Glenn Talks With Evan McMullin About Taking the Lead in Utah

October 20, 2016

Writer

Independent presidential candidate Evan McMullin joined Glenn on radio Thursday to talk about his recent surge in Utah. Unheard of less than three months ago, the momentum in McMullin's campaign has been astonishing.

"You have now pulled ahead of both candidates in one state. And if you saw the polls in the others, you may be doing the same in a couple of others, at least in the Mountain West. That changes the dynamic of everything," Glenn said to McMullin.

Encouraged by the traction his campaign is experiencing, McMullin talked with Glenn about a return to principled leadership and why he's running for president.

Read below or watch the clip for answers to these questions:

• Does Evan McMullin know what partial-birth abortion is?

• How is McMullin polling in Idaho?

• What is McMullin's vision for the Supreme Court?

• What are McMullin's 13 Principles for New American Leadership?

• Is McMullin building a new conservative movement?

Below is a rush transcript of this segment, it might contain errors:

GLENN: Evan McMullin is on the phone. EvanMcMullin.com. Running for president.

Evan, what's the problem with partial-birth abortion?

EVAN: Well, it's a violation of our basic inalienable right to life. I mean, you know, it's sad that we even have to make that defense in this day and age. But, look, these are lives, and they have a right to them. And we have an obligation to protect them.

GLENN: Now, I'm going to play Hillary Clinton, and she responds, "Well, I know women who have had to have this because of the life of the mother, and you think don't like moms." How do you respond?

EVAN: Well, look, first of all, I think those kinds of scenarios are extremely, extremely rare. So it's a bit of a -- you know, it's a bit of a cop-out, I think, to make that defense. In most cases, that's not at all the case.

PAT: They were common in the 1800s, Evan. They were common in the 1800s.

EVAN: Yeah, right.

GLENN: So partial-birth abortion, to save the life of the mother.

EVAN: Yeah. It's -- first of all, it's illegal I think in the vast majority of states across the country. Most Americans are even opposed to partial-birth abortions, if not -- I mean, the vast majority are.

PAT: It's illegal in most of the world, actually.

EVAN: Yeah, most of the world too. I mean, you look at both of these candidates, both of these candidates have been supportive of late-term abortions. Forget about partial-birth abortions. Late-term abortions in the past. Donald Trump only became pro-life when he decided to run for president as a part of the -- through the Republican primary.

Mindy Finn and I are the only pro-life candidates running for president and vice president this year. And it's deeply -- well, I guess Pence is pro-life as well. But I'm the only presidential candidate who is pro-life -- truly pro-life in this race.

GLENN: Evan, a new poll has come out. Three months ago, you know, nobody knew who you were. Now, at least in Utah, you are beating Hillary. Last week, you were not. This week, you were beating Hillary and Donald Trump.

EVAN: That's right.

GLENN: And you're beating by four points?

PAT: Yeah, 31-27.

EVAN: Yeah, I'm over Donald Trump by four points. And Hillary by more than that. You know, it's one poll and we've got a lot of work to do. And there's a few weeks left. We're very encouraged by our progress, by our momentum. We see it in the polls. We see it in our online engagement. We feel it in our events. But we're hoping that it will spill over into other states in the Mountain West, and beyond. Even though there are only a few weeks left, we think we can advance this momentum pretty far.

PAT: Evan, if you were to talk about the importance of Supreme Court justices, what is the first thing you would identify as -- as the cause of that importance? Why is the Supreme Court justice so important right now?

EVAN: Well, we need Supreme Court justices who will enforce the Constitution, who will -- who will take it as it's written. That's what we need: Originalists. You know, the one thing that I heard last night from Hillary Clinton is that she thought our justices needed to --

PAT: Originalists.

EVAN: -- quote, represent us.

PAT: Right.

EVAN: And I thought, "My goodness, this is a woman who does not understand what the court is there to do." As I said it, it's there to enforce the Constitution. It's actually precisely not there to represent us. That's the point.

STU: Yeah.

PAT: One of the Supreme Court justices --

(cuts out online and on the app)

PAT: -- what you would identify as the cause of that.

(Cuts out online and on the app) (music)

VOICE: We apologize for this disruption in our regular programming. Thanks for your patience. We'll return to our scheduled show, as soon as we can.

