RADIOSeptember 30, 2024

Why this IRS whistleblower is SUING Hunter Biden’s attorney

When IRS investigator-turned-whistleblower Gary Shapley accused the IRS of covering up Hunter Biden’s tax crimes, he knew the path forward wouldn’t be easy. While he says he has “no regrets,” he joins Glenn to explain why he and his fellow whistleblower Joseph Ziegler filed a $20 million defamation lawsuit against Hunter Biden’s attorney, Abbe Lowell, for defamation. Shapley is joined by Empower Oversight President, who has worked to protect whistleblowers.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: So for people who think maybe bad guys don't ever pay for their crimes.

Good guys never win. You remember the IRS whistle-blowers, that blew the whistle on Hunter Biden's tax crimes. These are the guys, who said, wait. There's something going on. We were told not to look into it. They slow walked it, et cetera, et cetera.

Well, they were smeared and really destroyed. And one of the guys is -- is pretty amazing.

He's -- he's known throughout the world. This is an IRS agent. Known throughout the world for his work on global tax enforcement. He was selected to create a new international organization called the Joint Chiefs of Global Tax Enforcement.

He's a supervisory special agent of the International Tax and Financial Crimes Group.

Where he leads 12 elite special agents who are subject matter experts in complex international tax and other related financial crimes.

The guy has -- I mean, he started his career as AmeriCorps volunteer. That he went to work for the Defense Department. Then Intel. Then he joined the IRS and criminal investigations. He's out to get the bad guys. He joins us now.

Welcome, Gary Shapley. How are you?

GARY: Very good. Thanks for having me, Glenn. I appreciate it.

GLENN: Oh, yeah. Thank you for your courage. For speaking out. Thank you for doing the right thing.

I also want to bring in Tristan Leavitt. Tristan is a guy who worked with Chuck Grassley, trying to help all the whistle-blowers.

He helped expose Operation Fast and Furious.

And a lot of different things. And is really strong on protecting the whistle-blowers. They are so important.

Tristan, welcome.

TRISTAN: Thank you so much, Glenn.

GLENN: So where do we start, Gary, because you are now suing Hunter Biden, and you are suing them for, what? $20 million?

GARY: To be clear, where the alleged defamation is against Abbe Lowell, the attorney for Hunter Biden.

And, yeah, the amount is 10 million for me, and also Joe Ziegler, for a total of 20 million, yes.

GLENN: So what do you claim they did?

GARY: So the complaint alleges that -- that Mr. Lowell defamed us, and it was part of an overall smear campaign, to attack both Joe Ziegler and I, for coming forward, following the law, going to Congress, and disclosing the preferential treatment that his client was receiving by the Department of Justice.

And, you know, our disclosures weren't -- weren't -- even though Hunter Biden was the topic.

Our disclosures were against the malfeasance in the Department of Justice.

FBI and IRS. So it's really interesting, that it was this third party, that came in. And became the -- you know, as we allege in our complaint, the main defamer and smearer, of both Joe Ziegler and I.

GLENN: So Tristan, that is not uncommon, though. Is it? You're a whistle-blower.

They attack whistle-blowers now like there's no tomorrow.

TRISTAN: Yeah. That's exactly right. I testified yesterday -- or, I guess two days ago, in front of the -- and there are three of our FBI clients that had been with us in the past, and one was with me again. And it's very, very common for us, to be lied about and defamed. That's part of why we want to create consequences for that.

We started. We are supporting. We are funding this lawsuit, that Gary and Joe are bringing in Abbe Lowell in our organization, of how our oversight, who I'm the president of.

And we want to, you know, hold people accountable. We want to do it in other cases.

Because we just think there's never any consequences for people just lying with impunity. They just get away with it.

And so we want to fight back, and that's not something you see happen a lot.

So that's why we want to raise money from the public. You know, we have this website, the FederalWhistleblowers.com, to build up this fund, precisely for suits like this. Where Gary and Joe, were just trying to do the right thing. And they went to Congress to do what was right. But, again, as so often happens, they were lied about. But in their case, it can have real consequences for their careers.

