
MASSIE: People ask me, is there any hope?
I say, I am here on the 5 percent chance that we can fix it.
And on the 30 percent chance, that it all goes to hell, and I live through that. And I can be here to try to put it back together.
So, you know. We started out this year.
We were -- you know, and McCarthy put three of us on the rules committee. So we could make sure that this didn't happen. So we could make sure they didn't put two different bills together.
You understand -- I don't want to defend it. But I want to explain the reason 147 Republicans voted the wrong way. They were given a false choice.
They were saying, if you don't -- if you don't fund this program, then we won't be able to spy on terrorists. And, oh, by the way, we've attached it to the military funding bill and the soldiers won't get paid. And they won't --
GLENN: You know, I'm sorry.
I'm sorry, Thomas. I don't mean to. I'm probably as mad as you are. But you're being much too kind. I'm sorry. If you're in Congress, and if you fall into that trap, which has which has been used over and over and over again, by both sides, you're a moron. And not smart enough to be in Washington, DC. Sorry.
MASSIE: It's -- it's Lucy and the football for some of us who have been here for ten years. We've seen it about three times. Because this program comes up for reauthorization every four years or so.
But you're right. They use the same tricks over and over. And in the classified rooms, they give you examples of how this program has been used to stop terrorists. But they don't give you examples of how this -- being able to spy on Americans, without a warrant has ever been able to help them stop a terrorist.
GLENN: We have -- I mean, does CTIL ring a bell with anyone?
Are they even paying attention?
You know, what Matt Taibbi and -- and Shellenberger came out and testified to, about CTIL and the program of psychological ops, being run on the American people.
The last thing this government needs is more power.
You know, everybody on the left, and the media. Oh, Donald Trump is going to be a dictator.
What's the difference, from what we're doing right now?
What's the difference?
MASSIE: Here's what's so frustrating to me, Glenn. Is we've waited. I've waited a decade to get a Chairman of Judiciary or Chairman of Intel. And in this case, we have got the Chairman of Judiciary who actually cares about this issue Jim Jordan.
And -- and Mike Johnson served on this committee. He was working on this problem, with us.
Then he became speaker. And he won't bring the judiciary bill to the floor.
GLENN: Why? Why?
What part of his soul do you think he sold?
MASSIE: I don't think he sold his soul.
I think they have put him in one of these rooms and shared him the extra super classified stuff. And convinced him, if he doesn't do this, this will be a terrorist attack on --
GLENN: There will be a terrorist attack in this country, because our borders are wide open.
MASSIE: That is true.
GLENN: I mean, you cannot have it both ways. You can't say, we have to have this tool, because terrorist attacks are going to happen. But we're letting 15 -- what is it 5,000 people in every day.
You can't have it both ways!
MASSIE: Listen, you're --
GLENN: I know. I'm sorry.
MASSIE: But your frustration is an expression of the frustration of your listeners and of my voters.
I am -- Chip Roy. He tried -- I have to give him credit. He called a motion to adjourn, before they brought this bill up. He tried to adjourn Congress.
GLENN: He should have put -- you know what, he should have pulled the fire alarm. They don't do anything about that anyway.
MASSIE: I guess we should all pull fire alarms.
GLENN: Yeah. I mean, it's unbelievable.
And then the gall of James clapper to come out.
And have the same people, that wrote the public statement about Hunter Biden's laptop. The same people come out and say, we really need section 702.
How do these people have any credibility?
MASSIE: I don't know. But they put them as subject matter experts.
They should be a reason to vote against this.
GLENN: Exactly right. Exactly right.
Okay. Can you tell me.
Gosh, you know, Thomas. You know I love you.
Don't feel like I'm taking it out on you.
But you're one of the good guys.
And thank Chip and Mike and everybody else working behind the scenes to stop this stuff.
MASSIE: There's a little bit of hope, Glenn.
Let me give you a little bit of hope. We still have the judiciary bill that can still bring it to the floor.
We can still pass that in the House. That's what we need to do. There's a fake reform package that the Intel Committee has passed. We do not need to bring that to the floor. Actually, Chip Roy and I and Ralph Norman stopped that from coming to the floor this week. The fake one.
So there's a real one on the docket. They could mark it up. January, February, March. That's what we need to do. It's got reforms like get a damn warrant.
It's got reforms like criminal penalties for people who abuse the program. It's got reforms like congressmen can go there, and look at what's goggle. Kind of reforms.
I think it's a serious bill.
That's the one we should go to the floor. And we should do it as soon as we get back from Christmas.
GLENN: All right. What else is being sneaked by the American people in the holiday season.
Because this is when it always happens. What else is going to happen?
MASSIE: Well, while I've got you on here. Here's what's coming up next. They did the extension. The CR.
GLENN: Yeah. Of course they did.
MASSIE: Into January and February. But remember, I got a provision that if they keep doing PRs, the whole budget gets cut 1 percent. I know that's not enough. But that will kick in, in April. And they are freaking out right now.
GLENN: Over 1 percent!
MASSIE: Over 1 percent. Like the world will end, if we spend 1 percent less this year than the Democrats did last year.
GLENN: Joe Biden -- Joe Biden farted out $200 million to Ukraine, and that wouldn't even -- that's not even touching 1 percent.
You are kidding me? They're freaking out?
MASSIE: They're freaking out. 1 percent is 15 billion. And Joe Biden is asking for another 60 billion.
He's asking for 4 percent of our discretionary budget additionally to go to Ukraine. And they're freaking out over this 1 percent cut provision, that I got signed into law. They did this out of desperation.
But now it's coming up. They will move heaven and earth to get out of that 1 percent. That's what everybody needs to be watching, I think, right now. Is whether they cheat us out of the 1 percent cut that Chuck Schumer voted for and Joe Biden signed so they can get the debt limit through.
GLENN: Hmm. Unbelievable.
Well, Thomas, thank you for all the fight that you guys are doing.
And I know that I hear from you guys. Personally, I hear from you, late at night.
What the hell am I still doing here.
You know, it's is not making a difference. You are making a difference.
And at least somebody is -- is standing up to all of this.
Can I ask you: Do you have an opinion on the Supreme Court taking the Donald Trump case? Or not the Donald Trump case, but the -- the -- what's-his-face -- you know, the -- the prosecutor.
MASSIE: I've been so busy with the FISA thing. I haven't paid attention to that.
I saw Joe Biden stroll through here, by the way, showing up to testify.
GLENN: Imagine the gall of that.
MASSIE: It's insane.
GLENN: Insane. Insane.
MASSIE: He's just flouting it in our faces.
GLENN: I know. And you guys can't really do anything, you can?
You can hold him in contempt of Congress, but that doesn't mean anything because the Justice Department is rogue.
MASSIE: That's correct. You referred to the DOJ. They're not going to do anything. It's the president's son.
GLENN: It's obscene. Thank you so much, Thomas. I appreciate it. All right. You bet. Buh-bye.