RADIOMarch 19, 2018

‘Passion of the Christ’ actor Jim Caviezel shares why God works through his films

For someone who played the lead in the greatest story of all time, Jim Caviezel seems like a pretty humble guy.

The Catholic actor, who is slated to play Jesus again in a sequel to Mel Gibson’s “The Passion of the Christ,” joined Glenn in the studio today to talk about what it’s like to be a believer in Hollywood and how he wants to continue to give his career over to God.

Author reveals the one alarming stat that shows US Christians are in trouble

“It was always God through me that would make these films great,” Caviezel said. He added that his goal was always that “I don’t want them to see me; I want them only to see You [God].”

Caviezel is making headlines with another biblical role; he portrays the disciple Luke in his latest film, “Paul, Apostle of Christ,” which is coming to theaters this weekend.

On today’s show, he talked about the contrast between the value his faith gives to his life and the emptiness of Hollywood celebrity on its own.

“People will give up everything for a red carpet,” he said.

This article provided courtesy of TheBlaze.

GLENN: Jim Caviezel is in studio with us. A good man and a friend. We grew up, kind of together. I mean, we went to the same elementary school. And you were, what? Two years behind me, Jim?

JIM: I was -- I was in third grade when you were in eighth grade. But I saw you for a second in third grade.

GLENN: And you remember it.

JIM: I remembered you in the wide-legged corduroy pants.

GLENN: Yep. That was me.

JIM: Was it Robert Conine? Rose Krantz. Peter Janakey.

GLENN: Yeah. Oh, my gosh.

JIM: And we rode the bus -- the school bus together. I remember you -- I remember you jumping up and down, up on Peter Janakey's shoulders. I remember Sister Agnes Joseph coming to our class and said she just saw you debate the entire class. Michael Rosencrantz told me that that boy is a genius. And she was saying -- and Janakey was pretty genius too.

GLENN: Yeah, well, none of those stories were true. Yeah, none of those stories were true.

So how are you?

JIM: I'm good.

GLENN: Yeah. Now, you're in a new film called Paul: Apostle of Christ. I haven't seen it yet. When does it come out?

JIM: March 23rd.

GLENN: Last time I saw you, you had -- you were still reeling from, you know, the -- not temptation of Christ. But the --

JIM: Passion of Christ.

GLENN: Passion of Christ. And you were still reeling from that. And I think you are one of the bravest men I think I've ever met. One of the most loyal men to God that I've ever met.

And I think -- wrongfully persecuted for what you've -- what you've done. The standards that you've taken. You've been very careful and very true.

When you were in school, when we were there together, you made a promise to God. Can you talk about that?

JIM: I was given a gift. And I -- I think it's very difficult for God to give certain people gifts. Because once they get the opportunity, it starts out being, here, God, I'll give you all that. And it becomes, you know, nine for you, one for me, and then it eventually becomes nine for me, one for you.

So I just said that I would make the kind of films that would, you know, affect people's lives. Like, you know, It's a Wonderful Life. When I met Jimmy Stewart, I was a waiter for him. And I went and got him a drink. And I was working at a party. And they told me that I couldn't speak to any of the celebrities. And I saw that guy and I said, well, I could get fired for talking to him. So at the time, I had applied to the US Naval Academy. I applied three different times and didn't get in. And I had a shot at West Point. And I told him, you know, I know that you flew the liberators over Germany. And he was just shocked that I knew. Here I am 19 years old, 20 years old, and I knew so much about him.

GLENN: Uh-huh.

JIM: And I think that -- Clooney told me one time, George said that when they were at -- he was with Rosemary, his aunt, and they were at Stewart's house. And on the TV was his academy award, and Stewart said, you know, I wish I had done more.

And here's a guy that made arguably one of the greatest films ever made. I watch it every year. It's a Wonderful Life. I want to have that kind of affect on people. But it was always God through me that would make these films great.

GLENN: Is it true that you said, I want to play you?

JIM: No, I said, I don't want them to see me. I want them to only see you. And that became the difference. And to do that was on the cross, I felt the love that he had for me. But when I asked him to come closer than that, he said, you may not like what you're going to get. And I said, as long as they see you, that's all that matters. And what I felt was a broken heart because our Lord is not loved by most of our children. And, you know, I tell people, I know God loves you. And if you don't know that, then, you know, kind of live the life that makes people feel that. But those that say that -- that have accepted that, you know, just get up in the morning and tell Jesus that you love him. He needs to hear that too.

GLENN: You are -- you would have gotten along with Hollywood a long time ago. With the Jimmy Stewarts of the world. I think they were more like you.

JIM: Right.

GLENN: Now not so much. Now not so much. And yet you are consistently amazing in every role I have ever seen you in. You are just tremendous.

JIM: Glenn, I've this said before. Hollywood, at best -- you know, if that really is the world, at best, it can only like you. Because the love -- it does not come from man. It comes from God. So at best, Hollywood can like you. And I can prove it to you, when you go to the Academy Awards. Former winners are on the sideline. It's over the current winner. And you look at some of the films. And the substance that's coming out. And they're making all over that. People will give up everything for a red carpet. But the question you have to ask yourself is, do you want to be liked by many or loved by one?

GLENN: I have a friend, John Irwin, from the Irwin Brothers. And they just made a film. What was the name of it? Yeah. I Can Only Imagine.

It came out this weekend. It's supposed to make $2 million. It's a faith film. It's really good. It has Dennis Quaid in it. Supposed to make $2 million. It made $17 million. It's only in 1600 theaters. It's number three this weekend.

JIM: Yeah, that means the per screen average was more than the two films prior -- that are ahead of them. That's over $10,000 a screen.

GLENN: Yeah.

JIM: That's extraordinary.

GLENN: Yeah. And you're not reading about it anywhere.

JIM: No, you won't.

GLENN: Yeah, but since you were in Passion, things have changed. You don't need Hollywood as much as you did.

JIM: The system -- you know, the -- the truth is out there. And it's not going to go away. And, you know, the -- the --

GLENN: The Irwin brothers?

JIM: Yeah. He came up -- I don't know which one.

GLENN: John probably.

JIM: He did the Steve McQueen documentary. Did you see that? American Icon.

