GLENN: It is Father's Day weekend. And speaking of Amazon, a book you can pick up on Amazon.com right now is Play the Man. Mark is a friend of the program. Been on several times. He is the author of 16 different books. This one is a really interesting book because we have nothing, and I have been looking for books over the last few years of I want to build a library of how do you build a man? What does it mean to be a man? Because nothing in our culture is supporting that now. Mark, welcome to the program.

MARK: Hey, Glenn, it's good to be to be back.

GLENN: So the comes from the Bible the Romans took because he was worshiping Jesus. Can you tell the story?

MARK: Yeah. Incredible true story about Polycarp, he was the bishop of Smyrna, and he was taken into the coliseum, told to recant his faith, and he wouldn't do it. And part of why he wouldn't do it because he heard a voice from heaven saying be strong, Polycarp, play the man. And when I first heard that, Glenn, it gave me goosebumps because here was a guy who was martyred for his faith, and it's that little saying play the man that, you know, he died for his faith. The question is how do we live for our faith? What does it mean to play the man?

GLENN: That's what I was going to ask you. Play the man is weird advice. What does it mean?

MARK: Well, there's a verse in second Samuel that says play the man for our people. And Glenn, we share a love for history with so I tell a lot of stories about everybody from Teddy Roosevelt to a guy named John Wesley Powell. But really, it's about seven virtues that I think are the key to manhood, and that's the first part of the book. From to have love to moral courage, things that are lacking in our culture.

GLENN: So let's go through some of the virtues. Give them -- just go through all of them quickly first. Tough love, childlike wonder, willpower, raw passion, true grit, clear vision, and moral courage.

Let me start with true grit because you see that in a -- you see that in, you know, the movie true grit, and you identify it as that. As being that guy. A guy who saw something that wasn't right, wasn't necessarily a guy who was living a great life, but followed through and finished what he knew was right. Is that what true grit is?

>> I think it is. And let me just say this. I think different cultures at different points of history have defined manhood differently. And what I do is go back to a person by the name of Jesus. Son of Man. And I think he's true worth when it comes to manhood. No one models true grit better than he does. He endured the cross. I mean, that's -- that's grit right there. And then you read in another place in the New Testament where it says having done all the stand. It's this idea that it's going to take some grit to do the right thing. And I think we give up too easily. We give up too quickly, and I think part of what I advocate for the book is you've got to fight for your family and your marriage. It's not going to be easy. But grit is something exemplified by Jesus, and it is something we are called to as men.

GLENN: What is the biggest lie that our boys are being told?

MARK: That's a big question, and I'm not sure I can reduce it down to one. But I'll start here. The first virtue is tough love. Tough love is carrying a 300-pound cross 650 yards down for someone else's sin. I think we forgot what it means to exercise tough love. I think it's loving people when they least expect it and least deserve it. And it's not easy. But that's the standard we're called to. And in something that I think is -- in some ways because in our culture, Glenn, manhood is almost avoided or devalued or in some ways redefined. And so I think we've got to get back to some of these virtues that we see in the person of Jesus and we need to live out as men.

GLENN: So what is the difference between these virtues with women and why is this play the man? Shouldn't my wife have clear vision and moral courage and willpower and child like wonder?

MARK: Absolutely. And I make that admission in the book that, listen, I think these apply to anybody and everybody. But this is a call to men. Let me give you an example. A few months ago I was in a room with 500 guys, and I asked them how many of you were intentionally discipled by your did ad? And three hands go up. So what we have is a culture of men don't know what it means to be men of god and fathers don't know what it means to be a spiritual father. So what I'm going to do with the book, Glenn, is step into that no-man's-land pun intended and say here are seven virtues that I think we can work on as men. And then of course the second half of the book is really the heartbeat of the book, and it's about how to disciple our children.

GLENN: The name of the book is creating the man God created you to be. 16 best-selling books and a message that I think we truly, truly need. Play the man. Thanks, mark, for being on the program with us.

MARK: , hey, absolute joy and privilege. God bless, Glenn.

GLENN: God bless. We'll talk to you again.