GLENN: I will tell you, I saw -- I saw one of the whistle-blowers, Marcus Allen, with the FBI. That guy seemed like he was dirt strong.

In -- you know, standing up for the right thing.

But he looks like he had been dragged the lie.

And just -- just punched repeatedly in the gut.

It was -- it was amazing to watch him. These whistle-blowers are really, truly, the best of America.

TRISTAN: Yeah. I sat right next to him, as he gave that statement the other day, as I testified there also. And he is, unlike some of the other whistle-blowers that testified with us, a year and some change ago, he's not been on social media.

He's just been holding it in, so we could get his pay reinstated.

And get his security clearance back.

He's finally through all of that. This was his real -- the first time people saw it. Just everything he's been through.

GLENN: It's horrible.

So what are the odds of -- I mean, what are you fighting against?

They are going to fight you with everything they have and lots of money.

Law firms do not want this one to win.

TRISTAN: Yeah. That's absolutely right.

Yeah. The real thing that Gary and Joe. They can share this.

But they're not suing for the more than in any way, right? Yes. It's a 20 million defamation suit. The point of this is that they -- as alleged in the complaint. It's not right for someone like Abbie Lowell, who is well-known, well-identified as a really big name.

A really big litigator. He represented Jared and Ivanka Trump even. But for him to go. If he goes on TV and says, these guys broke the law by sharing their tax information with Congress. Lots of people believe it.

And even Mitch Langberg, who is a defamation attorney who is representing our -- our defamation expert on our legal team, who was one of the foremost experts in the country. You know, without having a background. He said my general impression of these guys breaking the law.

Until he studied the case. And read what we shared.

And said, wow. We haven't been treated fairly here.

We want to educate the public. To know that these guys did not only the right thing. But they did it in the right way.

GLENN: So, Gary, did you at all have conversations amongst yourself of. Should we do this?

You know what will happen to us? Did you have that conversation?

GARY: Well, overall. Right? People say, why did you come forward?

And it really wasn't a choice for me. just my conscience wouldn't allow me to sit there, knowing -- knowing what I know. And seeing what was going to happen in this case. So, I mean, of course, we talked about the -- the risks, but at the same time, unfortunately -- you know, fortunately, for the American people, unfortunately for me personally, you know, the risks were real. And many of them are coming through fruition through retaliation by my employer, IRS, and the Department of Justice against me.

So I went in with my eyes wide open. And, you know, I have no regrets. I feel like we've been vindicated by -- you went from charges that weren't even going to be charged. That even before the -- the generous plea deal fell apart, where he was going to have to plead guilty to two misdemeanors. You know, they were going to give him a deferred prosecution agreement.

And when we were coming forward, you know, DOJ and David Weiss, knew they were coming forward.

He said, no, no, no. That's not going to work out. So we will have to make him plead guilty.

Of course, the judge had the amicus brief from Congress. They included our testimony. They voted out, and made public.

And, you know, that information made it pretty clear that -- that Hunter Biden was receiving that preferential treatment.

Once again, the Department of Justice and IRS here.

That is the one that engaged in -- in the conduct, in which we blew the whistle again.

So, you know, I have no regrets. And I hope the American people have confidence in -- in the IRS. And of government employees, because of what Joe and I did.

GLENN: Here's what I would like you to do. If you are -- if you have $5. There is nothing better than -- than cleaning out this rat's nest. Of liars. And thieves.

In our Justice Department. In really, in all throughout the government.

They have to be taught a lesson.

And unless we do it from the outside, the inside is never going to punish itself.

And I would urge you to go to Empowr. E-M-P-O-W-R.us. And if you can, make a donation. This thing is going to cost a lot of money.

But we have to have the best lawyers on it. We have to have the strongest case possible.

Otherwise, this continues over and over and over again, and good people are destroyed.

So please, go to Empowr. E-M-P-O-W-R. No E there, dot.us. And give, if you can.

Thank you so much, guys.

Appreciate it.

TRISTAN: Thank you, Glenn. Appreciate it.

GLENN: You bet. Buh-bye. Let me just play this whistle-blower.

So this guy is the guy that Tristan was just talking about, that he sat next to.

I don't know if you saw this. But he's an FBI agent. Who was a whistle-blower.

