Was a college student suspended for refusing to stomp on Jesus?

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Last week, TheBlaze reported the story of a Florida Atlantic University (FAU) junior, Ryan Rotela, who issued a complaint about a professor, Dr. Deandre Poole, who had forced students to write “Jesus” on a piece of paper, drop the paper on the floor, and stomp on it. Rotela refused to participate in the act and went on to voice a complaint about the exercise with Poole’s supervisor. The student was then suspended from the intercultural communications class.

TheBlaze went on to report that Fox News’ Todd Starnes added additional context to the story explaining that Rotela was initially accused of violating the student code of conduct after the official complaint was made.

The University reportedly told the Florida CBS affiliate WPEC-TV:

“Faculty and students at academic institutions pursue knowledge and engage in open discourse. While at times the topics discussed may be sensitive, a university environment is a venue for such dialogue and debate.”

Well it didn’t take long for this story to gain national attention and with that attention came a formal apology from FAU and an expunging of Rotela’s record. “One for the good guys,” Glenn said on radio this morning. “Florida Atlantic University has now issued a formal apology to a student that was facing academic charges that he complained about a professor who ordered the class to write the name ‘Jesus’ on pieces of paper and then stomp on the paper.”

Rotela, who was removed from class, ordered not to contact fellow students, and faced possible suspension or expulsion pending a student hearing, has now received an apology from the FAU Dean of Students Cory King and will be able to return to another section of the course not taught by Poole. Additionally, Rotela’s attorney stated that “there will be no punishment” and the school is “wiping the record clean” for Rotela.

While justice has certainly prevailed for Rotela, it is unclear what repercussions, if any, the professor will face. “What happens to the professor,” Glenn asked. “Does the professor just go on? You can say just make pieces of paper?”

According to the lesson plan, the objective of the assignment was to: Have students write the name Jesus in letters on a big piece of paper. Ask the students to stand up and put the paper on the floor in front of them with the name facing up. Ask the students to think about it for a moment; after a brief period of silence, instruct them to step on the paper. Most will hesitate. Ask why they can’t step on the paper. Discuss the importance of symbols in culture.

“That is not a symbol. [Jesus] is not a symbol,” Glenn said. “[Dean] King says it was ‘obvious the lesson caused hurt and pain within the community and within the university’s population. As a result, we feel it necessary to no longer offer this assignment or activity.’”

“Ya think,” Glenn asked.

In response to the overwhelming public support Rotela received, his attorney said, “When we stand together, we win.”

If you consider the outcry that would have surrounded this story if students were asked to stomp on, say, a piece of paper that said ‘Mohammed’, the apology issued to Rotela seems like a non-apology apology.

“Well, we better stand pretty darn soon,” Glenn concluded.

  • landofaahs

    Frankly, when people disrespect Christ, I understand that he suffered that while on this earth and he will come again to repay.  Christ offers forgiveness even to the mockers of him, but at the point of death and at the end times, their fate is sealed.  Our God, the Trinity, is big enough to take out his own vengeance.  It is why we are to pray for them.  Father forgive them for they know not what they do.

  • http://www.artinphoenix.com/gallery/grimm snowleopard (cat folk gallery)

    The student stood up for his beliefs and has been vindicated in the end; God is not to be mocked and He protects His people. 

    May the professor come to understand the truth and the light of God as presented in the life of Christ and the Bible. There is time for repentance and forgiveness if one is sincere and desires to change until the end of their lives or the last day when judgement closes; so many truth and light and the life from above come to replace their desire for darkness, error and lies.

  • http://youtu.be/0iRCvDwF26Q Sam Fisher

    What I would have done is that take the paper off the floor get a new sheet of paper write Dr. Poole name on it and stomp on that. Then I would say to him “what do you think you are better than God?” I know I would be kicked out and it is not Christian but boy it would feel so good.