GLENN: Yeah. Yeah.

JIM: He handed it to me when I walked out. And I went home and watched it. And here, we can arguably say that Steve McQueen was one of the greats. Physical actor. A guy who was absolutely the king of cool. But what was cool about him, he was hot about something. He was an orphan kid essentially. And I watched this documentary, and it just moved me to tears. Even at the end, he was searching for something greater. And he said there was a recording of him that his wife had gave out. And he said he wished he had touched more people's lives from Jesus. Billy Graham was there at the end of his life.

And he -- he was looking for his Bible, as he was dying. And Billy Graham gave him his Bible, who was a great that just passed away.

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: And without Billy Graham, we would not have had the reaction from America. We needed his support, and he gave it to us on the Passion of the Christ.

GLENN: What do you think about the division between our faith sometimes? You know, between, you know, the Baptists and the Catholics and the Mormons and the Protestants and everything else. What do you -- how do we solve that and come together on bigger issues?

JIM: Well, it's certainly not going to be beating you over the head. I mean, if God wanted to, he certainly could beat us over the head.

GLENN: Yeah. Isn't he though?

JIM: What?

GLENN: Beating us over the head. I think he is starting to beat us over the head.

JIM: Well, it eventually can come to that. But right now -- I mean, there is a wrath and a justice that is coming if we don't essentially -- look, I really feel that the ideal way would be love that we would just naturally turn to him. And I got that at a young age.

But the -- we have an opportunity right now, to decide where we want to go. As far as, you know, our feeling, I do believe there is one truth. And we'll know that one day in heaven. If there were many truths, there would not be a truth. And there would be much divisions in heaven.

What there is probably the right way. But I look at Jesus and he did not beat people over the head with either turn or burn. Now, that is out there.

GLENN: Uh-huh.

JIM: But it's -- what I find is that you have the truth. Years ago, that would all -- it would be given to us, just truth. And essentially, that would become fire and brimstone. And now it's all grace. You know, all love and forgiveness and everything. But then that becomes sentimental hogwash. Our Lord is both truth and grace.

GLENN: Are you happy?

JIM: Yes. When I came in here, I was a little frustrated.

(laughter)

But generally, yes. Because I know that I'm -- you know, I -- I have the future forever with Jesus, you know, in heaven. And I tell people that. You know, I do believe it. And I do believe it's worth dying for. And I know I'm going to die someday. And I -- I tell people that because, you know, I tell people, yes, our Lord loves you. But I don't always feel that. It is hard. But, you know, come hell or high water, you do the right thing, no matter what.

You just try to keep doing it.

STU: Yeah. I want to talk to you a little bit about that. Because doing the right thing is really hard. And you're a guy who has actually walked that walk. You've really walked that walk.

JIM: You know Marcus Luttrell. That was the last event we were at. Marcus reached out to me because I put in a movie, The Count of Monte Cristo, "God Will Give Me Justice." And he wrote that on the cave wall.

GLENN: Yeah.

JIM: And he became close. And I was -- the last time I was with him, I was with him and Chris Kyle. And I never saw him again. Obviously, that night, we went out -- a great night. And he wanted to just talk about that. But how many soldiers that come up to me in the airports and, you know, Special Forces, guys just ask me about Jesus. They say, do you really believe in that? Because I heard you suffer. I heard you were struck by lightning. And had open heart surgery. That you went through horrible pains. Do you really believe in that stuff?

And why are they asking me that? And then eventually, they talk about, you know, I've had to take somebody's life, by my own hand.

GLENN: Yeah. Yeah. And what that's like. And is there a place in heaven for me? You know, almost like daring God. It reminds me of Gary Sinise in Forrest Gump when he's up at the top of the tower. He says, all right. God. You and me. And I just love to -- I identify with them.

GLENN: Yeah. Yeah.

JIM: That there are people out there that will suffer whatever it takes because they feel a brotherhood. And I feel that brotherhood with our Lord. And I want to let them know that they're loved.

GLENN: Back with Jim Caviezel here in just a second. He's got a new movie out, called Paul: Apostle of Christ. It is in theaters Friday, the 23rd. That's this Friday. You can find out more about it at Paulmovie.com. Twitter handle @Paulmovie.

Jim Caviezel, when we return.

GLENN: Jim Caviezel. You might know him from many -- many movies that he has been in. Most famously, obviously, he played Jesus in Passion of the Christ. But also Person of Interest. The People's Choice Award. And -- and now in a new movie, called Paul: Apostle of Christ. And you play Luke.

JIM: I do.

GLENN: Tell me about it.

JIM: Well, the film is right at the end of Paul's life, like the last two weeks. And he's in the Mamertine Prison in Rome. And this is during the -- one of the biggest terror reigns of Christians, which was during Nero. And I basically get into the prison. And I try to bring his message of hope to the Christian communities that are barely alive in that area. And, of course, they're crucifying and burning them. Using them as light fixtures all over Rome. And I'm trying to give this message of hope. And he really doesn't have the message that they're looking for. They don't know what to do.

And so really what the film -- when I read it, I said, this is now -- this is just -- we're all playing characters in Scripture right now. You know, often people, when they look at the Bible, they say, well, it's a piece of history.

It's not the same as if you were to go back -- you know, we were just talking about Berlin, Germany.

And that's a history, you try to learn from history.

But this is something quite extraordinary, when you read Scripture, because it -- it goes -- it permeates your brain, into your heart. And bypasses it, and goes into that. And it's really -- and we're all playing a different character, you know. I got to play Jesus in the Passion. But some of us get to play Judas. And some play the Pharisees, and some are Herod. And that's playing out now.

GLENN: The Pharisees, the real problem there was the hypocrisy. And there are a lot of us, are Pharisees right now.

JIM: Yes. And there are Judases out there too.

GLENN: You've -- you've -- you've taken quite a hit your whole career. What gets you through -- what do you -- I mean, your low points -- you know, you've had -- you are a great actor. And because of what you believe, they -- you're not -- you're not asked to be in all of the great films.

JIM: Uh-huh.

GLENN: How do you get through that?

JIM: I get through it because I was in the greatest film there ever was.

