BLOGJune 20, 2017

How Innovators, Athletes and Warriors Hijack Their Senses for Off-The-Chart Productivity

It’s the biggest revolution you’ve never heard of, and it’s hiding in plain sight. Over the past decade, Silicon Valley executives like Eric Schmidt and Elon Musk, Special Operators like the Navy SEALs and the Green Berets, and maverick scientists like Sasha Shulgin and Amy Cuddy have turned everything we thought we knew about high performance upside down. Instead of grit, better habits, or 10,000 hours, these trailblazers have found a surprising short cut. They're harnessing rare and controversial states of consciousness to solve critical challenges and outperform the competition.

In his new book Stealing Fire: How Silicon Valley, the Navy SEALs, and Maverick Scientists Are Revolutionizing the Way We Live and Work, co-author Steven Kotler details this place called "the flow" where creativity and performance are heightened. Getting in the flow isn't all sunshine and lollipops, however. Kotler joined Glenn on radio to discuss the phenomenon.

"If I understand you right, what you're saying is, whether it's drugs, whether it's a spiritual experience, no matter how you get there, there's this place called the flow, and it makes you so much more focused and productive," Glenn said.

Kotler explained.

"What we know about flow is that . . . in these states, all of the brain's kind of information processing machinery gets amplified, right? We take in more information per second. We process it more quickly. We're able to, like, link ideas together. So creativity goes through the roof, motivation goes through the roof, cooperation, collaboration --- all the so-called twenty-first century skills, the skills that we need so badly right now," Kotler said.

This state of consciousness floods the brain with dopamine, the chemical that underlies all addictive behavior --- like gambling, sex, shopping or cocaine addictions.

Glenn experienced his own version of it for several years from a "deep spiritual connection of profound gratitude and service" called "helper's flow."

According to Kotler, there are ten individual triggers that could drive someone into the flow, as well as group or shared triggers.

"There's a shared collective version of a flow state, known as group flow. It's what happens if you've ever been in a great brainstorming session or if you watched a band come together and the music just starts to soar, or for that matter, if you saw the Super Bowl last year . . . what the Patriots did in the fourth quarter. Everybody comes together, and football looks more like ballet. That's group flow. It's what the SEALs rely on so heavily too," Kotler said.

Based on brain research and four years of investigation, Stealing Fire explains how the driving forces of psychology, neurobiology, technology and pharmacology are fueling a trillion dollar underground economy.

Enjoy the complimentary clip or read the transcript for details.

GLENN: Steve, welcome to the program. Glad you're here.

I have to be honest with you, I've only read, you know, 50 pages of the book. And I'm not sure I -- I understand. Let me just ask you one question before we get into it, to make sure I do understand what the point is here. Is James Valentine -- he was not taking any drugs. He was just -- he had a different kind of experience. But the same effect.

STEVEN: Yeah.

GLENN: Okay. So I just wanted to know that. Now you can start at the beginning because now I think I got it.

STEVEN: Absolutely. Let me just put it in historical context for you because it's the -- thank you for having me, by the way.

GLENN: You bet.

STEVEN: But it's the easiest way to frame this up.

Back at the turn of the century, 1902, William James, who is a Harvard philosopher and psychologist and has used sort -- he's sort of the godfather of western philosophy -- he makes the observation that a whole slew of experiences, what all the experiences that are sort of found north of happy -- so these are states of awe. Certain kinds of mystical experiences, like trance states or states produced by prayer or yoga or meditation, or even in some cases, psychedelic states or flow states, which is what we study at the Flow Juneau Project, myself and Jamie Weil, who I wrote the book with. Which are those states of -- kind of optimal states of consciousness where we feel are best, where we perform our best.

You notice that all these states were really, really similar. They produce very similar psychological changes in us. They seem to heal anxiety, heal trauma, and they seem to lift us up to incredible heights. And they produce a very similar kind of physical experiences in us.

And we sort of turned our back on it. Like we weren't really interested in all states of consciousness at that point. Freud came along. He said, hey, pathological problems are much more interesting. Let's try to fix people.