  • http://youtu.be/0iRCvDwF26Q Sam Fisher

    John 15: 18-26 and 16:1-4. If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. If you belong to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you. Remember the words spoke to you: no servant is greater than his master. If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also. They will treat you this way because of my name, for they do not know the One who sent me. If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not be guilty of sin. Now, however, they have no excuse for their sin. He who hates me hates the father as well. If I had not done among them what no one else did, they would not be guilty of sin. But now they have seen these miracles, and yet they have hated both me and my father. But this is to fulfill what is written in their law: they hated me without reason.
    When the Counselor comes, whom I will send to you from the father, the spirit of truth who goes out from the father, he will testify about me. And you also must testify, for you have been with me from the beginning.
    All this I have told you so that you will not go astray. They will put you out of the synagogue; in fact, a time is coming when anyone who kills you will think he is offering a service to God. They will do such things because they have not known the father or me. I have told you this, so that when the time comes you will remember that I warned you. I did not tell you this at first because I was with you

  • Anonymous

    “This exercise is a bit sensitive, but really drives home the point that
    even though symbols are arbitrary, they take on very strong and
    emotional meanings,” the exercise states. Of the stomping, it said,
    “most will hesitate. Ask why they can’t step on the paper. Discuss the
    importance of symbols in culture.”

    Interesting lesson and exercise to make a point about strength of symbols, probably should have used something other than jesus that most students might hesistate to stomp on, santa, or something else along those lines that would still cause most to hesitate.
    clearly the professor didn’t handle it well if a student ended up suspended, assuming complain is the only thing he did. 
    and christians really should wear it as a badge of honor that they can be made fun of without responding violently.

  • Anonymous

    It’s a pity no one had a copy of the Koran. Let them put it on the ground by the Jesus picture and tell the prof if he stomped on the Koran, on video that would be posted, they would stomp on Jesus. Anyone actually think the prof would do it?

  • Anonymous

     probably not since the point of the assignment wasn’t to actually make them stomp on jesus, but to use their reactions to the hesitation to stomp on the word to then discuss the meaning symbols in society.
    and the point of picking to have them write jesus is it is a symbol that would have meaning to them and would create hesitation, whereas unless you’re teaching a room full of muslims stomping on the qur’an wouldn’t have the same lesson…not to mention the qur’an would be more of an equivalent to having them stomp on the bible, which would then get away from the lesson b/c now you’re dealing with holy scriptures and not symbols.

  • Anonymous

    It was subsequently reported that FAU filed charges against the student:  http://news.yahoo.com/student-now-suspended-complaining-jesus-stomping-assignment-223212111.html

  • Anonymous

    This is a very significant event. It is just one more effort by “progressive” liberal educators to desensitize youth and re-educate them to their way of thinking. The student’s refusal obviously caused an “undermining” of this pompous “professor”. Anyone who thinks conservative young people don’t have it rough in college, especially from the educators, doesn’t understand how pervasive the progressive movement is in our culture.
    Here’s a good question – if the exercise had demeaned something Islamic, would we have another Benghazi on our hands? Because we all know an inflammatory film caused that. And a other riots.
    Yet Christians have to deface thier own “symbols” – all in the name of “understanding of other cultures?” Baloney. Hooey. The description of the exercise doesn’t jive with the student’s reaction or the professor’s or the school’s. This student was being coerced to do something against his beliefs. When he stood up for himself, they tried to force him through semi-legal punishment through the college. Shame on the college. Shame on the professor. Shame on liberal hatred being spread in the name of education.

  • greywolfrs

    Maybe the lesson was to get them to understand the meaning of symbols, but using ANY religious symbol is  bad idea. It doesn’t matter whether it was Jesus, Mohammad, Budda or any other religious symbol, they had to know this would create a problem. I believe this story is more about the brain-dead people who make up these so-called “lessons,” never thinking about the shit storm it WILL cause. That is quite a bit more disturbing to me.

  • greywolfrs

    Unfortunately, things like you are talking about are one of the few ways to get these dolts to realize what they are doing.

  • greywolfrs

    I believe that the more disturbing problem here is the dolt that came up with this “lesson,” not realizing the shit storm it would cause. They either didn’t realize it, which makes them a dolt and why would anyone follow a lesson written by them, or they knew and did it anyway, which means they are doing exactly what people think, trying to get rid of religion. (especially Christianity) Either way, who could have thought this was a good idea? Maybe Mayor Doomberg…

  • Anonymous

     SAM FISHER, what do
     you mean “It’s not Christian???” …What!?!?!? not christian to stand up for your Lord?? IT’S YOUR MANLY DUTY AND DEFENCE OF YOUR “CULTURE” which is your  LIFESTYLE!” (and your kids future)   Please don’t call yourself a Christian, if you are going to disgrace Real Christian men & woman who are not disgusting whimps,  that give the enemy the impression – our beautiful Lord Jesus, and his men AND OUR AMERICAN CHRISTIAN CULTURE  is “up for grabs”  – without a fight – Because of the display of “christian disgusting effeminate,” gutless & brainless ‘CHRISTIAN WHIMPS!” – whimps that can be walked over!!! THAT, is the very reason that pigs like this ‘moron’ – wrongly called – professor have the ‘BLASPHEMOUS AUDACITY’  to stomp all over our Cultural basis which is “NATIONAL CONSTITUTIONAL CHRISTIAN CULTURE OF THE USA” .
     

