David Barton & Throckmorton disagree. Each interpret history differently. Which one helped, in essence, ban a book & seems OK with that? 

I’m not sure I understand why some of the religious right has a problem with this book.
Can someone explain? ,

This case comes down to one nutshell event: Those on the left and the right seek to make history fit their examples of ideology and ‘corrective views of historic interpretation.”

The ideologes have for so long written history and events, from all sides, to encompass their own events and views as to try and shape it to ‘their way it must have happened’ instead of
‘this is the truth of what happened, here are the original documents to prove it.”

When people have a view of history that has become tradition, it tends to be accepted to the people as ‘the way it happened,” and most refuse to accept it could be a larger portion of a grander story.

One historic example comes from Russia, where to impress the czar of the day, Iurii Krizhanich wrote the book “Politika.” It was written roughly in the 1660s for the czar, to show the czar the world history as “it should be seen by the Russians.’

Basically Krizhanich wanted a job with the czars government; so this book was written to be the first recorded, to my knowledge, case of political brown nosing, as it goes “all russian stuff is good, rest is bad” mentality. This is the same ideological rewriting and reshaping of views of history as is happening here today.

I would recommend reading this book, and the english translation of it called “Russian Statecraft: The Politika of Iurie Krizhanich” by Letiche and Dmytryshyn. It can be found on Amazon at a fair price.

And if anyone wishes to know, Krizhanich so impressed the czar with his efforts he was given a position of eternal exile to Siberia.

I may be able to; being a preacher gives me some inside perspective, in that many of the seminary schools have, over many generations, become bound to a degree by tradition of “these are how it happened,” and seldom are teaching their students to go and examine it for themselves.

This is one reason I got into near constant battles with some of my teachers; not due to them teaching falsely, just of them not covering the entire story, which was often a part of a wonderful whole.

In example, much of the various faiths and denominations that aided the drive to bring the revolution to happening were only briefly touched upon; and finally to find out more as I tried to dig the information up (this was in pre-internet days in a town with only a small library, but plenty of old bookstores and centuries old churches) I managed to find pastors who had done the research already and learn more of the story from all of them.

It was not a deliberate coverup on the teachers part, they felt there were more important things to cover in their lessons.

Tradition can be a great asset, as it shows where we came from, and how we got to be what and whom we are; but to neglect encouraging the people to study it for themselves, to go and seek and learn the depths of the story as they wish, is a part we of the churches have, for the most part, failed.

I hope that this provides some answers.

Thomas Nelson is also a major Bible Publisher which includes the New King James Version. After listening to Glenn and David you have wonder about the credibility of the publisher.

But why wouldn’t the Christian right want people to know that historical documents show that Jefferson was a Christian and believed in Jesus Christ as his saviour? I can understand why the left wouldn’t accept this but not the right????

Barton is a hack.
glenn loves him because glenn and bought and paid for support and twisted “historical” views.
Enough said.

Folks, strtlk is a hatemonger as is evident in all of his spam that he post on this site. He’s a typical liberal hatemonger.

Save America, Vote conservative. there’s still time. It’s alright to vote against Obama and the people who carry his water like strtlk.

Each interpret history differently. Which one helped, in essence, ban a book & seems OK with that? http://Millionaire4Project.blogspot.com

Hmmmmmm….

Thomas – Nelson is not a fly-by-night operation. Why would they pull a top selling book if they didn’t have serious issues with it. What’s their motive?  I noticed that all of the other books by Barton were published by Wall Builders Press, Barton’s own organization. Something’s not right here.

Could “Jerferson Lies” be the first book that got any serious scrutiny and came up short? The “evidence” Barton and Glenn talked about would not stand up in court. You can’t positively say what was on a person’s mind based on circumstantial evidence. Barton makes  assumptions that border on misrepresentation. When he says that Jefferson signed most of his documents with the phrase “In the Year of our Lord Christ” he is misleading people into believing that Jefferson wrote those words himself at the end of the document. When he says Jefferson sent missionaries he is misleading people as well. Hiring a priest to work for a tribe that is already converted to Catholicism is not the same as sending missionaries to people who have not heard the Gospel. Barton is playing semantic games and misleading people into believing one thing when the documents say something else. Sad.