Life destroyed.

Hasn't said anything publicly. Until the other day.

And listen to what he said.

It's cut three.

VOICE: I've considered the hearing today, my last act of service as a public servant for the United States of America. And I'll give you my professional opinion.

I was an Intel professional for our country, for many years.

And I would give recommendations. And also indications and warnings.

Soiled offer this to the American people, as my warning to them.

This is a warning, the American people, I say, you personally have no confidence, that the FBI will reign in its own conduct.

I have been persecuted along with Garrett. Steve and Kyle. And countless other whistle-blowers. It is my opinion, that the bureau used reprisal and fear to control the workforce.

It has been a seemingly effective tactic. I personally believe that there are no current effective checks and balances against them, conducting lawless action with any type of correction in a legitimate time frame.

GLENN: Wow.

VOICE: I welcome the work of the IG. But I think any type of lawless action, there is no legitimate time frame to rein them back in. Their ability to overclassify information, to allow them to stonewall forever.

To the American people, you have a duty as a citizen to vote. And I strongly urge you to do so.

It's how you participate in the American experience. I know people have doubts about election integrity. But you must vote it as your claim.

Stake your claim, and don't forfeit it willingly.

Have your voice heard. My other recommendations are in the natural order.

First vote. Is the Second Amendment. Arm yourself, and know how to defend yourself. Make three to four friends in your neighborhood. And promise to come to people's mutual aid in times of hardship. And during the great depression. People stocked up a pantry.

So I think that's a good practice, especially in our economic times, and make sure you have three to four months of food. As a person of faith, I would say, pray the rosary.

Go to the first Friday devotions. That's for everybody. All my brothers and sisters of all faiths. And I know I'm Catholic. And read the gospel of our Lord and savior Jesus Christ. And live it every day.

And that's all I have to say, thank you for the time.

GLENN: Do you hear how his voice is shaking?

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: This is -- how do people dismiss that warning? That is -- I mean, we are living in unprecedented times.

And I tweeted that out, the other day. I should retweet it now.

These guys are so brave. And you can tell they are -- they are not playing politics. Listen to that warning, and share it with your friends.

Why RFK Jr.’s Former Running Mate OPPOSES Casey Means for Surgeon General

President Trump’s nomination of Dr. Casey Means for Surgeon General had many MAHA fans cheering. But RFK Jr.’s former running mate, BlazeTV host Nicole Shanahan, has major reservations. She joins Glenn, who has been a fan of Casey, to explain why she believes there are stronger candidates. Means, Shanahan claims, may have “conflicts of interest” because of the “biometric harvesting company” she founded and its close ties to Silicon Valley. Shanahan also questions whether RFK Jr. is playing “political 4D chess,” or if she was lied to when she was promised that the Means siblings wouldn’t be in government. Is RFK Jr. reporting to someone other than Trump? Shanahan explains why she believes it’s possible.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: Nicole Shanahan. Nicole, how are you?

NICOLE: Glenn, how are you doing?

GLENN: I am very good. It's great to have you here.

So I want to ask you, the Surgeon General thing, are you for Casey Means? Or not for Casey Means?

NICOLE: Well, I will tell you who I am for, Glenn.

GLENN: Okay.

NICOLE: I'm for all of those Americans. Those hundreds of thousands of doctors, seeking truth, honesty, and dignity in our medical system once again. That is what I'm for. That is what propels MAHA into existence.

That's what propels Bobby Kennedy into the position of running for president of the United States. That's why I joined the campaign. It really is about listening to this group of doctors that did the right thing during the COVID pandemic.

That spoke up, when it was dangerous to speak up.

That lost their licenses. And so when I hear from that base, concern or research. About individuals, in and around MAHA.

I have to listen to them.

And I do listen to them.

Because oftentimes, they are right. They're brave, and they're principled. So the concern I've been hearing from that group of people is that MAHA -- you know, any movement. MAGA had this issue too of infiltration by different groups that are more self-serving, than they are for the movement itself.

GLENN: Uh-huh.

NICOLE: And so just one example, Casey Means is a founder of a company that does biometric harvesting. She's very close with many of the big data biometric harvesting companies.