  • greywolfrs

    Hey stupid, he was saying writting the name of the Prof. on a piece of paper and stomping on it would not be very Christian of him and it would not be. Simply refusing to participate would more than enough and quite Christian of him. You obviously have some fucked-up notion of what a real Christian is. 

  • http://youtu.be/0iRCvDwF26Q Sam Fisher

    Not what I am saying I am saying it is unchristian treating this bore like he treated Christ I still would of done so my brother or sister.

  • http://youtu.be/0iRCvDwF26Q Sam Fisher

    Still like you told me you can’t fix stupid. I wonder tho what would have been his reaction?

  • Anonymous

    I think Obama would have been a better choice to stomp on.  They choose such brain dead processes MINUS THE THOUGHT because these elitist  idiots think they have protection under tenner; Teaching or dictating their own agendas because the  leadership at the Universities and Colleges don’t have any guts to stand up to them and fire them.  That’s why they get away with it.    Tenner and the Dept of Ed should be eliminated PERIOD.     A good lesson about our Constitution, the founders and the book of Romans should be presented to them and they should have to write a thesis on the subject.  Unfortunately, I don’t think much would change.  We should learn a lesson from history and the most important one we haven’t learned is of Noah Webster’s teaching.  When it comes time to exercise your right to vote, vote for GOD FEARING MEN.  My only question to that is, how can we, when, we don’t fear God ourselves?  Now, isn’t that the real truth of the matter?  America, we need a serious wake up call and I don’t know what could be much worse than 9/11 other than the end of time.

  • greywolfrs

    Would have been interesting to find out.

  • Anonymous

    That teacher is a complete idiot.  The lesson as written in the manual anticipates that there would be students who would refuse to desecrate the Lord’s name.  The whole point of the lesson was to initiate a discussion as to why that symbol of the Lord was so important to the student.

  • Anonymous

    Part of the offensiveness of the exercise is the notion that all symbols are arbitrary and more or less subjective. Jesus was a real person albeit unique according to His association with God. Mohamed was also a real person although he shares a different relationship to God than Jesus because he is a mere man; although Muslims hold him in the utmost regard. To ask any person to offend his/her own conscience by tempting them to do that which is forbidden by their religion is immoral and inflammatory. Once again this shows the extreme arrogance and elitism of the liberal mindset. 

    .

  • Anonymous

    Semantics which completely misses the point. Very well then, a student should have written Mohammed on a piece of paper and challenged the prof to stomp on it and watch the prof hesitate to do so. Or perhaps they could have written Marx instead since that is a name the prof very likely counts as holy.

  • Anonymous

    Thank you very much.I agree 110%.

  • Anonymous

    Like the way you think!

  • sparducks

     Or have the professor fold bacon slices into the Qur’an then stomp on it while calling Mohammed  a heretic. All the while every student recording the event and sending their recording to Aljezeera. Let’s see if the Professor is brave enough to do that.

  • Anonymous

    Jesus himself isn’t the symbol, the letters that form the name used to represent him are a symbol.
    When you stomp on a sheet of paper that has jesus written on it you’re really just stomping on paper with a few letters on it until you give meaning to the letters or the word/name that is formed.

  • Anonymous

    of course they would, the point was to pick something that the students wouldn’t want to stomp on so they would hesitate. if you picked something with no meaning then the lesson has no point.
    Jesus is just a series of letters written on a sheet of paper, or a name that doesn’t necessarily mean jesus christ, until we give it meaning. which is the purpose of the lesson to demonstrate that things/symbols that may seem arbitrary to us or out of context can and do have real meaning.

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBKwtvnfYZA Marys Image

    You are totally wrong. Bring it, Edward.