I am disappointed with Barton. Again you have to ask why would Thomas Nelson pull a top selling book if they didn’t have serious issues with it?

Sometimes facts threaten peoples’ beliefs rather than strengthen them when their minds and hearts have turned to stone. David is a scholar in every possible meaning of the word.         

I have seen this happen before. I grew up in Bible Churches. I watched one Sunday as “Deacon’s” of the little church we were attending came to my father after a Sunday service and asked that he not come back. After all, he couldn’t be a Christian as he claimed, because he was a Geologist. I believe it broke his heart. It didn’t change his mind or kill his Faith. My father was a Christian and a geologist. He never saw a contradiction. Imagine that… He just had the unmitigated gall to see and comprehend that God gave us a detailed record of his creation of Heaven and Earth.     

Saved by grace and not works. He taught Geology (not Creationism) to thousands of students in public Texas colleges and universities over 30 years. He always told the students in the first lecture of the semester that he had never found a contradiction between Geology, Science and the Bible. You see he was a Geology graduate of Wheaton College. He walked the same campus, had some of the same professors as Billy Graham had. My Dad was a student there and graduated from Wheaton I believe 2 years after Billy Graham. He was a strong Believer. He was the same kind of life student that David Barton is. Always learning and always teaching what he learned.

GO David GO!!!! David’s work will stand the test of time. I wish everyone was as careful and as detail oriented as David. May God continue to bless David’s work.

 Maybe they are just embarrassed they didn’t really investigate the facts first hand. They have been preaching and teaching second hand “facts”. They might lose credibility. Maybe they just should work a little harder to verify what David has uncovered.  

strtlk lives in his mothers basement..he needs odumo to save him

Did you watch the show?  Your questions are answered, I believe, in the show.

Thomas said I am amazed that any one can profit $4686 in a few weeks on the network. have you look this (Click on menu Home)

like….@don2500:disqus ,
goo.gl/MKro7

Watching the show, I think Barton gave pretty good reasons. But I’m a Glen fan and I do have to keep my own biases in check. It would have been good to see Thockmorton (or other “good men” on the other side) on the same show (respectfully) debating the issues. But I know that’s not usually Glen’s format. At the very least, Glen should interview one of the “good men” on the the other side of the issue. Truth is more likely to be revealed if you hear both sides.

 Yes. I watched the show. Some segments I watched several times. Did you read my entire post and confirm what I said was in the video? 

Barton draws conclusions that just aren’t there. If you look at his other books, all of them were published by….David Barton. This is apparently the firs book published by a mainstream publishing house. Unless Glenn is willing to invite the other scholars on and have them go head to head with Barton, it’s not going to resolve anything. If this book ever gets published it will have to fix the 23 error that have been pointed out or no one will touch it.

 Krizhanich was exiled to Siberia in 1661, and did not begin working on Politika until around 1663-1664.  The reasons for his exile have been debated, but had nothing to do with a book that wasn’t even written yet.   By the way, Krizhanich was freed from exile in 1676.

There is a difference between believing in the Messiah and what Church leaders and seminaries promote. The difference is in the purpose of salvation. There is quite a difference between God’s design and the Church “product”. For that reason, stand in your own faith and not under the auspices of the Council of Nicaea.