You know, look, the -- I -- I almost never became an actor. I almost never did The Passion of the Christ. I almost never married my wife Kerri. I almost never adopted my three children. All three of them had -- two had tumors. One had the cancer, sarcoma.

And I thought, well, I'm not the kind of guy that can adopt. You know, I'm just not -- I'm too selfish. That would have been the worst mistake of my life, if I had not done those things. The path of Christ is hard.

It is the road less traveled. It is --

GLENN: Yeah.

JIM: It is. But it is one that is beyond -- anything I've ever experienced. And I know it's the way for me. I know -- yeah, sure, I've pouted and played the victim. But I realize that, yeah, it's not really going to get it done.

Victim is not a strong position.

GLENN: Jim Caviezel. The name of the movie is Paul: Apostle of Christ. It is in theaters this Friday. Don't miss it.

GLENN: Welcome to the program. We're glad you're here. Jim Caviezel is here. And Pat Gray has just joined us from the Pat Gray Radio Roundup or whatever it is --

PAT: That's exactly what it is. Pat Gray Radio Roundup.

GLENN: Whatever it's called, it happens after this program. Pat, Jim Caviezel. Jim, Pat.

PAT: Jim, we've met actually before.

GLENN: Yeah. I know. I know. I just wanted to make sure of that. I was being a gracious host here.

PAT: Yeah. That's nice. That's nice. Good to see you again.

JIM: Good to see you.

GLENN: So, Jim, have you been down to Waco? You know Chip and Joanna Gaines?

JIM: No, I don't.

GLENN: Do you know of them?

JIM: No, I don't.

GLENN: Oh, you're kidding me. They're great. Do you watch TV at all or do you --

JIM: I watch a little bit here and there. Obviously, just doing a lot of the scripts --

GLENN: Yeah. I know. I know.

But I was down at Waco.

PAT: This weekend?

GLENN: That place --

PAT: It's amazing.

GLENN: -- has totally transformed. These people are -- they're so good. And -- and people are flocking from all over the country.

PAT: And they've completely repositioned Waco, Texas. Because Waco was, what? It was Branch Davidian. It was wacko Waco. And now they're transformed it into this desirable place to go.

GLENN: Yeah. And it's really -- it's amazing. Because here they are. They're people pretty much like you that just kind of live their principles. And they're not ashamed of their faith. And they do this little show on HGTV. And it's turned into this monster. And I don't think people in the -- I don't think people in New York or Los Angeles even understand it. They think, well, it's a husband and a wife. No, it's their principles and their values that really set them apart. And they just -- there was probably $100,000 down there.

PAT: I bet. It's always jam-packed.

GLENN: It's crazy. Yeah. And they're not even there. It's crazy what they've done.

PAT: Yeah, yeah, but everybody there is hoping for a glimpse. You know, maybe this is the day they'll be running out.

GLENN: No.

PAT: I don't know. Straighten the shelves.

(laughter)

GLENN: Yeah. Straighten things up.

So Jim is here because he's in a new movie, Paul: Apostle of Christ. And, Jim, I love the story of Paul. But the thing that sticks in my mind, in Paul's life -- well, there's many things. But -- but when he's on the wrong side, you know, the -- the death of James, he's -- he's mentioned just -- give me your coat. Kill him.

JIM: Oh, Stephen.

GLENN: Or, Stephen. Yeah, thank you.

He's standing there, and he's listening to Stephen. And he's helping riling up the crowd. And he doesn't do any of the beating himself. Beating to death. He just says, give me your cloak. I'll hold it for you.

JIM: Yeah, essentially. Probably taken their coats and handed them stones, and have at him.

GLENN: Yeah. And just -- just -- I mean, it's real evil manipulation.

JIM: Yeah.

GLENN: Where he was the guy kind of behind the crowd.

JIM: Yeah. I think that when Stephen called out, you know, I see the Son of Man, repeating the words of Jesus, I see the son of man sitting at the right hand of the father, coming in the clouds of heaven, that reflection in his eyes, he probably saw our Lord right there and probably was the beginning of the end of Saul.

GLENN: How difficult would it be for you if you knew that Saul was coming your way and -- and you were told, you know, Jim, I need you to go give him a blessing real quick?

How difficult would that have been for you? I think that would have been terrifying.

JIM: Well, of course. But I look at just some of the videos and pictures that I saw from what ISIS did to Christians last year, during Good Friday, where they literally executed them by crucifixion.

And I -- I think the modern day Christians really have to understand that, you know, we're all going to die some day. And, you know, being in heaven, I want to -- I'd rather be known as someone who did something for Jesus than spending eternity without doing much for him.

GLENN: You spend any time in the Middle East recently?

JIM: Yes. I had to shoot a movie out there. The Stoning of Soraya. And that really exposed Sharia law. And it -- it is just extraordinary what happens to women there.

GLENN: Yeah.

JIM: And I played a guy named Fredom Seronjom (phonetic), who was a guy who was just out there to write a story about the ayatollah takeover of the Shah. It was a peaceful movement and what not. And out of this comes this woman's story of being stoned to death. And the stonings still take place. So it was -- I don't feel like we have a lot of help from many of the groups here, you know, many of the women's groups that weren't there to help --

GLENN: I will tell you that it's been encouraging to us. We've raised probably $30 million now.

JIM: Yeah.

GLENN: To get some of these Christians out. We've taken 7,000 out of the Middle East. We're rescuing slaves --

JIM: That's great. Yeah.

GLENN: And it's remarkable that there is a -- while it's not talked about, there is this -- this, I don't know, underground, would you call it, Pat? Kind of this -- something that's not on the surface. And nobody is talking about. But there is real concern for that. And real -- the people really helping.

JIM: Good. A lot of people are helping. But they're doing it in -- in the -- in quiet ways, working in -- like you say, the underground.

GLENN: Yeah. The Christians are unlike everything I've ever met.

JIM: Chaldeans, Syrians, extraordinary.

GLENN: They're not like anything I've ever met.

PAT: They're committed. They have to be. And they are.

GLENN: You know what, I read a quote this weekend. I had written down a long time ago. And I had forgotten all about it. They tend church. Not attend church. You know, they're tending every day. They are there. They know what it is. It's not just a place they go to every Sunday.

JIM: Yeah.