  • Anonymous

    Christian means to be a follower of Christ. Christ said that he didn’t come to do away with the law ,but to fullfill it. Christ explained that to Hate your brother is the same has murder and to curse him wasn’t much better because you would be endangering your soul to hell fire. Jesus told us that we should pray for our enemies,we should obey our leaders and pray for them(especially those we disagree with) If someone strikes you on the  one cheek you should turn to them with your other cheek so that they might strike it. When Peter cut off the servant’s ear in the garden when they came to arrest Jesus Jesus rebuked Peter and healed the ear. Jesus reminded him that he could call down an army of angels if he wanted to –to protect him.To be meek doesn’t mean to be weak,but as Christians we are suppose to be different than the world. We are to be a peculiar people, a people that in every way follow Jesus,live our lives for him and obey him. Jesus was Not a whimp neither are Christians that put Him first  above their own personal pride, above their country, above their families and even above their own lives. I have never seen,talked with or been around a true “born again” Christian that was effeminate,gutless,brainless or a whimp. All the Christian men I know are “real” men–they support and care for their family, raise their kids according to the bible, they are leaders at work and at their church, they don’t drink alcohol, gamble, smoke, chase women, use vulgar language or read porn. All own guns,some hunt, fish, love football or sports,many have served in the military or are serving now. They are white collar, blue collar workers ,they are professional men: doctors,lawyers dentist judges ,etc.This country is indeed a Christian Nation and was founded on the bible,but being a Christian means more than being one in name only. Just like sitting in a mechanic shop doesn’t make you a mechanic–sitting in a pew in church doesn’t make you a Christian. There are hundreds of Cafeteria Christians that like to pick and choose what parts of the bible they like or don’t like or choose what parts of the things Jesus said to agree or disagree with. Just because some people call themselves Christians doesn’t make it true. Look at how they live, their speech, how they treat other people, how they treat their wives, kids, fellow employees. etc. then decide if they follow Christ. I don’t believe Mr Fisher meant any disrespect to Christians-he was saying that he would like to beat the daylights out of that professor and that would not be very Christian like. I totally agree with him and agree with you about the professor being an idiot. I would also like to speak to the professor in person. Question Is professor Poole a man or a woman with a name like DEANDRE?  

  • Anonymous

    However you claimed that symbols are arbitrary when in fact they are not. The name Jesus is forever connected to the person Jesus. The letters have intrinsic meaning because of the person attached to them. The meaning is therefore not subjective but objective. You and other liberals who defend this wacko professor fail to acknowledge that the lesson could be taught without the offence by simply stating the objective of the class in hypothetical terms i.e. , “suppose I was to ask you to write the name of a person you revere on a piece of paper and then stomp on it. What would your reaction be and why? What is the connection between the name and the person, why is this so?”
    The real truth is that liberal elitist assholes deliberately pick the name of Jesus to persecute those of a religion they detest because they hate it’s Author.

  • Anonymous

    People.Nothing new here. This has been going on in school class rooms for more than 50 years. Both in college and in the elementary, junior high and high schools. That’s one reason why we have the generations of liberal,progressive, ungodly individuals we have today. Most if not all colleges today are filled with liberal professors. And the ones at the adminstration levels hire more liberals. They promote their agendas on college campuses and brainwash or threaten students into agreeing with them. If you disageee they flunk you , embarass you in the class and try to force you to drop out. Even the kids that disagree are afraid to stand up and speak against the professor— so they comply.
    We are all to blame for this type of propaganda because WE let it happen. As parents who pay taxes to suport the schools or pay to send our kids to college we didn’t voice our opinions or take a personal stand in the education system. We didn’t get personally involve in our kids education. We didn’t speak with the teachers, the principle, the City council or local representative to let them know how we felt. At the college level we assumed that those in charge were doing the right thing or that our kids were receiving an education to be able to get a job,earn a living,make money raise a family,etc. We didn’t question what they were doing. You reap what you sow. If you have young children –get involved. Find out what is being taught, who are the techers, what do they believe. At the college level, look at the books that are being used, talk with the professors, if you can visit the campus and attend a class that your kid is taking–that is questionable. And if you disagree let the chanchellor or the president of the college or university know. You are paying them to provide a service– to educate your kid and in a fashion you agree with.It’s your money. Without your money they don’t have a job.
    More and more colleges and universities are becoming communist,socialist breeding grounds and promoting the homosexual and lesbian life styles. Speak up!

  • Anonymous

    i’m not a liberal and i think the lesson plan was poorly planned but still generally accurate, it just didn’t properly anticipate the reactions people would have to it. ie. see it for the demonstration that it was and not become incredibly offended like a bunch of liberals.
    But the name Jesus itself is arbitrary, the fact that these squiggles on paper equate to the name Jesus is very arbitrary.