Nick, I don’t know how many of Barton’s books you’ve read but the man footnotes and uses more original sources than any other author I’ve read.  28,000 words of resources and original material left out by Thomas Nelson, then they say it lacks in substance – THEY TOOK A LOT OF SUBSTANCE OUT THEMSELVES. Seriously, his writing is supported more than my history books in school. In fact, I’ve learned in the past 10 years that I was taught wrong on a lot of history, particularly regarding our Founders.  You are right that there is something wrong here….but it lies within the agenda or failure of those attacking Barton here……not Barton.  Oh and by the way, I have the book….it’s more like reading what Jefferson has to say than it is what David Barton has to say – - and that’s a lot more than I can say about most such authors…

 This is unintelligible.

While Thomas Nelson may have been reputable up until now, they have shown they are a different company with their newest translation, The Voice.  Google it. 

 Thomas Nelson has also published, The Voice, a controversial Bible interpretation.  You ask why Thomas Nelson had issues with Barton’s book.  I ask you, would you have issues with The Voice?  I no longer respect Thomas Nelson; therefore, their opinion of any book is meaningless to me.

 ”Thomas – Nelson is not a fly-by-night operation. Why would they pull a
top selling book if they didn’t have serious issues with it.”

These guys publish the heretical version of the Bible called ‘The Voice’ !!!  If they are so concerned with accuracy and reliable information being dispensed, why is it they didn’t have “serious issues” with it ??!!!

Hmmmmmmmm…..

Thanks for that information, in the edtion of the book I have it stated that he was exiled in part for writing the book. I’ll have to check more into it and see what other researchers have found since it was published.

As being someone who has found the life of Thomas Jefferson so interesting, I am amazed at what has come out. I am thankful for the research done by David Barton. There was a time when I would have been shocked at the conspiracy of some who will discredit the work of a Christian. Unfortunately, I am not shocked any more. It all boils down to good vs. evil in this world and in today’s time, the evil is masked as good. Be very careful people. This video is lengthy but very well worth watching. Thank you, Glenn Beck, for getting the real truth out to America!!!

As being someone who has found the life of Thomas Jefferson so interesting, I am amazed at what has come out. I am thankful for the research done by David Barton. There was a time when I would have been shocked at the conspiracy of some w…ho will discredit the work of a Christian. Unfortunately, I am not shocked any more. It all boils down to good vs. evil in this world and in today’s time, the evil is masked as good. Be very careful people. This video is lengthy but very well worth watching. Thank you, Glenn Beck, for getting the real truth out to America!!!

 Just found an interesting tidbit.  Last year, Thomas Nelson was purchased by HarperCollins, a secular publishing agency.  Though they may be categorized a “Christian” company, they are now controlled by secular media.

strtlk is a hack. Obama loves him because he doesn’t think and is great at regurgitating the twisted and easily disproven party line. Strtlk is bought and paid for with food stamps and welfare, necessitating his continued support of  odumbest, even in the face of reality. Not to mention his required need of odumbest’s sodomite support.

Some day he will leave mamma’s basement and emerge into the sunlight of reality. Then he MAY become a sensible champion of the right . . .

 They are no longer credible.  They are owned by HarperCollins, a secular publisher.  Secularists do not want the truth about religious founding fathers known.

You are wrong. Circumstantial evidence “stands up in court” everyday. Barton simply used an enormous amount of such evidence to postulate his own inferences of what Jefferson may have been thinking. That is absolutely no different than any other Jefferson “scholar.” From my perspective, the amount of circumstantial evidence referenced by Barton is indeed more extensive and reliable than other alleged scholars. Thankfully, God gave us all a mind to consider the information and arrive at our own conclusions as to what it means.

As to why would they pull the book? That is easy pressure from a larger money making account most likely one of it’s bible accounts said pull the book or we walk down the road and take a list of friends. If you think politics is a game played only in Washington D.C. you need to wake up. It is played in ever business, church, where ever you get 10 people or more in a room. 2800 words that were footnotes and quotes from Jefferson himself. I wrote a book once it was crappy and saw the back table of some small bookstores and didn’t get 1/10 of that sort of edit and I had no clue as to what I was doing. This guy is a published author he knows what he is doing that is an astronomical edit.  