(music)

GLENN: -- you believe your campaign is working and what it stands for.

But are there other states that you're also doing well in?

EVAN: Yes. Well -- so as you mentioned, we're doing very well in Utah. There are not a lot of polls in Idaho unfortunately, because it's just been a very, very -- you know, it's gone Republican.

But so has Utah. But a few weeks ago, we saw polls in Idaho that had us at about the same place we were in Utah. And we're seeing a lot of momentum there online, as well as at our events. And so I think what's happening there is similar to what's happening in Utah. We just haven't been able to quantify it yet.

STU: Yeah, we should point out, as a message to pollsters out there -- I mean, if Evan McMullin is on the ballot in your state, he needs to be included in these polls. I mean, these guys are polling states and leaving "other" as one of the options. And "other" is mysteriously getting 11 percent in the poll. I mean, it would follow logically to believe that a lot of that is going to Evan McMullin. He's been making great gains. I mean, the idea that you're leaving him out at this point, you know, Evan, I think it's just --

GLENN: When you called us three months ago, we were like, "Okay. I don't know who you are. And this is not going to work. I mean, this is crazy."

(chuckling)

GLENN: But now -- you have now pulled ahead of both candidates in one state.

EVAN: Yeah.

GLENN: And if you saw the polls in the others, you may be doing the same in a couple of others, at least in the Mountain West. That changes the dynamic of everything.

PAT: Uh-huh.

GLENN: Of everything.

EVAN: Yeah, sure. Absolutely.

GLENN: Can you give me the --

EVAN: But, you know, these pollsters, they've got their established plans, and their established plans are competitors. And so, you know, there's a reason why I think many of us are leaving us off. I'm trying to understand it myself.

But look, where they do include us, we register. And we're very excited about that. And we know that we have a great deal of support out there that's growing very quickly. So, you know, we hope that they'll start including us. When they do, they tend to register our support. And in a place like the Mountain West, it's significant. So hopefully we'll see more out of Utah -- or, more out of Idaho.

GLENN: Can you give me any of the items of what you stand for? It was a list on your website. I don't remember what it was called.

EVAN: Yeah, yeah. We released -- Glenn, we released a document called Principles for New American Leadership. And it's just 13 principles that we think are basic for uniting the conservative movement and for drawing in to our side people who are conservatives, but tend to vote on the Democratic side. I'm talking about a lot of people in the Hispanic community, people think -- especially in the African-American community, there are a lot of people who are actually conservative, but they vote Democratic because they don't think they're welcome in the Republican Party.

So what are those principles? Some of the first ones are simply that all of us, all men and women are created equal, that we have a right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. That's the first thing. The second thing is that we have an inspired Constitution that needs to be respected for how it was written, not how some people wish it were.

The other thing is that we need to have, as the Constitution lays out, a separation of powers, that's both vertical and horizontal. Meaning, the balance of powers between the federal branches, as well as the empowerment of the states, beyond those powers that are explicitly listed in the Constitution for the federal government. These are the types of things.

Another thing is that we need honest and wise leaders because, even though we have an inspired Constitution, Glenn, it doesn't matter if our leaders don't respect it and if they are not wise and honest. We must -- absolutely must have honest and wise leaders. If we don't, our Constitution will be trampled upon, and it won't mean much.

And then the last thing maybe I'll mention her -- and I'm going through the top five points. The last point is that we need a new era of civic engagement. All of us. We cannot trust our leaders anymore, Glenn. And that's why Mindy and I have gotten into this race. Because we couldn't trust them to do the right thing anymore. We -- all Americans have to step up. We need to recruit honest and wise leaders and promote them into office and be educated -- well-educated on the issues and drive this thing forward.

GLENN: What message do you hope that the American people get, the media gets, the two-party system, the Republicans get? What message do you hope that you are sending, you know, the day after the election?

EVAN: Well, we're building a new conservative movement. And that's what -- that's what we're doing.

So, yes, there's a chance that we can block Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, if the race is very close. Right now, Hillary Clinton is absolutely dominating Donald Trump in the electoral college. So it doesn't look like it's going to be a close race.