In Silicon Valley. And this -- I noticed with all these people. You do not want them running in a government position that is responsible for everybody equally. Right?

GLENN: So wait. Wait. Wait.

What is -- what is that?

They're harvesting, what?

NICOLE: Well, so biometric data is anything between heart rate data, to all of the data that is collected from your FitBit or high glucose monitor. It could be labs. It could be -- then there's all the DNA harvesting. And big data that's being done.

So, you know, I think that the base -- MAHA really came from medical freedom. And medical sovereignty.

And the idea that we have to keep conflicts of interests. Out of the government.

And so when I -- you know, see some stuff going on. That we could be doing better.

Right?

Our job.

And I learned this from the MAGA base.

Our job is to ton seek the best possible people. For government, that are truly putting the principles of this country first.

The principles of American sovereignty first.

GLENN: So you wrote yesterday.

It's very strange. It doesn't make any sense. I was promised that if I supported RFK Jr. in the Senate confirmation, that neither of these siblings would be working under HHS or an appointment.

And that people much more qualified would be. I don't know -- I'm sorry.

RFK very clearly lied to me. Or what's going on. It's been clear in recent conversations that he's reporting to someone regularly, who is controlling his decisions, and it isn't President Trump.

With regards to the siblings, there is something very artificial and aggressive about them. Almost as if they were bred and raised as Manchurian assets. Wow!

NICOLE: So keep in mind, I was responding to Dr. Suzanne Humphries.

Who was also expressing very similar sentiment.

GLENN: Concern. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

NICOLE: Concern. There's better candidates.

So what's going on? I also heard from other MDs in the field.

That there was another doctor that RFK had wanted for the position. Very, very qualified doctor.

And -- and, you know, he was caught by surprise as well. By -- by this other choice.

So, you know, there's -- again, they -- they don't call it the swamp for no reason. Right?

GLENN: Right.

NICOLE: And, you know, I'm not officially within the administration at all.

In fact, I decided to take the path of staying an independent --

GLENN: Smart.

NICOLE: -- media person. Which I think -- I think and you know this, Glenn. It's really important that when you are an independent media voice, that you -- you stick by your principles. And that you are not just a mouthpiece for any government organizations.

That you're really on the outside, reflecting back the hopes and wishes of the constituents.

GLENN: Yeah. There's -- it's very hard to do.

I mean, I take stances against the president.

And for the president. You always have to -- you always have to balance, you know, I have my opinion.

And I'm never going to be bought out by anybody.

I'm never. But you also want to make sure that you're being fair to the people that you trust. And I know you have trusted RFK for a very, very long time.

And for what struck me on this. Is, you know, I don't know if RFK lied to me. Which I hope he didn't, or what's going on. It's been clear in recent conversation that he is reporting to someone regularly, who is controlling his decisions.

That's a remarkable thing to say, especially about RFK.

Because he does not strike me as somebody who is afraid of somebody else.

NICOLE: You know, I don't know if it's fear or that he's playing political 4D chess. And, again, they don't call it the swamp for no reason.

It's just, at some point, there's certain decisions, that are worth fighting for.

And I do appreciate what a very complex political environment this is.

GLENN: Oh, yeah.

NICOLE: And I do understand that even within these agencies, there are groups that are intentionally keeping and withholding information from the new leadership.

So, you know, I -- I fully appreciate how complicated it is.

So I fully appreciate how complicated it all is, but there are definitely things that the base is -- is, you know, like, this is an easy one. This could have gone better. Right?

You don't truly -- and, you know, everyone is guessing what precisely this 4D chess is all about. And why these moves are being made. And trying to anticipate the next one.

But it's something that I think that, you know, there's just certain things that indicate that whomever he's giving -- whoever his chess coach is. Could be making some better decisions for him. And --

GLENN: But Casey.

I mean, when I talk to the twins, during -- or after COVID.

They seemed pretty clear on what was bad and what was good.

They -- they both seemed to be good on -- on COVID. And the vaccines. Didn't they?

Or is my memory --

JEFFY: They talk a great talk.

I will say, I was once a fan of it as well.