My problem is the lingering question, “WHY?”  After the success of so many denominations at Indivisible, Under God, which had a profound effect on me–a Catholic–I am upset that over interpretive differences that sound now like jealousy and a regression into book burning, I am afraid we are going to lose the ground we have gained, and that sounds like the Progressive role to me–and in my own parish, I am asking my pastor to take a stand on abortion and at least once a year give a sermon about the 4000 babies we kill each year–and one sermon should be a refresher course of what we as Catholics believe and our responsibility to vote.  You cannot be Christian on Sunday and forget it Monday through Saturday,.  The sermons will not be given because we as a Church are fighting the social justice issues in individual parishes.

Who made Barton one of the nation’s most respected people? Glenn Beck?

If the truth is the guide then why should Beck say the Barton is being smeared at the very beginning of the show?

He says the publisher should be ashamed before he even makes his case. He says he won’t buy a book from them and essentially encourages his viewers to do the same.

Could it be the publisher rather than bowing to pressure, acknowledged they made a mistake in publishing a wretchedly bad book and pulled it to save their reputation? Certainly Beck could have invited a representative on his program to make his case. 

“Let the facts and the chips fall were they may”

Beck exposed his bias at the beginning 

Barton couldn’t back up his claim about the security bond except to say he heard it from students.

Beck has no more credibility than David Barton

He has a hard time being civil doesn’t he?

People hate truth no matter which side your on the truth is the only thing we should be searching for no matter where it leads.

Civility is not his forte’. Threats, lies and vulgarity are his Liberal Progressive mantra. Sadly, there are many like him in our Government under Obama.

There’s still time to save the United States from people like strtlk. We all know what needs to be done.

Thanks for your reply. : )

It’s spam

 Why haven’t there been a long list of conservative, Christian, historians coming out to defend Barton on his stuff? That’s another thing that bothers me.

Where are all the “scholars” he’s talking about? Maybe I missed them, but maybe Glenn or somebody could produce a list of these “scholars” to back him up.

 That doesn’t wash. Glenn is published by Threshold Editions which is owned by Simon & Schuster. They’re not exactly a conservative Christian organization. Your logic would lead me to stop buying Glenn’s book since they are “controlled” by a progressive organization. It’s all about the bottom line.

And in the case of Thomas Nelson they still have a reputation to maintain in the Christian community. Thomas Neslon published the enormously successful and intensely Christian book “Bonhoeffer: Pastor, Martyr, Prophet, Spy” which won the Christian Book Award.

don2500, God bless your father and you for blessing us with his story.  Please continue to share it with others.  Such are the men of Christian conviction America so desperately needs right now.

 ”And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus,
by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will
be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerve in the
brain of Jupiter. But may we hope that the dawn of reason and
freedom of thought in these United States will do away with this
artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine
doctrines of this most venerated reformer of human errors.”

-Thomas Jefferson, Letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823

  “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus,
by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will
be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerve in the
brain of Jupiter. But may we hope that the dawn of reason and
freedom of thought in these United States will do away with this
artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine
doctrines of this most venerated reformer of human errors.”

-Thomas Jefferson, Letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823

  “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus,
by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will
be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerve in the
brain of Jupiter. But may we hope that the dawn of reason and
freedom of thought in these United States will do away with this
artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine
doctrines of this most venerated reformer of human errors.”

-Thomas Jefferson, Letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823

  “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus,
by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will
be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerve in the
brain of Jupiter. But may we hope that the dawn of reason and
freedom of thought in these United States will do away with this
artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine
doctrines of this most venerated reformer of human errors.”

-Thomas Jefferson, Letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823

Wow, I comment on Barton’s lies and your debate tactic is to try and attack me personally.
Then you mock people who are poverty stricken and may need food stamps to help feed their children.
Then, true to form, you make sodomy jokes.
Finally, President Obama was elected to his position through a national election. He knew he would open himself up to personal and crazy attacks, but he chose to serve his country.
Has glenn beck ever served the public?