So what we're building is a new conservative movement that will be dedicated to the principles that I've just described, and others that we believe will unite conservatives. True conservatives, by the way. True conservatives. And also appeal to people who aren't conservative, but who haven't felt welcome in the Republican Party in the past.

That is the kind of leadership that this country leads. That will create a powerful conservative movement in this country that is electorally viable, unlike the type of conservatism -- if you can even call it that -- that Donald Trump has offered the American people. And I wouldn't call it conservatism, to be clear.

But that's the kind of leadership, that's the kind of movement we need in this country, to be powerful and prosperous and to unify us as well.

PAT: If only there was a place where people could go to help your campaign, to donate or volunteer service.

GLENN: Oh, my gosh, we're back to that.

JEFFY: Right.

PAT: Man, if they --

GLENN: I didn't think we would hear this for four more years.

PAT: I didn't either. If only there was a place --

(chuckling)

EVAN: There is.

PAT: Oh, my gosh. Oh, my gosh.

JEFFY: What?

EVAN: I know you're surprised by that. And guess what, it's a website, and it's called EvanMcMullin.com.

GLENN: I don't know what that is.

PAT: EvanMcMullin.com. Now, that's with an I at the end of McMullin, right? Instead of an E? Kind of counterintuitive --

EVAN: That's right. That's right. Ends in I-N.

PAT: Now, also, I know you're doing well in both Utah and Idaho, but as a BYU grad, do you have a prediction for BYU/Boise State tonight?

EVAN: Oh, yeah. Well, I'm going to go with the Cougs, of course. Go Cougs!

PAT: He's going to win Utah.

GLENN: All right. Good. I'm glad we have that.

PAT: He's going to win Utah.

GLENN: You guys got to bring Jell-O dishes and share those.

EVAN: Oh, yeah. I'll be eating a lot of Jell-O tonight. You know it.

GLENN: All right. Evan, thanks a lot. I appreciate it. EvanMcMullin.com.

STU: That's the only reason you wanted him on, Pat. Wasn't it?

PAT: That's it. Yeah.

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The Woodrow Wilson strategy to get out of Mother’s Day

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I’ve got a potentially helpful revelation that’s gonna blow the lid off your plans for this Sunday. It’s Mother’s Day.

Yeah, that sacred day where you’re guilt-tripped into buying flowers, braving crowded brunch buffets, and pretending you didn’t forget to mail the card. But what if I told you… you don’t have to do it? That’s right, there’s a loophole, a get-out-of-Mother’s-Day-free card, and it’s stamped with the name of none other than… Woodrow Wilson (I hate that guy).

Back in 1914, ol’ Woody Wilson signed a proclamation that officially made Mother’s Day a national holiday. Second Sunday in May, every year. He said it was a day to “publicly express our love and reverence for the mothers of our country.” Sounds sweet, right? Until you peel back the curtain.

See, Wilson wasn’t some sentimental guy sitting around knitting doilies for his mom. No, no, no. This was a calculated move.

The idea for Mother’s Day had been floating around for decades, pushed by influential voices like Julia Ward Howe. By 1911, states were jumping on the bandwagon, but it took Wilson to make it federal. Why? Because he was a master of optics. This guy loved big, symbolic gestures to distract from the real stuff he was up to, like, oh, I don’t know, reshaping the entire federal government!

So here’s the deal: if you’re looking for an excuse to skip Mother’s Day, just lean into this. Say, “Sorry, Mom, I’m not celebrating a holiday cooked up by Woodrow Wilson!” I mean, think about it – this is the guy who gave us the Federal Reserve, the income tax, and don’t even get me started on his assault on basic liberties during World War I. You wanna trust THAT guy with your Sunday plans? I don’t think so! You tell your mom, “Look, I love you, but I’m not observing a Progressive holiday. I’m keeping my brunch money in protest.”

Now, I know what you might be thinking.

“Glenn, my mom’s gonna kill me if I try this.” Fair point. Moms can be scary. But hear me out: you can spin this. Tell her you’re honoring her EVERY DAY instead of some government-mandated holiday. You don’t need Wilson’s permission to love your mom! You can bake her a cake in June, call her in July, or, here’s a wild idea, visit her WITHOUT a Woodrow Wilson federal proclamation guilting you into it.