And that's what psychology did, for about a hundred years, until the late '90s, when somebody -- hey, you know, there's this whole upper realm of experiences we haven't looked at. And now we have.

And as it turns out, using, you know, high-powered brain imaging technology, James was right. There's very, very little difference in the brain of a skier in the zone, moving down a mountain base, or say, as you pointed out, in the beginning, a billionaire microdosing with psychedelics or somebody meditating. Very similar things happen in the brain. They produce very similar feelings. And, thus, they have similar benefits.

GLENN: Okay. So let's get into this. Because I -- I've read 55 pages this morning, just trying to get ready for this. And I wish I would have picked the book up earlier. Because I think --

STEVEN: I got to tell you, by the way, 55 pages, you're doing well compared to a lot of people I talk to.

GLENN: Well, I'm embarrassed --

STEVEN: I appreciate that.

GLENN: I'm embarrassed that I've only read 55.

But the idea here -- I'm fascinated by it because I believe -- as long as we're not talking about a drug-only state, in the flow, I really truly believe that from 2007 to about 2012, I experienced that. And it -- just being in the flow. And it was a very different feeling and real high, high clarity.

Mine was a -- mine was a -- not drug induced. But I could explain it to you. And I think it's the way John Valentine --

STEVEN: James Valentine.

GLENN: Or, James Valentine would explain it as well. So I think there is something here to people --

STEVEN: Do I mind if I ask you a question?

GLENN: Yeah, go ahead.

STEVEN: What triggered that experience in you? At the front end of it, what was going on in your life that brought that on?

GLENN: It was a -- a -- a deep spiritual connection of profound gratitude and service.

STEVEN: So, interestingly, you had an experience, and it's very long-lasting. It's known as helper's high. It was discovered by Allan Luks, founder of Big Brothers Big Sisters back in the '90s. It's essentially a flow state. Right? And let's just define "flow" for your listeners who don't know what exactly it is. Flow is a fancy term for being in the zone, being unconscious, if you play a lot of basketball. Those moments of wrapped attention and total absorption, where you get so focused on what you're doing, everything else vanishes. So your sense of self goes away. Time passes strangely. It slows down, or it will speed up.

GLENN: It's what, like, SEALs and people describe when they're at their height of, you know, going in to kill Osama bin Laden. Time slows down. Everything else disappears.

STEVEN: Yes. Now, that's a very acute -- when time slows down, it has to be very acute. There's a lot of additional brain processes being involved a little bit

GLENN: Right.

STEVEN: But essentially, helper's high is a flow state produced by altruism. You can even get a little taste for it -- if you've ever donated to Kiva or an online charity or anything like that, you'll get a little flush of that kind of feel-good feeling on the back end.

GLENN: Yes.

STEVEN: You just got it for a very long time. My wife and I were on a dog sanctuary and -- so we do hospice care and special needs care, and we live in a very poor community. And we work here intentionally and live here intentionally to do this work. And she runs on helper's high.

GLENN: So the difference between that and just the dopamine that you get from -- you know, the (sound effect) from your Facebook or your email.

STEVEN: Yeah, exactly.

GLENN: What is what is the difference?

STEVEN: So the differences are, as we move into flow, a couple of things happen: First of all, you get -- so most of what -- what they call 21st century normal, you and I, where our brains are right now, there's a lot of activity kind of behind our forehead, in what's known as the prefrontal cortex, which is your executive function, your attention, your sense of morality, your sense of will, language, function, all that stuff. That's going crazy.

And we -- most of us live with like the steady drip, drip of stress hormones like cortisol and norepinephrine. That's what psychologists talk about as 21st century normal, essentially.

As you move into all of these states -- this happens in meditation. It happens in conflative states like yoga. It happens in flow states, whether they're triggered by action/adventure sports or by music. James Valentine's experience was he got into these deep trances playing music.

You can -- chess is -- Josh Waitzkin talks a lot about chess and flow. Very common in a lot of things that require intense focus in the present moment or altruism, in your case.