You deserve what you get strtlk. You constantly personally attack others here on a regular spamming basis.

Obama is about to be fired through a National election and Liberals like you who are in government will be sent packing.

Many people have never served in Government and yes Glenn Beck serves the public every day. You can’t stand that, can you. that’s why you spam his site twice a day.

Save America, Vote Conservative.

I know the pain of Churches not being Fellowship communities but some other “business”.  But i can in no way stand on my own after what i read in the Bible about the Community of Faith, which we are to live in.

happy, strtlk gets what he deserves.  He attacks people here all the time.  He’s a Media Matters hack.

strtlk is also a Phony Soldier (sailor), he claimed to have served but it was proven that it was all a bunch of lies.  He was caught in his lies by many of us who know him and his past ID of MtClayboy.

You’re right on.

Just went over to Amazon.com and bought the book!  Thank you, Glenn, for giving Mr. Barton an opportunity to be heard on this controversy.  I was shocked when you showed the pages of edits by the publisher!  How, then, does Thomas Nelson have the nerve to pull the book when they know their edits were a major contributor to the criticisms?  Unbelievable.  I am a big fan of Mr. Barton’s books and wouldn’t miss an opportunity to support him, especially now.

I waited to long to buy the book, I fist saw Barton book at books a million and said oh I will get it later, well on my way home from watching 2016 I said I better get it now with all the contraversy over it, they pulled it from the shelves. I was able to get a copy on line. Good luck David, hope my buying the book helps.

Forget the ‘collector’s edition’.  I’ll wait, Glenn, until Mercury publishes the less abridged version.  David, thanks for the scholarship.

The left, the wicked, the evil…THEY CAN’T HANDLE THE TRUTH…They are afraid of the TRUTH..they even LIE to themselves…So I wouldn’t worry one bit about… THEM………………WHO EVER THEY ARE

Those are not the real believers that hate and smear brothers telling the truth…Jesus said you will know the wolfs…in sheeps clothing…by their fruits you will know them…their fruits means…WHAT THEY SAY AND WHAT THEY DO…So just keep going forward David remember Joseph and what happened to him…You will get promoted by the Lord…

Why has Jay W. Richards not had a public interview to back his storyabout David. David can and will verify his research.
contact jay at info@discovery.org
206-292-0401 ext160

I think you meant to write ’4000 babies each day’ not ‘year’

Wow, Glenn!  when we say; peeling the onion skin, this is what they mean. Digging for the truth. I don’t care about the (former publisher) I want to see the new David Barton book with all the information included. By a publisher with the truth in mind. I’m writing from Michelle Bachmann country in Mn. It’s an uphill battle, even in my own family, from my father to my son.. you are to THEM  the rodeo clown, or ideologically worse, with all that crazy talk!  I’m going to show this David Barton series to them and find out if they can see through their bias. 

David Barton was my inspiration to get into learning about some of the Framers.  I heard him speak on a radio program back in 2000.  Through a Denver station.  I later ordered some cassette tapes.  Remember those??   That led to my digging into men such as Jefferson, Morris and Jay.  

I’m betting I’m one of a very small number who have actually read the letters between Jefferson and the Danbury Baptist Committee.  If one does, you’ll learn the very thing the Danbury Baptists feared most has come to pass beginning with abolishing prayer in schools.  That was the beginning of twisting the Constitution and other words by its writers to mean what was not intended.

So, I thank David Barton and I thank God for a man like him who continues to teach and help others learn.  By the way, I was on probation for theft through a computer at the time and had to use a computer for both the card catalog and to pull up cases Barton had referenced.  I had to answer to a judge for the violation who later threw it out.  I’d do it all over again because of what I learned.

Thank you for the correction–four thousand a year in comparison to the reality of each day in America would almost be a miracle.