PAT: And they take it seriously because it doesn't come easy for them, like it does us. You know, when you have to fight for something and put your life on the line for something, I think that changes you inside a little bit. It makes you more -- it makes you more committed. And they definitely are.

GLENN: Yeah. And we get so fat and lazy over here on everything. That we don't know -- it has no value. It has no value.

JIM: There's a great line in the film where Paul says, to live is Christ, to die is gain. You know, I'm sure many of those Chaldeans, Syrian Christians, and Coptics, believe in the same way.

GLENN: Yeah.

PAT: It true on another topic that there's a passion of the Christ sequel coming?

JIM: Yes.

PAT: And you're signed on for that?

JIM: Yes.

GLENN: As Jesus?

JIM: Yes.

GLENN: Wow.

PAT: Well, he'd have to be.

GLENN: I don't know. It's the next day --

PAT: Now I've turned into John. So surprise!

GLENN: I mean, you don't really look that different. You work out and all that crap all the time?

JIM: Yeah.

GLENN: Yeah. Yeah. It's overrated.

JIM: Fortunately -- well, I have to because so much of the work that you do involves stunt. So if you don't keep that up, you're going --

GLENN: Especially on that. I mean, on that one -- that one was pretty serious. Struck by lightning.

JIM: Yeah. Last shot of the movie. Very last shot.

GLENN: What went through your -- I mean, besides Jews. What went through on that?

JIM: I was -- I was scared. You know, just -- but it wasn't my time. You know, it was -- I had physical problems, you know, with electrical heart and everything like that after that. And I was on a lot of medication. So in 2009, I had my first heart surgery. And then 2014 --

PAT: Wow.

JIM: -- was open heart. They in the clinic saved my life.

PAT: And it was because of that?

JIM: Yes. It was a combination of the lightning bolt and then -- and then the -- the hypothermia and then the -- the -- the pneumonia.

GLENN: Have you thought about suing Mel? Just taking him for everything he's worth?

PAT: He's worth a few bucks now. You might want to think about that.

GLENN: He's a really nice guy. You know, I don't know him at all. In meeting him, he's really quite brilliant.

JIM: Oh, yeah. He's a freak show.

GLENN: Going about 1,000 miles an hour.

JIM: He would be the Michael Jordan in my business of what he can do. You know, he has the -- it's extraordinary with him because, you know -- you've seen him in Hamlet. He can do Hamlet. He can do his range. His humor.

But just -- you know, even looking at Lethal Weapon, when Steve McEveety produced the Passion, produced the lethal weapon with Mel. You know, the opening of the movie, he takes a gun. He's going to put it in his mouth. And he uses a bullet. And he's going to commit suicide. And just how he layers and takes the -- if you have an onion, just peels it away. And later on, he's up on the top of the building. This guy is going to commit suicide. He's smoking his cigarette up on the building. He said, come on, man, it's not good to commit suicide. It's really bad for your health. You know, and you're laughing your head off. Because you know this guy just takes his -- but how he sets it up. And he gets you focused over here. He's smoking a cigarette. Here, you want a drag. And then he throws up another ball up in the air. And while you're looking over here, sleight of hand, he puts the cuffs on the guy's wrist. And then he's like, oh, you jerk, I'm going to jump. He goes, do you really want to do it? Do it? You know, I want to do it. So you go, no. The movie is over. Jumps off. And, of course, they don't show it. But then they jump on that big old bag. This guy is nuts.

Mel goes, oh, that's fun. Let's do it again. But that's just -- I mean, that's flatout, straight-up Gibson.

GLENN: When do you go into production for this?

JIM: I heard -- when I was speaking to him last time, he says, I'd like to be going. And he gave me a certain date, by that particular time.

GLENN: You're not going to give it to us. I'm not looking for a scoop.

JIM: Yeah. But, no, he just said, I would like to be going at this particular time. This is the one, two, three -- he's on the fourth draft of the shift. So I started talking to him about this five years ago. Nothing was mentioned. Then last year, both Randall Wallace -- they wrote Braveheart together. And just to show you how hard it is, that blueprint is everything. And now he's on the fourth draft of this thing. So he finally broke it. That's why -- I had never said anything about it. But he finally figured everything out. It's kind of like Thomas Edison gets to the end. You go through the alphabet. So by way of analogy, he starts at A and gets to Z. And then he goes, oh, my gosh. I figured it out. But now he has to go back to A and start all over again. But he finally figured it out.

GLENN: Yeah. Jim, good to see you. Thank you so much. The movie opens up this Friday. It is Paul: Apostle of Christ, starring Jim Caviezel. You don't want to miss it. It's opening in theaters everywhere. It's Paulmovie.com.

RADIO

“He was one of ours, and he was taken”: Megyn Kelly remembers Charlie Kirk

Glenn Beck and Megyn Kelly remember their friend, TPUSA founder Charlie Kirk, a day after he was assassinated at Utah Valley University. They also discuss the manhunt for the killer.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: Yesterday was such a surreal day. I was getting to record my special last night. It was in the afternoon. And I'm sitting here in my studio, and I look at the stairs through this glass door that I have here. And my wife is on the phone, and she's standing in the stairway.

And she has her, her hand gripping the stair rail. And I could see it in her eyes, she was on the phone. And I could see confusion, and I could see trouble.

And in my ear, I'm hearing, five, four, three -- and I said, "Stop. Stop. Stop. Stop. I need 30 seconds. I need to talk to my wife."

And I motioned for her to come in. And in a confused and dazed sort of way, she kind of stumbles into the room.

And I said, "What's happening, honey?"

And she said, "It's Cheyenne."

I didn't know what that meant. As a dad, you can imagine. I said, "Is she okay? What -- what's happening?"

She meant, it's Cheyenne on the phone.

Cheyenne had just gotten past the crush of the crowd. She called her mom. She said, "Charlie Kirk's just been shot."

"What?"

She sent me some video, and I knew it was true, but hoped for the best until a few minutes later somebody else sent me video that I hope you did not see, of the bullet striking him.

It must have been like what it was when you first saw the Zapruder film, or if you were standing in the Grassy Knoll. You just knew.

I was on with Megyn Kelly, and we were holding on to the hope that he was somehow or another going to survive that. And Megyn said at one point, I don't know why I'm not announcing what everybody else is announcing. But I just can't.