And so what happens is you move into those states -- and in the prefrontal cortex, it gets really quiet. It dies down.

That's why your sense of self disappears. Right? The inner critic -- that nagging, always on, defeatist voice in your head goes quiet in those states because the inner critic is basically calculated in your prefrontal cortex. And if that part of the brain starts to shut down, we can't perform the calculations. So your inner critic goes away. Time passes, strangely. Because time is calculated all over the prefrontal cortex. And what goes away, we can't separate past, present, from future. It all blends together into what researchers call the "deep now."

And to your question, the stress hormones, norepinephrine and cortisol, they get flushed out of our system. And they get replaced by not just dopamine. Dopamine itself is a very powerful, you know, feel-good neural chemical with a lot of performance-enhancing benefit. But you also get endorphins and serotonin and monoamine and oxytocin. It's the cocktail that is so popular.

And what that cocktail does -- you talked about the clarity, besides -- you know, it makes us feel selfless. It makes us feel timeless. It also gives -- it massively -- it massively boosts motivation.

So McKinsey, for example, did a ten-year study of top executives in flow. And they found that top executives were 500 percent more productive in flow. That's a huge boost. And it's because all of these same neural chemicals, they're feel-good drugs. Some of the most addictive pleasure chemicals the brain can produce -- flow is the only time we get all at once. And so it produced this huge spike in motivation. A positive spike, right? Like a positive addiction.

GLENN: And so your -- your job now is to try to figure out how to trip us into this flow?

STEVEN: Yeah. We -- so over the past -- you know, flow science has -- stretches back 150 years. But recently, the past ten years, we've been able to look under the hood for the first time. Where are these experiences coming from? And we've been able to work backwards. And we now know that flow states have triggers, preconditions that lead to more flow.

There are ten individual triggers, what you or I could have used on our own to drive ourselves into flow. And then there's a shared collective version of a flow state, known as group flow. It's what happens if you've ever been in a great brainstorming session or if you watched a band come together and the music just starts to soar, or for that matter, if you saw the Super Bowl last year. Saw fourth quarter comeback, right? The spectacular -- what the Patriots did in the fourth quarter. Everybody comes together, and football looks more like ballet. That's group flow.

It's what the SEALs rely on so heavily too. It's a team coming together, being able to kind of behave like a collective organism.

GLENN: Okay. When we come back, I want to have you go through some of those ten things that can trip us into it. The name of the book is Stealing Fire: How Silicon Valley, Navy SEALs, and Maverick Scientists Are Revolutionizing the Way We Work and the Way We Live.

[break]

GLENN: I'm fascinated by this. Steven Kotler. The name of the book is called Stealing Fire.

And, Steven, if I understand you right, what you're saying is, whether it's drugs, whether it's a spiritual experience, no matter how you get there, there's this place called the flow, and it makes you so much more focused and productive. And however you get there, you're trying to figure out how to trip yourself into it. Correct?

STEVEN: Yeah.

GLENN: Okay.

STEVEN: What we know about flow is that -- you know, in these states, all of the brain's kind of information processing machinery gets amplified. Right? We take in more information per second. We process it more quickly. We're able to like link ideas together. Find -- so creativity goes through the roof. Motivation goes through the roof. Cooperation, collaboration, all the so-called 21st Century skills, the skills that we need so badly right now.

GLENN: Okay. So give me -- we have about five minutes. Give me the high points on how to trip yourself into it.

STEVEN: So, you know, some really kind of basic stuff is pretty simple. First thing you need to know is that flow shows up when all of our attention is focused on the right here, right now.

So at a very practical level, we go into companies, one of the first things we tell them is if -- you can't hang a sign that says, bleep off, I'm flowing. You are in trouble. Because flow requires 90- to 120-minute periods of concentration to really bring it out. Which is, by the way, one of the reasons Montessori education is so effective. It's built around to 90 to 120 minutes of uninterrupted concentration periods, right? They use this. And it's why Montessori kids, you know, see so much flow and end up testing better than so many other kids on any test you throw at them. Very simple thing.