I just watched the whole interview. I have listened to David over the years, and I find him to be first a man of commitment to God as well as to the facts on the ground. Let us stay focused on the bigger issues of honoring God as God and restoring America, and let us not be reduced to partisan squabbling. David and Glenn set a good example of this in the good-hearted way they just set the facts straight while not demeaning others who disagree. It’s good to set the facts straight, and they have done that. Now let’s also keep our sights on staying Under God Indivisible in honoring God and restoring our country. Vote principles!

O.K. This might sound like a wacko conspiracy theory, but I heard something interesting last week when this story first came out. I am repeating from memory as I have deleted the original material. The comments that I read originated from a post on the Gospel Coalition. A commentator mentioned that NPR had done a program on Barton and the Jefferson Lies issue and NPR linked him (Barton) to Marco Rubio. (note this was a day or two before the announcement of the VP pick.) I was at an MSN news page later that night and an article quoted a far left wing organization spokesperson (can’t remember the name) saying something to the effect that all the politicians and pundits that supported Barton should be called out and exposed, implying that anyone who supported Barton was an idiot. I wonder if the plan was to have something to attack Rubio with if he was named the VP? I know it’s a bit far-fetched, but I wouldn’t put anything past the Obama people. Although maybe NOT so far-fetched as another commentator (James2826) made mention of several Republicans associated with Barton and how (apparently) that makes them idiots..I also  read that The People For The American Way had a big part in these attacks on Barton. They are an extremist left-wing SUPER anti-Christian organization that has been around for a long time. I remember my mother warning me about them back in the 80′s. They have one agenda and that is to silence all Christians.

Let’s assume for a moment that Barton’s critics are correct, and that his book is a total shipment of organic fertilizer.
I say, so what?  Have you checked the non-fiction shelves lately.  Space aliens built the pyramids, Apparently John F. Kennedy was assassinated by a made communist, industrialist, homosexual who was upset about his policy in Southeast Asia and was under contract to the CIA.
Hitler is now 109 and pastoring a Lutheran Church in Buenos Aires—and on, and on, and on.

So, Nelson should publish the book, call it fiction if it makes them feel better.  Let peers review it and disagree, as they always have over every word published by and about Jefferson.  But don’t ban the book!

That having been said, I would like one answer from David Barton.  How as an academic historian, could you allow a book to be published under your name, that had nearly 1/3 of it’s content, including a boatload of footnotes, expunged from it’s pages?   You should have more than smelled a rat at that point, and withdrawn the book from publication.  The fact that you didn’t do that is very troubling to me. 

It is better to be sued for breach of contract, than to allow your integrity to be questioned, and your best defense erased.  The progressives are certainly out to get you, so you can not make it easy for them.

Nick – you have cut and pasted two separated passages from Jefferson’s letter to give the illusion they were spoken as a single line of reasoning.  Jefferson was debating and condemning the Calvin philosophy and the 1st part of you quote is actually from Calvin. . .not Jefferson.  He was commenting to it.  With all due respect, you have committed the same fraudulent act of “misinformation” that you have accused David Barton of.  The understand the TRUE context of Jefferson thoughts on God and Jesus in this discussion, the entire letter can be found here:   

http://www.beliefnet.com/resourcelib/docs/53/Letter_from_Thomas_Jefferson_to_John_Adams_1.html

Y’all should read some of the things being said about David Barton on the Stone-Campbell Google Group – one guy is actually saying that Barton “rates very high on the fruitcake index.” That same guy claims to be a “Democrat Campbellite.” Go figure!  The Stone-Campbell group are various members of the Church of Christ, who actually teach that *they* are the only “true Christians.” I know this for a fact, because I grew up in that church. To this day, I am glad I got out of there.

https://groups.google.com/a/acu.edu/forum/?fromgroups#!topic/stone-campbell/FVU9JgM7aGc%5B1-25%5D

Are you sure?