  • Anonymous

    i am totally right…

  • The American Patriot

    “Political Correctness is Legalized Hypocrisy!” ~ The American Patriot
     

  • Anonymous

    If you think a name is arbitrary why don’t I call you Bob? Answer; your name isn’t arbitrary your name “is”. It represents a distinctive person who exists in real time and space. If you think language is subjective why don’t you write kjndijvnvkjnkjndfkdk92948u4ujkj  kj nj,mdfnmcmk,’mnk and see if you can communicate. Language is hardly arbitrary nor can it ever be less it cease to be “language”. You may not claim to be a liberal but you have all the earmarks with your constant relativistic rants. 
    I say it is inaccurate and shows the naked non logic of liberal academia. I will agree that the prof wasn’t counting on someone not bowing to his foolish philosophy. 

  • http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBKwtvnfYZA Marys Image

    Edward, you are wrong. Tomorrow or the next day after work, I will present a counter point. It should prove interesting, no?

    See ya-
    Mary

  • Anonymous

    the creation of human language is arbitrary, the fact that english uses this alaphet and sounds and letters etc, is pretty arbitrary.
    The name is arbitrary and we give it meaning.
    Jesus is just letters on paper, or even just ink lines on paper, until the viewer decides to give it meaning.
    Show Jesus to a russian who only speaks russian and only uses the russian alphabet, it has no meaning to him until you tell him that that’s how jesus is written in english, now he gives it meaning. It is no longer arbitrary marks on a sheet of paper, its a symbol. Letters, language are just marks and noises, but we choose to give them meaning.

  • Anonymous

     He is a man. I agree with what you said. Especially about cafeteria Christians who want to pick and choose what they believe. We are different from the world. We have chosen a different path. The student who refused to stomp on the paper, was exercising his right to choose. The professor, by penalizing him, changed the exercise by not allowing him to state his reasons for refusing to stomp. The professor and the school were wrong. We have to stand up for what we believe in or we’re no better than they are.

  • Anonymous

    Before the reflected light of those letters even falls on my eyes, they have  predetermined meanings associated with a given vocalisations. That name is in accordance with a predefined person. There is no need for anyone to ascribe any meaning to a word other than the pre agreed upon definition  of the code. The interpretation of language is not arbitrary even though the symbols may at some time have been. Once the code is agreed upon the interpretation is no longer arbitrary. The fact that diverse cultures use different symbols, phonics and letter sequences in no way undermines the value of this pricipal in communicating objective truth. For this to take place the rules within any given language are predetermined and therefore not open to interpretation outside the laws governing that language.
    Every person with any knowledge knows that the name Jesus the professor was referring to was the Jesus of the bible who we as Christians know as Christ. Hardly arbitrary on the level you intend to use that term,  to minimise the nature of the offense. To deny this is to be intellectually dishonest and self contradictory; for didn’t you say that the purpose of the lesson was to have them write the name of a person who had personal significance?

  • OneNation245

    @greydick “Hey Stupid”… get the hell off the site ignoramus! Insulting people with valid complaints and using the f-bomb shows you are part of the mentally disabled libtards and your IQ level of -25!

  • Anonymous

    @Edward Ohare:

    “Jesus is just a series of letters..”

    Perhaps to someone like you he is. To the rest of mainstream America he is more than just a porcelain figure on a cross or a series of letters in a word. He represents our faith, the literal embodiment of it, and no true Christian should take kindly to yet another intentional slight against our faith.

    People like you, either by willful intent or happenstance, ignore the satanic prog agenda to diminish and destroy the Christian connection that this Country has had since its history began.

    Get a clue dear friend.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_4HAW7OERGSC7VZM72V7IGDJ3B4 Sharmane

    The professor (and I use that term loosely) should be fired and never allowed to teach students again as she is unfit to be in the classroom.