Megyn joins us now. Hi, Megyn.

MEGYN: Hi, Glenn.

GLENN: What a weird 24 hours it has been. Where are you this morning, in unraveling this knot in your head?

MEGYN: I still don't have my arms around it. I -- I don't feel like I've totally digested the fact that he's gone and the way in which he was taken. You know, Charlie truly was such a larger than life figure. We say that term. But it -- it was true about him. At six-five, he truly seemed larger than most of us. And he was, in his gifts, in his tirelessness. And just knowing exactly where the scene. Every story was.

And his raw courage. So many times. We like to think we're courageous in our commentary. You look at Charlie, and you think, now that's try courage. He -- he would just say it like it was.

The things you might be thinking in your head, but you might not want to say explicitly, he said. And he took a lot of slings and arrows for it and was demonized for being all the terrible things, as opposed to people taking him on and saying, "Does he have a point?"

GLENN: You know, I said earlier today, you don't kill the weak. People don't want to try to heal. They just want to speak in anger at times. And anger is part of the grieving process. And I know I'm angry.

But Charlie would face that anger. And what people think is weakness, by showing love and compassion and listening and just having a decent conversation, that's one of the reasons why he was killed. He wasn't -- he wasn't killed because he was weak. Just like Gandhi wasn't weak. He -- he -- he was killed because he was effective.

Megyn, where do we go from here?

She dropped. Can we get her back on the phone. I got an email from somebody today. This morning.

And I want to share the email. I won't share the name. It's short. But I -- I also think I should share the -- my response. Because I think it's how most of us feel.

It -- it comes from a very well-known conservative leader. Glenn, I am devastated this morning.

I am in deep mourning for Charlie. I am in mourning for his family and our country.

And I don't know how to surface from this. I don't know if I do either.

But I would like to share my thoughts with you, a little later on. Megyn is with me.

Megyn, how do we process this? How do we surface from this?

MEGYN: You know, I think as many lost -- we -- we all have to go through the denial and the bargaining. You know, I'm still refreshing my X account, like hoping somehow there's a reversal. You know, like somehow it was all wrong. Somehow we got it all wrong. You know, sometimes the media gets it wrong. It -- it's absurd. We know what the answer is.

But that's a natural reaction when you had a sudden loss in particular. And anger is completely appropriate now too. It's completely appropriate.

You know, we are going to catch this guy. You know, that FBI presser they just held which is very encouraging.

They -- and two things that happened this morning that are of note, Glenn. First, Steven Crowder who is very solid on his law enforcement leak reporting. He has -- he has a proven track history. He's the one that got the manifesto from the trans shooter in Nashville before anyone else. And that's not all.

He's had other leaks, posting a document saying he received from an ATF source on the investigation.

And that says that they retrieved the gun in the would see, behind the campus. Wrapped in a towel. And that there were three unspent cartridges in the gun. That had transgender and antifascist ideology. Something written on them.

Now, that piece of -- that last piece of it was not confirmed by the FBI at the presser they just held, but every other thing was.

The Crowder report was confirmed in every detail, including naming the kind of gun. He had that right. He had the location right. He had the trail and the tracking of the suspect right.

They did not volunteer the business about what was written on the cartridges, nor did anyone there ask. Because those reporters almost certainly don't follow Steven Crowder because those reporters will probably tell you, he's not to be trusted.

Now, this is an early report. And it could turn out to be wrong. But that's the update as far as we know it.

And the FBI revealing that they have a picture of him, that they did, of course, track him on his way to the shooting spot with surveillance cameras, of course, on these college campuses. We would expect that in dorms or class buildings.

And they appear confident. At least to me. That they've got the guy. And if they've got the weapon, Glenn. Well, they may or may not have fingerprints.

But they almost certainly have DNA. They almost certainly DNA, which I'm sure they're uploading right now, into every database, they can.

You know, within we saw -- they're not supposed to use the public databases. Sorry, private like 23andme or Ancestry.com. Though, in Culverter (phonetic), they did. And that is how they found Culverter. Sometimes they do.

And even just a public database of DNA. Can lead you at least to a family member somewhere near a shooter or suspect. And then it's just a matter of charts and a few hours in getting to that person's relative. So I believe they will find the shooter.

And then we'll know the ideology. And then we'll have a place to put some of the anger. Like, an explanation or something that will help us understand what deranged person. And I don't mean that in a clinical sense. Did this yesterday.

I just feel like, I don't know where to go, until I figure out who did this and why.

GLENN: It was about midnight last night, when I talked to the president.

And he was very clear, that we will find whoever is responsible for this. And justice will be served.

He was extraordinarily confident in that. Which gave me an awful lot of hope.

I don't know if you saw his speech last night, that he gave from the oval.

But I thought -- very powerful. Hit exactly the right tone.

Hit exactly the right tone.

But I think the days of us fooling around and nibbling at the edges. I think those days are over.

MEGYN: I agree. And one of the things that Trump said last night that was so good was, he used the word "terrorism." That's exactly right. You know, that's -- that is how a lot of us are feeling.

And I know you've had the same experience I've had in the last 24 hours, Glenn, where virtually everybody I know in the media business has reached out. I think there are a lot of folks who are in Arlene, in particular, in conservative media, who are very rattled by this because he was one of ours.

And he was taken. You know, he -- obviously, we all have concerns about personal security now with the shooter at loose. You know, at large as well. But I just mean that -- like the betrayal and the need to rise up and protect ours. And the people we value and love.

You know, this is like -- I don't want to say a call to arms. Because I'm not encouraging violence. But, I mean, a unifying call for us to stand shoulder to shoulder and stand up.

GLENN: Yeah. It is absolutely a wake-up call. To anybody who thought, you know, "Oh, it's just going to pass us by," it's not. This is -- this is the call of our age. And how we respond, is going to determine the future of freedom in this country. But I have great confidence that we will respond just as we did after 9/11.

We responded with conviction. We responded with an intelligence sort of way. We overreacted in some ways, that I would like to avoid this time.

But we came together as a nation, and did what had to be done.

For the preservation of our nation.