It was only after I received many comments from individuals, in and around the transition team.

As well as new research that came up.

And then really, like, you know, when the base expresses these things and provides that degree of inquiry, and it shows that kind of concern.

I think we owe it to them.

GLENN: Yes. I agree. I agree.

ANNA: Yeah.

GLENN: So overall, how do you feel things are going?

NICOLE: I think, again, there's been a lot of focus around food dives. Meanwhile, there's millions of people suffering from vaccine injuries, that still feel very neglected.

So I do think -- I do appreciate the executive order, regarding gain of function and limiting overseas research.

GLENN: And shutting down a dangerous -- and shutting down a very dangerous bio lab here.

NICOLE: Yes. And there are many of these bio labs that are kind of flying under the radar.

GLENN: Right.

NICOLE: So it's a big step in the right decisions sedition. I'm a huge Jay Bhattacharya fan. Probably one of his biggest.

I really am excited for him, as he built out his team.

I hope, he has a very, very strong team around him. In the next coming weeks. Because he's going need to it.

As far as HHS goes, you know, I would love to see Bobby bring in more of those doctors that have been around him for the last ten years, very regularly.

Because these are the individuals that, you know, I -- I trust these people with my life. They have sacrificed everything to do the right thing time and time again.

They are so deeply principled. They will never take a check over helping a patient out.

And they actually do have the answers. So I'm hoping to see more of those people around Bobby too.

GLENN: So I'm wondering because this is the way I feel about a couple of things with the FBI. And Intel.

That if I don't see some people in the next year or so, go to jail, or at least brought in for a fair and honest trial, you know. I don't want to just scoop people up. And just assume that they're guilty.

But build a good, strong case. Bring it to trial.

Have it a fair and honest trial. And let the chips fall where they may.

But if I don't see some prosecution, at least. I think I'm very upset at the G O.J.

Pam Bondi. Head of the FBI. Kash Patel. And I don't -- and I'm trusting them so far, that they are doing that.

Do you feel the same way at all, about -- you know, if you don't see some people who go to jail there, that clearly lied about the vaccines.

If they don't go to jail. You have -- you really haven't fixed anything.

You're just eating around the edges.

NICOLE: Yeah. Yeah. I think that really explains it. And this is why I think it's important to continue to voice those concerns, because they're only going to grow and mount.

And it really is the American people, that were sold this vision of accountability.

And as we want to see it. We have to see it. Anywhere. Several months into the administration now.

HHS, you know, lags behind the Oval Office in terms of getting going.

But they're -- people were seriously injured. There were many crimes committed against the American public.

Crimes committed against our bravest doctors. Crimes committed against children.

We need accountability.

We really, really need to see that.

Because, you know, there's -- there's a preciousness in this moment. We have to -- we have to deliver. This country deserves it.

GLENN: And, I mean, if we're -- if we can't correct the things that, for instance. Washington State. Just passed a law where if there is another pandemic, everybody seems to be, you know, claiming there's another one, right around the corner.

But if there is another pandemic, that they will have absolute control, over what you put into your body. And what you do. That's terrifying.

NICOLE: I do.

And those emergency orders, they will scrutinize them. They have revisions.

GLENN: Washington State just revised it to just codify it. Washington State just codified it. It's crazy.

NICOLE: Yeah. Yeah.

So I would like to see more focus around that, not Red Dye 40 and not Kellogg's.

I'm totally fine leaving Kellogg's alone, in favor of HHS spending. All of its energy. And all of its focus. And all of its leverage, making sure that we are actually properly ready for the next pandemic.

And not to cause the catastrophic harm, that was caused during COVID-19.

GLENN: Nicole Shanahan. She's got the podcast Back To the People. And it's now coming to Blaze Media.

It's the same podcast she's been doing. Now as she says, with a wider reach. Glad to have you.

Nicole, thank you very much.

NICOLE: Thanks, it's a pleasure to come on.

GLENN: We'll talk to you again.