Want to get it -- take it one notch up. We'll go into a trigger that's often called the golden rule of flow, known as the challenge skills balance. The idea here is really simple: All of flow's triggers are things that help drive attention to the present moment. Right?

So we pay the most attention to the task at hand, when the challenge of the task slightly exceeds our skill set. So you want to stretch, but not snap. And this is tricky. Because if you're sort of shy or timid, maybe a bit of an underachiever, whatever, the sweet spot is outside of your comfort zone. You have to be pushing yourself outside your standard comfort zone.

For a really super high productive, top performers, type A types, the problem here is they blow past the sweet spot. They will take on challenges that are so much bigger than they need to be.

And so one of the things we always tell people is in this stuff -- especially if you're type A, you got to go slow to go fast. There's a kind of neuro biologically sweet spot as to how we pay attention. And when you hit it, it really drives focus.

GLENN: Okay. Go ahead.

STEVEN: I mean, just a couple places to start.

GLENN: All right. So do you do this with -- are you guys doing this work with companies coming in and saying --

STEVEN: Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, last week, we spent a day with all the top senior management, top executives at Ameritrade. And the bigger point is this, we've learned this over the years in our digitally delivered classes -- and, for example, we did a six-week training at Google a couple years ago. It was a joint learning exercise, where we were trying some of this stuff out. And we train them up in kind of four high performance basics like sleep hygiene. Get enough sleep at night kind of stuff. Real basic. And then four flow triggers. How do you deploy these in your life?

And after a six-week period -- and they did about an hour of homework a day, spread out throughout the day, but it took some work. But not a ton. They saw a 35 to 80 percent increase in flow.

Now, within context, same McKinsey article I talked about earlier, the same study, found that a 15 percent increase in workplace flow will double overall workplace productivity. So what we've learned is, not only does flow have triggers, the stuff is really easy to teach. It's not -- and it's funny because everybody -- everybody is basically -- we're hard-wired the same. We're wired for high performance. So once you start understanding how this stuff works, you can really step on the gas.

PAT: So you don't have to do this through drugs, through chemical means, right?

STEVEN: No. No.

PAT: In fact --

STEVEN: There are a lot -- you have to understand that what you're talking about is pharmacology today, which has a long history of strong reactions. Lots of politics. Lots of mess. Goes back a long time.

Tomorrow, you're going to be talking about a EEG headset that zaps your brain in a particular way. We're already getting there. Right? We have EEG headsets that can dial up a lot of kind of the underlying neural biology of flow. And they're getting better. Virtual reality is better. Is really good at this as well. So like you have feelings of, hey, I don't want to take a pharmacological route. Totally fine. Right? Absolutely valid. You know what I mean? Not for everybody.

But, you know, it's an interesting bias because, you know, our idea that we -- it's internal and comes from us. It's pure and whole and sacred. And, you know, drugs are -- drugs are a cheater's way there, or they're bad or whatever. Fine. Okay. That's where we are now.

But tomorrow, it's going to be an app on your phone. That's where it starts to get really interesting.

PAT: Wow.

GLENN: Well, I want to talk to you about that a little bit. Because you say this can be really, really good or highly destructive.

STEVEN: Well, so earlier I mentioned that you get all five of these really potent neural chemicals. They're very addictive. All -- I mean, there's no external drugs, cocaine, for example, most addictive drug on earth. All it does is flood the brain with dopamine, right? Dopamine is the drug that makes -- that underlies all addictive behavior.

GLENN: Yes, yes, yes.

STEVEN: Gambling addiction, sex addiction, shopping addiction. You know, cocaine addiction. It doesn't matter. So you're getting the into the same neuro chemistry. So these states can be very, very addictive.

THE GLENN BECK PODCAST

Max Lucado & Glenn Beck: Finding unity in faith

Glenn Beck sits down with beloved pastor and author Max Lucado for a deep conversation about faith, humility, and finding unity in a divided world. Together, they reflect on the importance of principles over politics, why humility opens the door to true dialogue, and how centering life on God brings clarity and peace. Lucado shares stories of faith, the dangers of a “prosperity gospel,” and the powerful reminder that life is not about making a big deal of ourselves, but about making a big deal of God. This uplifting conversation will inspire you to re-center your life, strengthen your faith, and see how humility and love can transform even the most divided times.