If you are interested in the truth you might want to look at “Getting Jefferson Right” as I have done. Jefferson was not a closet Christian. He tolerated Christianity the way he tolerated the Hindus and Muslims. When he decided to run for President he began attending church because people in 1800 were accusing him of being an atheist. Yes. Even his contemporaries knew he wasn’t a Christian.

We do our cause great harm in playing the same game with history that the Left does. I am deeply disappointed in David  Barton. I am disappointed with Glenn for trying to redefine Christianity to prop up Barton.

Do you recognize this name: Jay W. Richards, Ph.D. Senior Fellow, Discovery Institute. He is the coauthor of “Indivisible: Restoring Faith, Family, and Freedom Before It’s Too Late” He is a collegue and close friend of Pastor James Robeson. Both have been on Glenn’s show. Richards is the one who began to question Barton in the first place and asked other scholars to look at Barton’s work as well.

If Barton is correct, then where are all the “scholars” supporting him and his conclusions? Where?

A famous man once said: “The Truth Has No Agenda”

Nick, you
seem to be a fascist because you imply that all books should be “certified” by
a government court before publishing, so as to make sure the people get the “truth.”
I suppose you keep a roll of paper with the 1st amendment imprinted
on it in your bathroom.

tinyurl.com/cyk9xz2

Sure

This is the one thing that destroys Beck credibility.  Glenn this guy is a pseudo historian.  The reason that the left and right criticize him is because he is full of it.  I’ve worked in academia all my life at many institutions and if there is a liberal bias, I haven’t seen it.  I’ve seen, worked and met professor who are on all sides of the political spectrum.  From hippy liberals to rush limbaugh fans.  They all say the same thing, this guy is a phony.

Seriously if 99% of the academics say he is full of it, you might want to listen…

Cool, now we can get rid of the myths of the Bible and that
fellow Socrates since neither will stand up in a court of law.

Regarding “Getting Jefferson Right”

I have been a fan of David Barton for many years. But now I can’t help but feeling betrayed. I have watched Barton on TV and been impressed by his performance. But like watching a great magician perform his tricks dazzles you, you are even more astounded when someone comes along and reveals just how those tricks are actual done. Barton has misrepresented the facts through omission, half-truths and out and out falsehood. The smoking gun? There is a whole armory of smoking guns in this book, but here is one of the most convincing. It is also illustrative of how Barton leaves out important details to perform his historical slight of hand. Barton points to the inclusion of Matthew 12:10-12 as proof that Jefferson intended to include a reference to miracles. If you look at the actual text of the Jefferson’s 1820 Bible he includes Matthew 12:10-12 AND vs. 14 and 15. Note that Jefferson cuts out vs. 13 which is the verse describing the actual miracle “Then saith he to the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it forth; and it was restored whole, like as the other.” Barton conveniently omits the fact that Jefferson surgically removed the miracle verse from the passage.

This book is full of such examples of cherry picked quotes and misleading interpretations. I think the book exposes Barton as a charlatan who has made a cottage industry out of trying to “Christianize” the founding fathers. It is clear that Jefferson was a Deist who believed in an afterlife and judgement. It is also clear he was not a devout Christian. Personally, I will lose no sleep over these simple facts. Jefferson was a great man and like all men had many flaws. The Bible is filled with many great men and woman who God used in spite of their flaws. I became a Christian because I objectively looked at the evidence for Christ. Christianity doesn’t need fakers and con artists to prop up our faith with this kind of revisionist history.

Fear is the motivation here.    Look at the history books that need editing, corrected;  people found guilty of making up stuff and stating as facts.   Yes, there s cause for fear.   The champions of the so-called leaders for the people, are flawed like the rest of us.

99.9% of the so called academics Are full of it and I not  talking about knowledge.