Is America’s Grid a Ticking Time Bomb? Trump’s Energy Secretary REACTS | Glenn TV | Ep 430

President Trump is working hard to right the wrongs of the Biden administration. But did Biden harm our energy grid even more than we thought? While Glenn was on vacation in Italy, two other European countries — Spain and Portugal — suffered one of the biggest blackouts in their history. The mainstream media, as they always do, rushed to blame it on ANYTHING other than the countries’ heavy reliance on unreliable green energy. But Glenn has the receipts and the evidence that leftists tried to make America’s grid just as unreliable. Glenn speaks with Energy Secretary Chris Wright about how the Trump administration is reversing these dangerous policies. Secretary Wright also discusses his department’s discovery that Biden shoveled out $93 BILLION in energy loans after Kamala Harris lost the 2024 election and before Trump could take office. Plus, he comments on Trump’s plans to deal with OPEC, why Trump must refill the Strategic Petroleum Reserve, and why Trump is planning the biggest energy project in American history to help accommodate AI. But first, Glenn recaps the biggest media lies that he missed while on vacation. Topping the list: Are these elitists like Axios and Jen Psaki finally admitting that they lied about Biden’s cognitive decline, or do they STILL not get that their charade is over?

THE GLENN BECK PODCAST

Is the New American Pope Catholic? | Bishop Strickland | The Glenn Beck Podcast | Ep 256

A new pope has been chosen! As the recording of this episode of "The Glenn Beck Podcast" began, white smoke emerged from the Sistine Chapel, signaling the selection of the first American pope. Glenn and Bishop Joseph Strickland react live to the news as the whole world wonders if Cardinal Robert Francis Prevost, now Pope Leo XIV, will continue in the ways of his predecessor Pope Francis or go a more traditional route. Bishop Strickland, who was removed from office by Pope Francis, says the former pope pushed a church “in the world and of the world” and reviews “duplicity,” “corruption,” and potential abuse overlooked by the Vatican, including the infamous McCarrick scandal. The pair discuss the resurgence of the Latin Mass, globalism, the Catholic Church’s approach to homosexuality and gender identity, and whether the Shroud of Turin is an “icon” or a “relic.” As the new pope greets the world, Glenn asks, “If we have a more progressive pope, does that set the Church back?” Bishop Strickland advises that “even if we are disappointed and dismayed,” we must pray and keep our focus on God.

Meta’s AI “Friends” Nightmare: How Zuckerberg’s Latest Move Could Enslave Your Mind

Meta and Facebook’s Mark Zuckerberg has a new goal: to give lonely Americans AI “friends.” But Glenn sounds the alarm: this must NEVER happen! Glenn explains the hidden danger in Zuckerberg’s seemingly kindhearted plan: “AI cannot, must not, and will never be your friend.” Opening that door will only give Meta insane levels of potential for manipulation and control over you.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: Let's start with this: Mark Zuckerberg. Good guy. I mean, he brought us Facebook.

And, you know, that is the thing that brought all of us together.

Brought out families together. All the people that we lost touch with.

Oh, the world is so much better now that we have Facebook.

So now, he's got another idea. Could we play the clip of Mark Zuckerberg?

VOICE: There's a stat that I honestly think is crazy. The average American has I think it's fewer than three friends. Three people they consider friends. And the average person has demand for meaningfully more. I think it's 15 friends or something.

I guess there's probably at some point, I'm too busy. I can't deal with more people. But the average person wants more connectivity, connection than they have. So, you know, there's a lot of questions that people ask.

Of stuff like, okay. Is this going to replace kind of in person connections or real life connections?

And my default is that the answer to that is probably no.

I think it -- it -- I think that there are all these things that are better kind of about physical connections, when you can have them.

But the reality is that people just don't have the connection when they feel more alone, a lot of the time, than they would like.

GLENN: Hmm. True.

Now, let me ask you. Is there a time when you don't remember feeling so isolated? When you didn't really feel like I don't have any real friends?

When you didn't -- you had real connections with people, instead of a million connections with people that are your friends, but not really your friends?

Can you think of a time, way back in history?

I mean, probably have to go back to the cavemen, to find a time.

Oh. Before Facebook, and social media!

When we weren't all killing ourself, because we have no meaning.

Now, from the people who brought you kill yourself, because you've been on Facebook too much.

Brings you new AI friends. Oh, this is going to be good.