  • Anonymous

    Students of that professor, do some critical thinking “outside the box” symbols of culture of your own….get together with each other and you all write the Professor’s name with his/her degree on it on pieces of paper and toss them on the floor, face up, and stomp on them…laugh, make fun of the professor…….let’s see what reaction we get from the professor, when the students are poking fun, showing “earned” disrespect.  Professors are held in high esteem, right?  Kind of like a cultural symbol throughout the world.  I wonder what the reactions by the Professor would be, hum?  Document it and turn it in for some extra credit in that class….In the Quran, Mohammed said Jesus was a prophet and a good man and prophets do not lie….and Mohammed was a prophet….and Jesus said he was the son of God…….and prophets do not lie…..since we show so much more respect to Mohammed than Jesus today around the world, do you think Mohammed would be pleased knowing a “prophet’s” name was used in vain as an exercise in “discussion of the importance of symbols in culture” as a class exercise of disrespect (really), if they wanted to be honest about it which, by using this exercise, THEY ARE NOT!  And what about Mohammed, let’s see them use the prophet Mohammed’s name in their next exercise of disrespect of a cultural symbol, or maybe the star and crescent flag.  How much courage does that professor really have? hum?  Maybe you students can do that for your next critical thinking “outside the box” extra credit cultural symbol exercise.

  • Anonymous

     Students of that professor, do some critical thinking “outside the box”
    symbols of culture of your own….get together with each other and you
    all write the Professor’s name with his/her degree on it on pieces of
    paper and toss them on the floor, face up, and stomp on them…laugh,
    make fun of the professor…….let’s see what reaction we get from the
    professor, when the students are poking fun, showing “earned”
    disrespect.  Professors are held in high esteem, right?  Kind of like a
    cultural symbol throughout the world.  I wonder what the reactions by
    the Professor would be, hum?  Document it and turn it in for some extra
    credit in that class….In the Quran, Mohammed said Jesus was a prophet
    and a good man and prophets do not lie….and Mohammed was a
    prophet….and Jesus said he was the son of God…….and prophets do
    not lie…..since we show so much more respect to Mohammed than Jesus
    today around the world, do you think Mohammed would be pleased knowing a
    “prophet’s” name was used in vain as an exercise in “discussion of the importance of symbols in culture” as a
    class exercise of disrespect (really), if they wanted to be honest about
    it which, by using this exercise, THEY ARE NOT!  And what about
    Mohammed, let’s see them use the prophet Mohammed’s name in their next
    exercise of disrespect of a cultural symbol, or maybe the star and
    crescent flag.  How much courage does that professor really have? hum? 
    Maybe you students can do that for your next critical thinking “outside
    the box” extra credit cultural symbol exercise.

  • Anonymous

    Math Lesson with your same critical thinking skills……You look at our deficit and debt as just a bunch of random numbers running on the debt clock…it doesn’t necessarily mean we are broke because we can still borrow and print and HUD can still force banks to lend to unqualified borrowers….and until we can no longer borrow, until there are no countries willing to lend us any more money, and/or until we have lost our credit ratings of good standing, then we can put meaning to it, just before we slide into 3rd world status of govt spending on steroids….what a great crap class to teach and what a great student of crap you are to comprehend it all and explain it so well….if I had a dime for every educated “liberal studies” idiot I’ve met like you, I’d be a f**king millionaire.  Here’s the end of my math lesson for the day…I have five fingers on my hand….the thumb (t), the index (i), the middle (m), the ring (r) and the pinky (p)     mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm…How’s that for symbols that may seem arbitrary or out of context and for some REAL MEANING, hum?

  • Anonymous

     That or he’s another student with a degree in “liberal studies” which by the way is 5 lbs of crap in a 4 lb bag……useless!

  • Anonymous

    when you write the letters J-e-s-u-s. they are just letters. without the english language they are just ink marks on paper. The point of the lesson is why won’t you step on just a piece of paper with some ink on it? b/c at the end of the day that’s all that is. The reason you won’t is b/c the name Jesus is a symbol and even in just ink and paper it has meaning.

  • Anonymous

    yes, the point was to ask them to stomp on the paper and when the didn’t ask why and point out its really just ink on paper. then go into the discussion of how this ink on paper becomes a symbol and takes on meaning it did not have

  • Anonymous

    the point of the lesson is that when you write the letters J-e-s-u-s. they are just letters. without the english language they are just ink marks on paper. The point of the lesson is why won’t you step on just a piece of paper with some ink on it? b/c at the end of the day that’s all that is. The reason you won’t is b/c the name Jesus is a symbol and even in just ink and paper it has meaning, we give the ink and the paper greater than just the materials, that’s a symbol.
    If you had a class full of muslim students then asking them to stomp on muhammad would be an effective way to make the exact same point.