I have known about David Barton since 1978 when he was introduced in our church to speak about schools, Founding Fathers, and The Constitution.  He is a great scholar.  He knows as much or more about our history, Founding Fathers, and how our country was founded than any other professor in history. I have seen some of his collection of books and I can’t believe with his extensive knowledge that these attacks are coming from the right!  All they have to do is research and know that if David wrote it, he has documentation. Praying for you, and your family.

Not a single one of you will even consider being objective about this fraud?  Even religious historians have questioned the honesty of the book.  
http://www.worldmag.com/articles/19837

Quit with the conspiracy nonsense, no one is ‘afraid’ of facts and the truth. 

The Left has no morals, no truth, and no shame.

Davd Barton is a great Christian man an I will not be buy in anything with Thomas Nelson Publishers from this day on. I will also contact them and encourage all to stand up to this evil,that threatens this good man.

Nick, you’re making the same mistake as the scholars refuting Barton.  You’re quoting from a book that took quotes from Jefferson and arranged them as they wanted them to look.  Go back to the original letters that Jefferson wrote.  He never said what you just quoted, at least not in the single context that you just gave it.  That’s the whole point that Barton is trying to make.  Most scholars go back to a single scholar from the 60s who studied Jefferson but they never go back to the original works of Jefferson.

I still feel deeply betrayed by David Barton. I’m sill waiting for the list of conservative “scholars” who back Baton’s interpretation of the facts. Apparently all conservatives scholars are in on the Left-wing conspiracy against David Barton. 

Glenn has let his feelings trump the truth in this situation.

GBTV: “The truth has no agenda except when our close friends are involved.”

thank you, glen for your interview with david barton.  it was so informative and revealed the man you described david to be.  thank you for your boldness and courage…both of you!  it is such a shame when there is so much evil going on in this country, we Christians can’t seem to work together and get along…

Funny…David completely ignored me when I called Wallbuilders asking why he compared the Barbary Corsairs to “modern-day Muslim extremists.”  Was told someone would get back to me, gave my email address and phone number, and NO ONE contacted me for OVER A YEAR.  Finally asked the same question on his Facebook page and was COMPLETELY IGNORED while people who posts praises of Barton and requests for appearances by him were answered immediately.  I’ve never been so disrespected by people as I have been by Barton fans, and his own “Wallbuilders” society.  Glenn, I don’t know who these “many many people” you’ve seen David talk to are, but I’m fairly certain they weren’t people who disagreed with him!

 ”Academia” is a cloistered bubble of self-proclaimed, self-congratulatory myopia.  If 99% of them couldn’t re-route the electrical connections in my house, I could claim that you shouldn’t listen to THEM.

I’ll consider everything I can read and hear before coming to my OWN conclusion.

“Academia” be damned.

So I suppose the
Smithsonian’s display of the actual book as a “fake” fabricated the
“liberal extremists”?  I’m sorry, but basing an assumption that Jefferson did include miracles in
one of his editions of his “Jefferson Bible” (even though David himself
isn’t sharing any actual images of such miracles existing in a
“Jefferson Bible) on the passages that were REMOVED from an English 1804
Bible is absolutely NOT a sound reasoning to
base an assumption on. Oh, and the
Bibles were printed on BOTH sides of a page. So if Jefferson cut
something out from the front of a page, he automatically rendered the
reverse section of that same page unusable, even if he wanted to include
something from that same area of the reverse side of the page. Because
of that, Jefferson actually needed 2 of each Bible so that when he cut a
passage out from the front of a page, he would still have access to
uncut verses on the reverse of that same page. I suppose Barton knows
which Bibles were used for cuttings from either the front or back of the
same page too, right? The only proof of what Jefferson intended to
include in “the Jefferson Bible” is to look at what was actually
included in the book itself; anything beyond that is unfounded
speculation, pure and simple.

tinyurl.com/cyk9xz2

Can we get the transcript from this exchange.  Some people are video-challenged who can’t bother to relate but will hold to their judgement.

Thanks for the good moral fight. Keep it up.