Shocking Christian massacres unveiled

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Is a Christian Genocide unfolding overseas?

Recent reports suggest an alarming escalation in violence against Christians, raising questions about whether these acts constitute genocide under international law. Recently, Glenn hosted former U.S. Army Special Forces Sniper Tim Kennedy, who discussed a predictive model that forecasts a surge in global Christian persecution for the summer of 2025.

From Africa to Asia and the Middle East, extreme actions—some described as genocidal—have intensified over the past year. Over 380 million Christians worldwide face high levels of persecution, a number that continues to climb. With rising international concern, the United Nations and human rights groups are urging protective measures by the global community. Is a Christian genocide being waged in the far corners of the globe? Where are they taking place, and what is being done?

India: Hindu Extremist Violence Escalates

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In India, attacks on Christians have surged as Hindu extremist groups gain influence within the country. In February 2025, Hindu nationalist leader Aadesh Soni organized a 50,000-person rally in Chhattisgarh, where he called for the rape and murder of all Christians in nearby villages and demanded the execution of Christian leaders to erase Christianity. Other incidents include forced conversions, such as a June 2024 attack in Chhattisgarh, where a Hindu mob gave Christian families a 10-day ultimatum to convert to Hinduism. In December 2024, a Christian man in Uttar Pradesh was attacked, forcibly converted, and paraded while the mob chanted "Death to Jesus."

The United States Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF) recommends designating India a "Country of Particular Concern" and imposing targeted sanctions on those perpetrating these attacks. The international community is increasingly alarmed by the rising tide of religious violence in India.

Syria: Sectarian Violence Post-Regime Change

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Following the collapse of the Assad regime in December 2024, Syria has seen a wave of sectarian violence targeting religious minorities, including Christians, with over 1,000 killed in early 2025. It remains unclear whether Christians are deliberately targeted or caught in broader conflicts, but many fear persecution by the new regime or extremist groups. Hayat Tahrir al-Sham (HTS), a dominant rebel group and known al-Qaeda splinter group now in power, is known for anti-Christian sentiments, heightening fears of increased persecution.

Christians, especially converts from Islam, face severe risks in the unstable post-regime environment. The international community is calling for humanitarian aid and protection for Syria’s vulnerable minority communities.

Democratic Republic of Congo: A "Silent Genocide"

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In February 2025, the Allied Democratic Forces (ADF), an ISIS-affiliated group, beheaded 70 Christians—men, women, and children—in a Protestant church in North Kivu, Democratic Republic of Congo, after tying their hands. This horrific massacre, described as a "silent genocide" reminiscent of the 1994 Rwandan genocide, has shocked the global community.

Since 1996, the ADF and other militias have killed over six million people, with Christians frequently targeted. A Christmas 2024 attack killed 46, further decimating churches in the region. With violence escalating, humanitarian organizations are urging immediate international intervention to address the crisis.

POLL: Starbase exposed: Musk’s vision or corporate takeover?

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Is Starbase the future of innovation or a step too far?

Elon Musk’s ambitious Starbase project in South Texas is reshaping Boca Chica into a cutting-edge hub for SpaceX’s Starship program, promising thousands of jobs and a leap toward Mars colonization. Supporters see Musk as a visionary, driving economic growth and innovation in a historically underserved region. However, local critics, including Brownsville residents and activists, argue that SpaceX’s presence raises rents, restricts beach access, and threatens environmental harm, with Starbase’s potential incorporation as a city sparking fears of unchecked corporate control. As pro-Musk advocates clash with anti-Musk skeptics, will Starbase unite the community or deepen the divide?

Let us know what you think in the poll below:

Is Starbase’s development a big win for South Texas?

Should Starbase become its own city?

Is Elon Musk’s vision more of a benefit than a burden for the region?

Shocking truth behind Trump-Zelenskyy mineral deal unveiled

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President Donald Trump and Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy have finalized a landmark agreement that will shape the future of U.S.-Ukraine relations. The agreement focuses on mineral access and war recovery.