Now, if we can have the moderation lesson learned this time. Perhaps we will be good. But I think the days of Antifa not feeling any ramifications for their work and others, those days are over! As of yesterday.

Megyn -- I just -- go ahead.

MEGYN: Go ahead, Glenn. I was just going to say. One of the things we did after 9/11 was when the stock market opened two days later. We -- we all bought stocks. We just -- it could have been a 5-dollar to being. But everyone did it to send a message that the financial center would stand. And I think we are going to see a reaction on college campuses when it comes to free speech by conservatives unlike we've ever seen before. In a similar vein.

GLENN: I agree. I'm proud to stand shoulder to shoulder with you, Megyn. And be in the trenches with you all the time. You are a light in a lot of darkness. And I appreciate our years of friendship. And everything that you've done for the country. Thank you!

MEGYN: Likewise, my friend. Thanks for having me.

RADIO

“Our country has changed forever”: Charlie Kirk's BlazeTV friends reflect on his death

BlazeTV hosts Liz Wheeler, Steve Deace, and Allie Beth Stuckey join Glenn Beck to reflect on the assassination of their friend, Charlie Kirk. They also discuss where the conservative movement goes from here and what they believe the impact of his death will be.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: I spoke to you yesterday. And we were both pretty raw at the time. How are you doing this morning?

LIZ: I -- I am in a fog of grief, Glenn. I think that a lot of us are -- it still feels very unbelievable what happened to our very dear friend, Charlie Kirk. I feel like I'm floating up outside of my body in a sense, watching all of this unfold.

It's quite something to see the reaction, from the American people over this assassination. I think you're correct when you say that our country has changed forever. I think this is one of the most significant -- not just political assassinations, but political events that we've experienced since the inception of our country.

And I think I've been praying about this, since you and I spoke for so long yesterday.

I've been thinking about this endlessly.

Obviously, on my knees, praying for sweet Erica and Charlie and Erica's two babies. But I think one of the things that's happened in the last 24 hours is people in our country, and I don't even want to say conservatives.

I don't want to say right-wingers because it's not just that, have realized that Charlie is so normal. He's not radical. He's not extreme.

He's not bombastic. He's not edgy. He's just a regular guy. And he's kind. And they killed him because of those beliefs and opinions, those principles and values, Glenn, that we share with him.

And you and I work in this industry, and you've written a lot of books about this political enemy that we face, and we talk about it a lot.

But for the majority of the American people, this is the first time, Glenn, that they're realizing, exactly who this political enemy that we face is.

And it's jarring, and it's gut-wrenching. Because they realize, that just as easily as they assassinated Charlie Kirk and are now dancing on his grave, they want to do that to us, too. (crying)

GLENN: Liz, I -- and I know you do. I have such faith in the Lord. And I know -- I don't know how our lives end.

I don't know how things work out. But I know everything that happens is used for his good. There is no way to thwart God's plan. You can make it -- you can make getting there harder. You can make getting there more painful.

But if we trust in him, great and glorious things are going to happen. Because of this.

LIZ: Charlie once said --

GLENN: Go ahead.

LIZ: Charlie once said, when someone asked him what he wanted to be known for the most -- and he wore a lot of hats, so he could have picked a lot of different accomplishments and identities. And he said he wanted to be known for his faith.

And that's -- it's so powerful. You and I are clinging to God right now. Everyone sitting here with us is clinging to God. I'm literally sitting here, gripping a rosary as we talk. Evil happens in our world, and we all ask that question, "Why? Why does God allow bad things to happen to good and innocent people?"

And, you know, as Father Mike Schmitz reminded us yesterday, "When evil happens, that is not God's perfect will. It is God's permissive will, which is very different."

God allowed Charlie's death to happen, but he did not want it to happen. God values human freedom and can bring about a greater good through these allowed events. But God does not allow evil. He uses it to achieve his higher purpose. When sometimes we don't know what that is, and I -- I'm human. I find it very difficult not to have an immediate answer to, "Okay. What is that higher good?"

But it could be testing faith or demonstrating compassion, teaching people how to uphold his perfect will of good.

And if God were to remove evil from the human existence, he would also be removing our free will to love him and to love others. And he knows that despite the evil that he allows to exist in the world, this greater good can be achieved for eternity, which is where Charlie is now.

And, Glenn, there are a lot of bad people online right now. You know, celebrating Charlie's death and saying how ironic it was, that Charlie was killed by a gun when he was a champion of gun rights. But you want to know what the real irony is? The real irony is that Charlie, at this moment in eternity, I guarantee you, Glenn, is praying for those who did this to him.

GLENN: You know, yesterday I said, "I think I might have done the hardest things I've done. I walked to the front gate, and I lowered my flag to half-mast for a dear friend."

And I think that is going to be easy compared to the forgiveness and the compassion and the restraint that is going to be required from all of us in the coming days. I think that's going to be very difficult. And I don't know how you do it, if you don't have God.

LIZ: I don't. I can't imagine moving forward without God. The Bible says, "He is my rock. He is my refuge."

And I can tell you, that that's the only thing that's helping me swim through this fog.

Charlie was such a good man, Glenn. Such a good man. You know, he once actually hired me -- this was a decade and a half ago. He hired me to work for Turning Point USA, but I wasn't going to -- my start date for starting that job wasn't going to be for, like, three months down the road because that's a new financial cycle. And in the interim after we had signed that contract, but before I had started, I got offered my first television job on OIN. And so I preemptively quit on Charlie.

And I remembered talking to him. And saying, "I know this is such a sucky move for me to preemptively quit on you after we had agreed. But, Charlie, what would you do?"

And he was so gracious, Glenn. He was so generous. He said, "You are -- you're going to kill it. You're going to -- you will use this platform to glorify God and save this country."

And he was always so encouraging. Yesterday, I was looking back at our text thread, because for as busy as this man was, he never neglected talking to his friends.

And during some of the most challenging moments in my public life, who was texting me encouragement, but Charlie Kirk? This -- it is hard to think about how to move forward, but one of the things -- and I know that it's hard to articulate clearly in this moment. But one of the things that I know with crystal clarity at this moment. Is we are not going to be silenced by an enemy who harms us.

We are not going to back down. We are not going to be quiet. We are going to honor Charlie's legacy. We are going to care for and love Charlie's families.