Watch Glenn Beck's FULL Interview with Max Lucado HERE

RADIO

Bill O'Reilly predicts THIS will be Charlie Kirk's legacy

Bill O’Reilly joins Glenn Beck with a powerful prediction about Charlie Kirk’s legacy. Evil tried to destroy his movement, Bill says, but – as his new book, “Confronting Evil,” lays out – evil will just end up destroying itself once more…

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: Mr. Bill O'Reilly, welcome to the program, how are you, sir?

BILL: Good, Beck, thanks for having me back. I appreciate it. How have you been?

GLENN: Last week was really tough. I know it was tough for you and everybody else.

But, you know -- I haven't -- I haven't seen anything.

BILL: Family okay? All of that?

GLENN: Yeah. Yeah. Family is okay. Family is okay.

BILL: Good question good. That's the most important thing.

GLENN: It is.

So, Bill, what do you make of this whole Charlie Kirk thing. What happened, and where are we headed?

BILL: So my analysis is different for everybody else, and those that know me for so long. About a year ago, I was looking for a topic -- it was a contract to do another book. And I said, you know what's happening in America, and around the world. Was a rise in evil. It takes a year to research and write these books.

And not since the 1930s, had I seen that happen, to this extent. And in the 1930s, of course, you would have Tojo and Hitler and Mussolini and Franco and all these guys. And it led to 100 million dead in World War II. The same thing, not to the extent.

But the same thing was --
GLENN: Yet.
BILL: -- bubbling in the world, and in the United States.

I decided to write a book. The book comes out last Tuesday. And on Wednesday, Putin lobs missiles into Poland.

Ultra dangerous.

And a few hours later, Charlie Kirk is assassinated.

And one of the interviewers said to me last week, your -- your book is haunting. Is haunting.

And I think that's extremely accurate. Because that's what evil does.

And in the United States, we have so many distractions. The social media.

People create around their own lives.

Sports. Whatever it may be. That we look away.

Now, Charlie Kirk was an interesting fellow. Because at a very young age, he was mature enough to understand that he wanted to take a stand in favor of traditional America and Judeo Christian philosophy.

He decided that he wanted to do that.

You know, and when I was 31 or whatever, I was lucky I wasn't in the penitentiary. And I believe you were in the penitentiary.
(laughter)
So he was light years ahead of us.

GLENN: Yes, he was.

BILL: And he put it into motion. All right? Now, most good people, even if you disagree with what Mr. Kirk says on occasion, you admire that. That's the spirit of America. That you have a belief system, that you go out and try to promote that belief system, for the greater good of the country. That's what it is.

That's what Charlie Kirk did.

And he lost his life.

By doing it!

So when you essentially break all of this down. You take the emotion away, all right?

Which I have to do, in my job. You see it as another victory for evil.

But it really isn't.

And this is the ongoing story.

This is the most important story. So when you read my book, Confronting Evil, you'll see that all of these heinous individuals, Putin's on the cover. Mao. Hitler.

Ayatollah Khomeini. And then there are 14 others inside the book. They all destroy themselves.

Evil always destroys itself. But it takes so many people with it. So this shooter destroyed his own family.

And -- and Donald Trump, I talked to him about it last week in Yankee stadium. And Trump is a much different guy than most people think.

GLENN: He is.

JASON: He destroyed his own mother and father and his two brothers.

That's what he did. In addition to the Kirk family!

So evil spreads. Now, if Americans pay attention and come to the conclusion that I just stated, it will be much more difficult for evil to operate openly.

And that's what I think is going to happen.

There's going to be a ferocious backlash against the progressive left in particular.

To stop it, and I believe that is what Mr. Kirk's legacy is going to be.

GLENN: I -- I agree with you on all of these fronts.

I wonder though, you know, it took three, or if you count JFK, four assassinations in the '60s, to confront the evil if you will.