After a tense March meeting, Trump and Zelenskyy signed a deal on Wednesday, April 30, 2025, granting the U.S. preferential mineral rights in Ukraine in exchange for continued military support. Glenn analyzed an earlier version of the agreement in March, when Zelenskyy rejected it, highlighting its potential benefits for America, Ukraine, and Europe. Glenn praised the deal’s strategic alignment with U.S. interests, including reducing reliance on China for critical minerals and fostering regional peace.

However, the agreement signed this week differs from the March proposal Glenn praised. Negotiations led to significant revisions, reflecting compromises on both sides. What changes were made? What did each leader seek, and what did they achieve? How will this deal impact the future of U.S.-Ukraine relations and global geopolitics? Below, we break down the key aspects of the agreement.

What did Trump want?

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Trump aimed to curb what many perceive as Ukraine’s overreliance on U.S. aid while securing strategic advantages for America. His primary goals included obtaining reimbursement for the billions in military aid provided to Ukraine, gaining exclusive access to Ukraine’s valuable minerals (such as titanium, uranium, and lithium), and reducing Western dependence on China for critical resources. These minerals are essential for aerospace, energy, and technology sectors, and Trump saw their acquisition as a way to bolster U.S. national security and economic competitiveness. Additionally, he sought to advance peace talks to end the Russia-Ukraine war, positioning the U.S. as a key mediator.

Ultimately, Trump secured preferential—but not exclusive—rights to extract Ukraine’s minerals through the United States-Ukraine Reconstruction Investment Fund, as outlined in the agreement. The U.S. will not receive reimbursement for past aid, but future military contributions will count toward the joint fund, designed to support Ukraine’s post-war recovery. Zelenskyy’s commitment to peace negotiations under U.S. leadership aligns with Trump’s goal of resolving the conflict, giving him leverage in discussions with Russia.

These outcomes partially meet Trump’s objectives. The preferential mineral rights strengthen U.S. access to critical resources, but the lack of exclusivity and reimbursement limits the deal’s financial benefits. The peace commitment, however, positions Trump as a central figure in shaping the war’s resolution, potentially enhancing his diplomatic influence.

What did Zelenskyy want?

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Zelenskyy sought to sustain U.S. military and economic support without the burden of repaying past aid, which has been critical for Ukraine’s defense against Russia. He also prioritized reconstruction funds to rebuild Ukraine’s war-torn economy and infrastructure. Security guarantees from the U.S. to deter future Russian aggression were a key demand, though controversial, as they risked entangling America in long-term commitments. Additionally, Zelenskyy aimed to retain control over Ukraine’s mineral wealth to safeguard national sovereignty and align with the country’s European Union membership aspirations.

The final deal delivered several of Zelenskyy’s priorities. The reconstruction fund, supported by future U.S. aid, provides a financial lifeline for Ukraine’s recovery without requiring repayment of past assistance. Ukraine retained ownership of its subsoil and decision-making authority over mineral extraction, granting only preferential access to the U.S. However, Zelenskyy conceded on security guarantees, a significant compromise, and agreed to pursue peace talks under Trump’s leadership, which may involve territorial or political concessions to Russia.

Zelenskyy’s outcomes reflect a delicate balance. The reconstruction fund and retained mineral control bolster Ukraine’s economic and sovereign interests, but the absence of security guarantees and pressure to negotiate peace could strain domestic support and challenge Ukraine’s long-term stability.

What does this mean for the future?

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While Trump didn’t secure all his demands, the deal advances several of his broader strategic goals. By gaining access to Ukraine’s mineral riches, the U.S. undermines China’s dominance over critical elements like lithium and graphite, essential for technology and energy industries. This shift reduces American and European dependence on Chinese supply chains, strengthening Western industrial and tech sectors. Most significantly, the agreement marks a pivotal step toward peace in Europe. Ending the Russia-Ukraine war, which has claimed thousands of lives, is a top priority for Trump, and Zelenskyy’s commitment to U.S.-led peace talks enhances Trump’s leverage in negotiations with Russia. Notably, the deal avoids binding U.S. commitments to Ukraine’s long-term defense, preserving flexibility for future administrations.

The deal’s broader implications align with the vision Glenn outlined in March, when he praised its potential to benefit America, Ukraine, and Europe by securing resources and creating peace. While the final agreement differs from Glenn's hopes, it still achieves key goals he outlined.

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