We are going to understand in a clearer sense exactly what we are up against. And it's going to -- with God on our side, it is going to lead us to victory, in a way that our country has not yet experienced. Because we do have this binary choice.

The left wants violence. The left wants Civil War.

The left wants to hurt us and kill us.

But what's going to happen instead, is these people in our country. People who are politically apathetic. Or lukewarm liberal. Or maybe right-wing, but not that active in politics, the same thing is going to happen as a result of Charlie's assassination. That happened after the Black Lives Matter riots.

Or after the COVID vaccine mandates. Where people realized that the other side does not want the best for us.

That the other side, during the Black Lives Matter riots, was willing to falsely accuse us of being racists when that wasn't true. Or during COVID, to tell us that we couldn't go to church and worship God. And we had to take their medical products because they said so, and they didn't care about the harm. Glenn, this is that, times one thousand!

People are now looking out across our country, realizing, that there are subversive forces. And not just a radical lunatic madman incident.

There are radical forces who want to kill us. And the awakening that is going to happen, the eye-opening, you are going to see churches filled with people turning to God. You are going to see politics, a swell of good people, who want to stand for normalcy, and common sense. Two million, 5 million, 10 million Charlie Kirks are going to be minted because of this!

And that's hard to picture in this moment, and there will be hard choices to make because we're angry right now and the left is taunting us, but I have so much faith. I have so much faith in what Charlie did and in the prayers that he is going to be bathing our country in now from eternity.

GLENN: I want to spend a few minutes with another friend of Charlie Kirk's and a good friend of our program and -- and mine. Steve Deace, who follows me on Blaze TV. Steve, I know it has been a hard 24 hours. How are you holding up?

STEVE: I'm pretty devastated. I think I have sobbed more, Glenn, in the last 18 hours than I probably did since the night of my own conversion.

GLENN: Hmm.

STEVE: I'm angry, as I know a lot of people are. And there will be a time, after we -- we need to mourn, first, Glenn. Because otherwise the anger will come out destructively. And it needs to come out, but constructively. And I think we have to mourn first. I think Charlie's legacy as a father, husband, friend, patriot merits that. And I think TP USA and his family need that.

In the not too distant future, we're going to have to get the message that was sent here. He was the best of us. We saw him behind the scenes or in public, genuinely kind, generous.

I -- I -- too many pastors and ministry leaders thought they were too good for Charlie and TP USA. Didn't want to get their hands dirty, and claimed they were being super friendly. And yet, he was the one that sought out the seekers. He went to the places that those nicer than God pastors didn't go to. And he took the bullet that, frankly, that's part of their calling. That they're supposed to take. And I hope in a good way, it shames some of them this morning. That they wake up and they realize, that they have slept on the job. And that's judge somebody like Charlie had to do their job for them.

And as Charlie, you know, named his own organization.

This is a turning point. We're never going back to the way things were before. What we do, next, will decide whether or not they are better. And as one of Charlie's biggest -- biggest supporters and donors texted me this morning, we can only pray that out of one, many will rise up.

GLENN: That's a guarantee. That is an absolute guarantee, that that is going to happen.
You know, when the tyrant is killed, his reign is over. When the martyr is killed, his reign has just begun. And make no mistake, for liberty, Charlie Kirk was a martyr. He was assassinated and martyred yesterday.

And -- and, you know, I -- I -- I -- I think -- I hope, that America -- I wish America could know him the way we knew him.

Because he was a -- he was such a generous man.

STEVE: Uh-huh.

GLENN: It didn't matter who you were, or what rank in life you were, if you needed help, he was there. And --

STEVE: Yep.

GLENN: No matter how busy he was, everything stopped.

And he would help you.

And I saw it in him over and over and over again. And I wish people could see that, because it -- you know, this cartoon character, where they're making him into this bomb thrower, he was anything, but.

I mean, he would have the greatest conversations with people. I mean, I could have done it. I couldn't do it. I couldn't sit through that nonsense. But he could!

And he could logically and peacefully have a great conversation, with people who despised him. And that was so important for the healing of our nation. And I really think that that's one of the reasons that he was killed, not just because he was effective at what he did, but because he was healing us. Something that is really vital to happen. He was healing all of those divides.

STEVE: I couldn't have said it better myself. And if you just look on social media and see so many people in our movement, who have such incredible -- people I don't know, people that don't know me, such incredible testimonies of everything you just said in their interactions with Charlie.

You know, we had a very divisive presidential primary. And to be honest, I didn't always handle it well. One of the first people I heard from when it was over was Charlie. And he texted me, and he said, "Don't give up. We need you."

He didn't have to do that, he won. And he's got the bigger platform. He's got the bigger show. He didn't have to do that. But that's the -- those are the kinds of things that leaders do.

And the void that is left here is massive. And at my lowest point I've ever had in my faith, the Lord said something to me, that will stay with me the rest of my life. And he said, "Steven" -- I'm sorry.

"Steven, I need apostles, not assassins."

And I want to share that with your audience because to win the fight that will come after this, that is what will be required. If you know me, this isn't about being a pansy. The apostles rebuke. But they don't seek revenge. The apostles confront. But they don't condemn. The apostles did something that Hannibal couldn't do.

No other civilization in the fertile crescent could do, they conquered the Roman empire. They set the stage for Western civilization. And they did not do it because they were passive, and they sit on the sidelines, and they were nicer than God. And they wear pleated khakis and Hawaiian shirts year around with sweater vests.

They did it because they got their hands dirty. They did it because they did the kinds of things we saw Charlie do: Build infrastructure.
Direct, lead, guide.

I mean, we would have to have a literal conclave, Glenn. And literally, everyone in our business and movement. And come up with divisions to do all the various things Charlie himself was leading and doing in that organization.

I told Charlie at dinner recently, "It's like, you were like, if Rush Limbaugh and the Heritage Foundation had a baby. This is what you and TP USA are."

And that's what it's going to take to fill that void. But I can't -- I'm sure with the size of your audience, my inbox -- my wife is going through it, as we speak, it is full of people. You were right. I have to get off the sidelines. I have to do something. My buddy Sloan over at TP USA texted me yesterday, he goes, "You know, I can't tell you how many pastors we're hearing from. They thought they were too pious for us. Too good for us.
And now the stakes have been raised. They're getting it."

