Independent presidential candidate Evan McMullin joined Glenn on radio Thursday to talk about his recent surge in Utah. Unheard of less than three months ago, the momentum in McMullin's campaign has been astonishing.
"You have now pulled ahead of both candidates in one state. And if you saw the polls in the others, you may be doing the same in a couple of others, at least in the Mountain West. That changes the dynamic of everything," Glenn said to McMullin.
Encouraged by the traction his campaign is experiencing, McMullin talked with Glenn about a return to principled leadership and why he's running for president.
Read below or watch the clip for answers to these questions:
• Does Evan McMullin know what partial-birth abortion is?
• How is McMullin polling in Idaho?
• What is McMullin's vision for the Supreme Court?
• What are McMullin's 13 Principles for New American Leadership?
• Is McMullin building a new conservative movement?
Below is a rush transcript of this segment, it might contain errors:
GLENN: Evan McMullin is on the phone. EvanMcMullin.com. Running for president.
Evan, what's the problem with partial-birth abortion?
EVAN: Well, it's a violation of our basic inalienable right to life. I mean, you know, it's sad that we even have to make that defense in this day and age. But, look, these are lives, and they have a right to them. And we have an obligation to protect them.
GLENN: Now, I'm going to play Hillary Clinton, and she responds, "Well, I know women who have had to have this because of the life of the mother, and you think don't like moms." How do you respond?
EVAN: Well, look, first of all, I think those kinds of scenarios are extremely, extremely rare. So it's a bit of a -- you know, it's a bit of a cop-out, I think, to make that defense. In most cases, that's not at all the case.
PAT: They were common in the 1800s, Evan. They were common in the 1800s.
EVAN: Yeah, right.
GLENN: So partial-birth abortion, to save the life of the mother.
EVAN: Yeah. It's -- first of all, it's illegal I think in the vast majority of states across the country. Most Americans are even opposed to partial-birth abortions, if not -- I mean, the vast majority are.
PAT: It's illegal in most of the world, actually.
EVAN: Yeah, most of the world too. I mean, you look at both of these candidates, both of these candidates have been supportive of late-term abortions. Forget about partial-birth abortions. Late-term abortions in the past. Donald Trump only became pro-life when he decided to run for president as a part of the -- through the Republican primary.
Mindy Finn and I are the only pro-life candidates running for president and vice president this year. And it's deeply -- well, I guess Pence is pro-life as well. But I'm the only presidential candidate who is pro-life -- truly pro-life in this race.
GLENN: Evan, a new poll has come out. Three months ago, you know, nobody knew who you were. Now, at least in Utah, you are beating Hillary. Last week, you were not. This week, you were beating Hillary and Donald Trump.
EVAN: That's right.
GLENN: And you're beating by four points?
PAT: Yeah, 31-27.
EVAN: Yeah, I'm over Donald Trump by four points. And Hillary by more than that. You know, it's one poll and we've got a lot of work to do. And there's a few weeks left. We're very encouraged by our progress, by our momentum. We see it in the polls. We see it in our online engagement. We feel it in our events. But we're hoping that it will spill over into other states in the Mountain West, and beyond. Even though there are only a few weeks left, we think we can advance this momentum pretty far.
PAT: Evan, if you were to talk about the importance of Supreme Court justices, what is the first thing you would identify as -- as the cause of that importance? Why is the Supreme Court justice so important right now?
EVAN: Well, we need Supreme Court justices who will enforce the Constitution, who will -- who will take it as it's written. That's what we need: Originalists. You know, the one thing that I heard last night from Hillary Clinton is that she thought our justices needed to --
EVAN: -- quote, represent us.
EVAN: And I thought, "My goodness, this is a woman who does not understand what the court is there to do." As I said it, it's there to enforce the Constitution. It's actually precisely not there to represent us. That's the point.
PAT: One of the Supreme Court justices --
(cuts out online and on the app)
PAT: -- what you would identify as the cause of that.
(Cuts out online and on the app) (music)
VOICE: We apologize for this disruption in our regular programming. Thanks for your patience. We'll return to our scheduled show, as soon as we can.
GLENN: -- you believe your campaign is working and what it stands for.
But are there other states that you're also doing well in?
EVAN: Yes. Well -- so as you mentioned, we're doing very well in Utah. There are not a lot of polls in Idaho unfortunately, because it's just been a very, very -- you know, it's gone Republican.
But so has Utah. But a few weeks ago, we saw polls in Idaho that had us at about the same place we were in Utah. And we're seeing a lot of momentum there online, as well as at our events. And so I think what's happening there is similar to what's happening in Utah. We just haven't been able to quantify it yet.
STU: Yeah, we should point out, as a message to pollsters out there -- I mean, if Evan McMullin is on the ballot in your state, he needs to be included in these polls. I mean, these guys are polling states and leaving "other" as one of the options. And "other" is mysteriously getting 11 percent in the poll. I mean, it would follow logically to believe that a lot of that is going to Evan McMullin. He's been making great gains. I mean, the idea that you're leaving him out at this point, you know, Evan, I think it's just --
GLENN: When you called us three months ago, we were like, "Okay. I don't know who you are. And this is not going to work. I mean, this is crazy."