  • Anonymous

    You wouldn’t really use this to do math stuff, the way this lesson would be applied is why do certain numbers represent certain amounts.
    the point of the lesson, and the point i’m unsuccessfully (i can tell based on the problems people have with my point have more to do with not liking the idea of randomness then the actual method of showing how seemingly arbitrary symbols have value) trying to make, when you write the letters J-e-s-u-s. they are just letters. without the english language they are just ink marks on paper. The point of the lesson is why won’t you step on just a piece of paper with some ink on it? b/c at the end of the day that’s all that is. The reason you won’t is b/c the name Jesus is a symbol and even in just ink and paper it has meaning.

  • Anonymous

     Edward, once again, you like to sound erudite, but you’re completely missing the point. The teacher chose a symbol that he felt very free to wantonly abuse in a university setting. He knew that he would not face opposition from the university in such an exercise. While his point was valid, his example was offensive to the point of idiocy. You said that having students stomp on scriptures is different because they’re not symbols? So, stomping on the Miriam Webster dictionary should elicit the same response, correct? It is the MEANING behind the book (in other words, what it symbolizes) that makes the act offensive.

    He could have achieved the same point by discussing why, for example, Christians would react negatively to being asked to wear a patch with the crescent and star symbols of Islam, or a patch with the flag of another country, or for Islamic students to be forced to wear a Christian cross. Object lessons can be powerful teachers, but they lose efficacy and validity when they involve forcing students to commit an act that is a fundamental offense against who and what they ARE at their core. It is an act that can as easily be imagined by students through hypothetical discussion. Attempting to force a student to actually ACT is a fundamental violation of that student’s civil rights.

    What if the student wanted to make the same point in a class in which he was required to give a presentation on the same point? What if he chose to demonstrate such a point to a teacher who is a follower of Islam? Would the university then be correct in maintaining that faculty and students alike should feel free to discuss and illustrate such matters however they choose? You and I both know that such an act would be considered a violation of the teacher’s civil rights and also a personal attack, and rightly so, as this is obviously the truth of the matter.

    When an object lesson detracts from what is being taught, it is not viable. Why was the act so important to the teacher when he could have simply asked them to imagine how the students would feel as he described the act? Or do you believe that actually forcing them to commit that act drove the lesson home more fully? Additionally, he could have shown clips of such acts of desecration from real examples that are easily found in seconds on the internet, thus removing the very intensely personal offensiveness of his actions and focusing the discussion on the subject being discussed, rather than the personal nature of the object lesson. If, as the teacher claimed, he was trying to “get the students to think,” why did he fail to “think” even to the level of being able to accurately predict the probable outcome of his chosen methodology? And remember, the teacher claimed he was trying to get the students to challenge the power of symbols. Yet, what is the university setting if not a symbol? When this student challenged the power of that symbol, the university’s reaction was wildly disproportionate punishment equivalent to nothing more than rage, revenge and intolerance. Congratulations…lesson learned.

    Additionally, the school’s actions following the report were reprehensible. They attempted to smear the student’s reputation, including turning turning the matter over to a “student committee” composed of leftist fascists fully committed to destroying ANY vestige of true freedom of thought. This, after the university had annotated the student’s official record, virtually guaranteeing that he would not be able to enter another university. They only backed off when their actions were exposed to the light of national attention. The fact that they have now apologized is meaningless in light of the fact that the teacher has suffered no repercussions for his actions. It is nothing more than a perfunctory statement designed to avoid the consequences of their behavior.

    The fact, Edward, that you both diminish the offensive actions of the teacher and fail to recognize the ineptitude of an educator and educational institution that is so profoundly ignorant of the real world application of the very lesson they claimed they were teaching speaks volumes about your true world view. Do you actually believe that public liberal arts colleges embrace and encourage “free” discussion? Not only do the liberals who infest public universities not embrace such lofty ideals, they consider any opinion to the contrary of the liberal agenda to constitute hate speech worthy of instant and permanent silencing through any means. Only a fool would believe that the university’s decision to both marginalize him amongst his peers and permanently malign his official record was a tempered response; both justifiable and explicable in the atmosphere of the “free exchange of ideas”. Both the teacher’s actions and the university’s response to the student’s complaint were reprehensible and shameful.

  • Anonymous

    it would be different b/c scriptures have more non abstract value.
    He did not force them to stomp, he told them to but if the symbol has meaning to the students they won’t which is when he interjects and asks them why etc.
    to sum up the point the lesson and i’m trying to make is when you write the letters J-e-s-u-s. they are just letters. without the english language they are just ink marks on paper. The point of the lesson is why won’t you step on just a piece of paper with some ink on it? b/c at the end of the day that’s all that is. The reason you won’t is b/c the name Jesus is a symbol and even in just ink and paper it has meaning.