Before people really woke up and said, enough is enough!

And then you have the big Jesus revolution after that.

Is -- I hate to say this. But is -- as far gone as we are, is one assassination enough to wake people up?

JOHN: Some people. Some people will never wake up.

They just don't want to live in the real world, Beck. And it's never been easier to do that with the social media and the phones and the computers.

And you're never going to get them back.

But you don't need them. So let's just be very realistic here on the Glenn Beck show.

Let's run it down.

The corporate media is finished.

In America. It's over.

And you will see that play out the next five years.

Because the corporate media invested so much of its credibility into hating Donald Trump.

And the hate is the key word.

You will find this interesting, Beck. For the first time in ten years, I've been invited to do a major thing on CBS, today.

I will do it GE today. With major Garrett.

GLENN: Wow.

BILL: Now, that only happened because Skydance bought CBS. And Skydance understands the brand CBS is over, and they will have to rehabilitate the whole thing. NBC has not come to that conclusion yet, but it will have to.

And ABC just does the weather. I mean, that's all they care about. Is it snowing in Montana? Okay? The cables are all finished. Even Fox.

Once Trump leaves the stage, there's nowhere for FNC to go. Because they've invested so much in Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump.

So the fact of the matter is, the corporate media is over in America. That takes a huge cudgel out of the hands of the progressive movement.

Because the progressive movement was dependent on the corporate media to advance its cause. That's going to end, Beck.

GLENN: Well, I would hope that you're right.

Let me ask you about --

BILL: When am I wrong?

When am I wrong?

You've known me for 55 years. When have I been wrong?

GLENN: Okay. All right. All right. We're not here to argue things like that.

So tell me about Skydance. Because isn't Skydance Chinese?

BILL: No! It's Ellison. Larry Ellison, the second richest guy in the world. He owns Lanai and Hawaii, the big tech guy and his son is running it.

GLENN: Yeah, okay.

I though Skydance. I thought that was -- you know them.

BILL: Yeah.

And they -- they're not ideological, but they were as appalled as most of us who pay attention at the deterioration of the network presentations.

So --

GLENN: You think that they could.

BILL: 60 Minutes used to be the gold standard.

GLENN: Uh-huh.

BILL: And it just -- it -- you know, you know, I don't know if you watch it anymore.

GLENN: I don't either.

So do you think they can actually turn CBS around, or is it just over?

BILL: I don't know. It's very hard to predict, because so many people now bail. I've got a daughter 26, and a son, 22.

They never, ever watched network television.

And you've got -- it's true. Right?

GLENN: Yeah. Yeah.

They don't watch --

BILL: They're not going to watch The Voice. The dancing with this. The juggling with that. You know, I think they could do a much better job in their news presentations.

GLENN: Yeah. Right.

BILL: Because what they did, is banish people like Glenn Beck and Bill O'Reilly.

Same voices, with huge followings.

Huge!

All right?

We couldn't get on there.

That's why Colbert got fired. Because Colbert wouldn't -- refused to put on any non-progressive voice, when they were talking about the country.

GLENN: I know.

BILL: Well, it's not -- I'm censoring it.

GLENN: Yeah, but it's not that he was fired because he wouldn't do that. He was fired because that led to horrible ratings. Horrible ratings.

BILL: Yes, it was his defiance.

GLENN: Yes.

BILL: Fallon has terrible ratings and so does Kimmel. But Colbert was in your face, F you, to the people who were signing his paycheck.

GLENN: Yes. Yes.

BILL: Look, evil can only exist if the mechanisms of power are behind it.

And that's when you read the front -- I take them one by one. And Putin is the most important chapter by far.

GLENN: Why?

BILL: Because Putin would use nuclear weapon.

He wouldn't. He's a psychopath.

And I'm -- on Thursday night, I got a call from the president's people saying, would I meet the president at Yankee stadium for the 9/11 game?

And I said, when a president calls and asks you to meet them, sure.

GLENN: I'll be there. What time?

BILL: It will take me three days to get into Yankee stadium, on Long Island. But I'll start now.