GLENN: But now -- you have now pulled ahead of both candidates in one state.
GLENN: And if you saw the polls in the others, you may be doing the same in a couple of others, at least in the Mountain West. That changes the dynamic of everything.
GLENN: Of everything.
EVAN: Yeah, sure. Absolutely.
GLENN: Can you give me the --
EVAN: But, you know, these pollsters, they've got their established plans, and their established plans are competitors. And so, you know, there's a reason why I think many of us are leaving us off. I'm trying to understand it myself.
But look, where they do include us, we register. And we're very excited about that. And we know that we have a great deal of support out there that's growing very quickly. So, you know, we hope that they'll start including us. When they do, they tend to register our support. And in a place like the Mountain West, it's significant. So hopefully we'll see more out of Utah -- or, more out of Idaho.
GLENN: Can you give me any of the items of what you stand for? It was a list on your website. I don't remember what it was called.
EVAN: Yeah, yeah. We released -- Glenn, we released a document called Principles for New American Leadership. And it's just 13 principles that we think are basic for uniting the conservative movement and for drawing in to our side people who are conservatives, but tend to vote on the Democratic side. I'm talking about a lot of people in the Hispanic community, people think -- especially in the African-American community, there are a lot of people who are actually conservative, but they vote Democratic because they don't think they're welcome in the Republican Party.
So what are those principles? Some of the first ones are simply that all of us, all men and women are created equal, that we have a right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. That's the first thing. The second thing is that we have an inspired Constitution that needs to be respected for how it was written, not how some people wish it were.
The other thing is that we need to have, as the Constitution lays out, a separation of powers, that's both vertical and horizontal. Meaning, the balance of powers between the federal branches, as well as the empowerment of the states, beyond those powers that are explicitly listed in the Constitution for the federal government. These are the types of things.
Another thing is that we need honest and wise leaders because, even though we have an inspired Constitution, Glenn, it doesn't matter if our leaders don't respect it and if they are not wise and honest. We must -- absolutely must have honest and wise leaders. If we don't, our Constitution will be trampled upon, and it won't mean much.
And then the last thing maybe I'll mention her -- and I'm going through the top five points. The last point is that we need a new era of civic engagement. All of us. We cannot trust our leaders anymore, Glenn. And that's why Mindy and I have gotten into this race. Because we couldn't trust them to do the right thing anymore. We -- all Americans have to step up. We need to recruit honest and wise leaders and promote them into office and be educated -- well-educated on the issues and drive this thing forward.
GLENN: What message do you hope that the American people get, the media gets, the two-party system, the Republicans get? What message do you hope that you are sending, you know, the day after the election?
EVAN: Well, we're building a new conservative movement. And that's what -- that's what we're doing.
So, yes, there's a chance that we can block Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, if the race is very close. Right now, Hillary Clinton is absolutely dominating Donald Trump in the electoral college. So it doesn't look like it's going to be a close race.
So what we're building is a new conservative movement that will be dedicated to the principles that I've just described, and others that we believe will unite conservatives. True conservatives, by the way. True conservatives. And also appeal to people who aren't conservative, but who haven't felt welcome in the Republican Party in the past.
That is the kind of leadership that this country leads. That will create a powerful conservative movement in this country that is electorally viable, unlike the type of conservatism -- if you can even call it that -- that Donald Trump has offered the American people. And I wouldn't call it conservatism, to be clear.
But that's the kind of leadership, that's the kind of movement we need in this country, to be powerful and prosperous and to unify us as well.
PAT: If only there was a place where people could go to help your campaign, to donate or volunteer service.
GLENN: Oh, my gosh, we're back to that.
PAT: Man, if they --
GLENN: I didn't think we would hear this for four more years.
PAT: I didn't either. If only there was a place --
EVAN: There is.
PAT: Oh, my gosh. Oh, my gosh.
EVAN: I know you're surprised by that. And guess what, it's a website, and it's called EvanMcMullin.com.
GLENN: I don't know what that is.
PAT: EvanMcMullin.com. Now, that's with an I at the end of McMullin, right? Instead of an E? Kind of counterintuitive --
EVAN: That's right. That's right. Ends in I-N.
PAT: Now, also, I know you're doing well in both Utah and Idaho, but as a BYU grad, do you have a prediction for BYU/Boise State tonight?
EVAN: Oh, yeah. Well, I'm going to go with the Cougs, of course. Go Cougs!
PAT: He's going to win Utah.
GLENN: All right. Good. I'm glad we have that.
PAT: He's going to win Utah.
GLENN: You guys got to bring Jell-O dishes and share those.
EVAN: Oh, yeah. I'll be eating a lot of Jell-O tonight. You know it.
GLENN: All right. Evan, thanks a lot. I appreciate it. EvanMcMullin.com.
STU: That's the only reason you wanted him on, Pat. Wasn't it?
PAT: That's it. Yeah.
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