By the way, you know, that's a crazy stat, I think the average American has, what? Three friends. And they have a capacity for, I don't know. Fifteen or 20. I don't know.

Really think about it right now.

How many true friends, do you have?

How many true friends?

People that when you are down and out, there is nothing -- the whole world is against you!

That that person will actually stand by your side. And go, yeah.

I'm their friend.

And I don't care what you say.

How many? How many do you have?

I think I would count myself lucky if I have three.

Now, I have a lot of consequences.

I have a lot of people who we all think are friends. But as a recovering alcoholic, I've been there.

I've done that. As a recovering alcoholic,
who then also is a conservative and spoke out about the Obama administration, I know who my friends are.
I know who my friends are not.

And I think there's a lot of people that have counterfeit friends.

If you've got. Oh, I've got ten or 15 friends.

Eh.

No, you don't. No, you don't.

I've always grown up thinking, you're lucky, you're lucky, to have three, five, really good friends.

That will walk through anything with you. Do you agree with that, Stu?

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: You've never been there.

STU: For you? Oh, God no. But I'm just saying, generally speaking. No. I think -- I mean, you're describing a great friend. You're describing a really --

GLENN: A real friend.

STU: Yeah. Like someone you know and stick around for multiple decades.

GLENN: Yeah, I have lots of friends. You know what I mean? I have millions of Facebook friends.

STU: Right. Those aren't real.

GLENN: Right. And I have lots of friends. But the ones that are there for you always, no matter what, I have family.

And I have family.

STU: Right.

GLENN: And I have a handful of friends. I would consider you one of those.

STU: Thank you. I would as well.

GLENN: Why?

Remember, I have a drinking problem.

STU: Yeah. A lot of brain cells killed to make that decision.

But I think that you -- yes. I think the only thing that I think I'm drilling down a little bit on to try to understand. When you say, well, I have a lot of friends.

In a way, I think that's what Zuckerberg is talking about.

It's not even necessarily a great friend that you have for multiple decades. And can count on at any time.

Just the mid-level consequences, are drying up for a lot of people.

GLENN: Yeah. And why is that?

Why is that?

Because we don't talk to each other anymore.

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: Because of social media.

You know, when this generation says, I don't know.

I just think it's weird. I'm just now in a bar someplace.

And some stranger comes up to me and wants to strike up a conversation. I'm like, hello, weirdo. I don't know!

You think it's less weird to go online?
When people can fake everything!

Thank you, Mark Zuckerberg.

But no thanks. Okay.

STU: And they're just -- to build up on this point for one second.

There's a study that came out, the last 20 years, of how much time do you spend socializing with the people.

Again, that's not with your best friends.

This is just socializing with anyone, a human.

Every single group. Every single group has massive drops.

GLENN: Massive.

STU: Massive drops. Just give you some examples.

Ages. Fifteen to 24-year-olds. Thirty-five-point down.

In 20 years. 35 percent. So a typical 15-year-old, as compared to what they are, in 2003 and 2025, where were the two measurement years?

They're spending 35 percent less time, with other human beings.

GLENN: Okay. Hang on just a second. Can you please stop distracting me? Because I'm trying to figure out why our kids are killing themselves.

STU: No, it's really hard.

GLENN: It's very hard to figure out.

STU: To understand.

And this is the coup de grâce of this entire study, which is, the typical female pet owner spends more time actively engaged with her pet, than she spends face-to-face contact with her friends of her own species.

GLENN: Uh-huh.

STU: That is unbelievable -- not like you're in the same house as your cat.

Right? No. More face-to-face time with your cat!

GLENN: And I've got news for you. If you think your cat is your friend, wait until you die, and your cat is trapped in the house with you and you have no friends to check. They will eat your face.

STU: They will still have a use for you.

GLENN: Yeah. They will have a use foy.

STU: Not the other way around.

GLENN: Okay. Here's why I'm bringing this up today.

This is a lie, that is going to be sold to you, like crazy. And it's going to be wrapped in a beautiful, shiny package. And it's going to have from Mark Zuckerberg and others like him, on the tag.

They want you to believe, that AI and bots can be your friends.