    I don’t know anything about public universities I don’t attend one. I know massive class sizes make discussion very difficult. I’m not defending the teacher, if the student was this upset that all this happened then he clearly screwed up the lesson in the what his instructor manual said it was supposed to be taught. I’m defending the premise of the lesson and the fact that I don’t see anything wrong with telling college students to write jesus on paper and then stomp on it with the point being if they see it as a symbol with value that they won’t and then delve into the lesson discusion etc.

  • Anonymous

    The name of any real person has meaning BEFORE being written down, otherwise writing would lack any intent or be able to be the object of planning in any way and be mere gibberish. Even the object of the lesson acknowledges this principal yet excuses itself from any ethical responsibility. That is only one of the self contradictory dimensions of your argument. I believe it is purposeful and meant to enforce subjectivism and relativism which are both aberrant philosophies liberal academia swallows hook line and sinker.
    Words are ink on paper but not merely ink on paper, sentences are words in a sequence but not merely words in a sequence. Propositions are thus able to communicate objective reality person to person. If the student went to the board and wrote the professor is an ignorant dickhead would he be able to get off the hook by saying its only a little calcium sediment on slate?
    Any sane person knows that whatever the professor was trying to communicate he could do so without offence or misunderstanding. If he’s to stupid to do this he has no business as a teacher. If that is not the case it means that the professor has a different agenda he is trying to work into the curriculum.

  • greywolfrs

    Yeah, but you are a mental giant, as you believe the “f-bomb” is anything more than just another word.

  • greywolfrs

    That or you are another ignorant jackoff that thinks you know something and can psychoanalyze someone by posts in an internet forum. Dunce.

  • Steven Roberts

    The fact that the student did not want to step on the paper drove the point home. To punish the student for not complying is just the bias views of the alleged professor. That was a teacher stepping over the line and should be fired.

  • CharlyO

    This is a perfect example of closed minded intellectuals. Why didn’t Prof use Jane Fondel! These little sheepl babies probably wouldn’t recognise her name.

  • Anonymous

    I have degrees from both private and public universities. My experience in public university showed me what happens when a person spends a lifetime in the insular cocoon of academia without ever actually personally interacting with the world that is purported to be explained by such an academic. It was not class size that caused the problem. It was the fools standing at the head of classes comprised of students that often had far more experience with the world than did the instructors. I witnessed abuse and excess on a scale writ large by all of those “mentors”. They had little more than disdain for the world of those of us who were not only students, but physicians. According to them, only the “pure” study of basic sciences qualified one for a vocation in the university setting. They wore their prejudice like a badge of honor, silencing and heaping abuse on those they deemed contemptible. My undergraduate degree was earned at a religious university, as was my medical degree. My residency and PhD were earned at a public university. The differences were so vast as to be breathtaking.
    What exactly does “non abstract value” mean? The words, “Jesus,” “Christ,” “Mohammed,” “God,” or “Allah” mean no more within the pages of a book than they do when written on a piece of paper. It is what those words represent to the participants in the object lesson that has meaning, not the medium in which they are presented. The object lesson chosen by the instructor shows his obvious lack of understanding, sensitivity and profound lack of judgment.
    Object lessons should not detract from the point being taught. In this case, the stupidity was not confined to the classroom, it was carried on and expanded by the university. Their actions were a direct result of the insular hubris that results when a publicly funded so-called educational institution is so populated by activist liberals that they no longer recognize the meaning of right and wrong. Their pride allows them only the view from their own bully pulpit. That term is aptly used here because their actions showed the true nature of who and what they truly are-bullies…nothing more and nothing less.

  • Anonymous

    No sir they are NOT just letters. You seem to be missing the entire point of what i’m trying to say, which makes what i said of you earlier all the more ironic.

    The point is that this exercise was no more than another attempt to render insults against the Christian faith, using the excuse of higher learning. Years ago this would have been considered blasphemy, today it’s considered part of liberal progressive education.

    Your comments remind me of a saying; “when you stand for nothing, you’ll fall for anything”

  • TrustButVerify

     @edwardhare:disqus – Like the good liberal/progressive you are, you keep repeating yourself, hoping that if you do it enough it will become truth. 

    The professor was WRONG! and the university compounded the error in their treatment of the student! ’nuff said!