And I'm just so sorry, that it took two little children and their -- and their mom's family away from them for two -- for more people to get the message. And I want to -- I want to specifically challenge my generation, Gen X, no more grunge. No more, we're too cool for school. No more, "Well, everything sucks. Nothing we can do." No more.

That was a 31-year-old man doing the work as a young father and husband, frankly it wasn't his time to do yet. He has other primary duties that he should have been given the benefit of devoting to as a husband father, but our generation has set on the sidelines for too long. We must lead. It is our children now that are grown, that are leaving the nest. We are the ones with the free time.

We are the ones with the discretionary income. It is our time now to leave, to stop bitching and complaining about boomers. And I say that to me more than anybody else.

And to stop looking around like we're still listening to Pearl Jam and Stone Temple Pilots and Sound Garden, and nothing is going to get better. It is time now to lead. This is our moment.

And we are the ones that are in a place to do this with the positions of our families and with our productivity and prosperity. We have to step to the forefront now.

GLENN: Such great good will come out of this, Allie.

I know this is a tough day for you, and thank you for joining me.

ALLIE: Yeah. God is in the business of redemption. He's in the business of thwarting Satan's schemes. He's in the business of bringing beauty out of the ashes. He's in the business of bringing glory to himself, and bringing people to himself.

And if Charlie had had the choice, if someone had been able to come to him and say, okay. This is what your death will accomplish, it will accomplish more people hearing the gospel, it will accomplish more people waking up, I know if Charlie had had that choice, he would have said yes. He would have said, "Yes, Lord, send me." And not only would he have, but he did.

He went into the lion's den, and now he is with the lion of Judah. Now he is with Jesus. And everyone is going to know who he was and why he lived and the gospel that motivated him. And that is the only thing right now that is giving me any hope or any peace or any comfort.

GLENN: I know that all I could think of yesterday was how glorious the greeting must have been on the other side. You know, good -- "Well, done, good and faithful servant."

ALLIE: Yes, absolutely.

And before any of us heard the news, before his sweet wife Erica got the phone call, he was already hearing those words. And I am so happy for him.

I'm so happy that he is with the saints and the martyrs and the persecuted through which the Church of Christ has been advanced for millennia. I'm so happy for him. I'm so sad for us. I'm so sad for us, having gained an incredible person. But we -- we lost a huge presence.

GLENN: That's how I know when people have faith. They don't weep for the dead.

They weep for the lost to themselves and to the world and to the families that are hurting.

They -- they mourn that loss on themselves. But they -- they -- when they think of the person who has died, they know exactly where they are.

ALLIE: Yeah.

GLENN: And with Charlie, I -- I -- I -- I mean, I knew him when he was 17, and he was a good kid, but what a change happened to him.

He -- he was on fire for Christ, on fire for that.

ALLIE: Yes. Absolutely. He grew into over the past five to ten years, such a theologically deep and apologetically astute man of God, as he became a husband, as he became a father, as he became even more of a warrior for truth, and that is really what -- that's what inspired me.

And when I heard the news yesterday, I thought, my thought was, that's it. I'm done. I'm throwing in the towel.

That is it for me. I'm not -- I'm not willing to do this anymore.

And then later after he died, I went through some of the texts that he had sent me over the years. He was always sending everyone. All of these friends. These very encouraging texts.

And he sent me this article from a liberal outlet, that of course, had taken some jabs at me. That had made me anxious. And he said, "Well done. Keep slugging."

And I just know that if he were here, that's exactly what he would say, not just to me, but to all of us.

He would say, "No. You can't get out now. You got to keep going. You got to keep going." That's exactly how he would feel, and that's exactly what he would tell all of us.

GLENN: I've received so many emails from people who have said, "I don't know how to get back up again."

ALLIE: Yeah.

GLENN: And I don't know what to tell them other than, faith in God. Faith in God.

ALLIE: Uh-huh.

GLENN: I think if our side, if you will -- boy, I hate that in this context, but if -- if we didn't have God, we would be very much like the left right now.

We would be mired in anger and -- and screaming for vengeance and it would be a really ugly place today.

ALLIE: Yes.

GLENN: If -- if we didn't have God.

ALLIE: Yes. And if Jesus wasn't raised from the dead, like if he wasn't resurrected, then we don't have a hope of a resurrection. If he didn't defeat death, then we can't defeat death. If Jesus didn't live forever, then we can't live forever.

And that's exactly what Charlie always preached. What he always posted on X. What he always said, if you were to be able to text him right now. And say, "Look, Charlie. I've got this really tough thing to talk about today. And I don't know how to say it. I don't know what to say. What are your thoughts on it? What should I say?" I know exactly what he would say, the one word he would text back, and that would be, "Jesus. Just tell them that. Just tell them that Jesus is the only way to fulfillment." That is what he would say. People may not realize that. Every time he went on a college campus, he wasn't just talking about capitalism or Donald Trump, and all those things are important. He shared the gospel.

GLENN: No.

ALLIE: He knew that every single person that walked in front of him, was made in the image of God with a soul that was going to live forever, in one of two places. He desperately wanted the people who hated him to go to heaven. And I just pray that I can have that same boldness for the rest of my life.

RADIO

Courage, Faith, and Truth: Glenn Beck's Tribute

Glenn Beck pays tribute to his dear friend Charlie Kirk following his tragic passing. With raw emotion and deep conviction, Glenn reflects on Charlie’s courage, faith, and unwavering commitment to truth in a world that often rewards lies. Drawing parallels to America’s founders, soldiers, and first responders, Glenn reminds us that Charlie’s life and legacy demand an answer to the question: “If not me, then who?” This episode is both a remembrance of Charlie’s extraordinary life and a call to action for all of us to stand firm in faith, defend truth, and carry forward the torch of courage that he so boldly bore.

Watch Glenn Beck's Full 3-Hour Radio Show from September 11, 2025 HERE

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Transcript

“Our country has changed forever”: Charlie Kirk's BlazeTV friends reflect on his death

Transcript

Courage, Faith, and Truth: Glenn Beck's Tribute