GLENN: Especially because the president is coming. But go ahead.

BILL: Anyway, that was a very, I think that Mr. Trump values my opinion. And it was -- we did talk about Putin.

And the change in Putin. And I had warned him, that Putin had changed from the first administration, where Trump controlled Putin to some extent.

Now he's out of control. Because that's what always happens.

GLENN: Yeah.

BILL: It happened with Hitler. It happened with Mao. It happened with the ayatollah. It happened with Stalin. Right now. They get worse and worse and worse and worse. And then they blow up.

And that's where Putin is! But he couldn't do any of that, without the assent of the Russian people. They are allowing him to do this, to kill women and children. A million Russian casualties for what! For what! Okay?

So that's why this book is just in the stratosphere. And I was thinking object, oh. Because people want to understand evil, finally. Finally.

They're taking a hard look at it, and the Charlie Kirk assassination was an impetus to do that.

GLENN: Yeah. And I think it's also an impetus to look at the good side.

I mean, I think Charlie was just not a neutral -- a neutral character. He was a force for good. And for God.

And I think that -- that combination is almost the Martin Luther King combination. Where you have a guy who is speaking up for civil rights.

But then also, speaking up for God. And speaking truth, Scripturally.

And I think that combination still, strangely, I wouldn't have predicted it. But strangely still works here in America, and I think it's changed everything.

Bill, it's always food to talk to you. Thank you so much for being on. I appreciate it.

It's Bill O'Reilly. The name of the book, you don't want to miss. Is confronting evil. And he takes all of these really, really bad guys on. One by one. And shows you, what happens if you don't do something about it. Confronting evil. Bill O'Reilly.

And you can find it at BillO'Reilly.com.

RADIO

Should people CELEBRATING Charlie Kirk’s death be fired?

There’s a big difference between firing someone, like a teacher, for believing children shouldn’t undergo trans surgery and firing a teacher who celebrated the murder of Charlie Kirk. Glenn Beck explains why the latter is NOT “cancel culture.”

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: I got an email from somebody that says, Glenn, in the wake of Charlie's assassination, dozens of teachers, professors and professionals are being suspended or fired for mocking, or even celebrating Charlie Kirk's death.

Critics say conservatives are now being hypocritical because you oppose cancel culture. But is this the same as rose an losing her job over a crude joke. Or is it celebrating murder, and that's something more serious?

For many, this isn't about cancellation it's about trust. If a teacher is entrusted with children or a doctor entrusted with patients, publicly celebrates political violence, have they not yet disqualified themselves from those roles? Words matter. But cheering a death is an action. Is there any consequence for this? Yes. There is.

So let's have that conversation here for a second.

Is every -- is every speech controversy the same?

The answer to that is clearly no.

I mean, we've seen teachers and pastors and doctors and ordinary citizens lose their job now, just for saying they don't believe children under 18 should undergo transgender surgeries. Okay? Lost their job. Chased out.

That opinion, whether you agree or disagree is a moral and medical judgment.

And it is a matter of policy debate. It is speech in the public square.

I have a right to say, you're mutilating children. Okay. You have a right to say, no. We're not. This is the best practices. And then we can get into the silences of it. And we don't shout down the other side.

Okay? Now, on the other hand, you have Charlie Kirk's assassination. And we've seen teachers and professors go online and be celebrate.

Not criticize. Not argue policy. But celebrate that someone was murdered.

Some have gone so far and said, it's not a tragedy. It's a victory. Somebody else, another professor said, you reap what you sow.

Well, let me ask you: Are these two categories of free speech the same?

No! They're not.

Here's the difference. To say, I believe children should not be allowed to have gender surgeries, before 18. That is an attempt, right or wrong. It doesn't matter which side you are.

That is an attempt to protect life. Protect children. And guide society.

It's entering the debate about the role of medicine. The right of parents. And the boundaries of childhood. That's what that is about. To say Charlie Kirk's assassination is a good thing, that's not a debate. That's not even an idea. That's rejoicing in violence. It's glorifying death.

There's no place in a civil society for that kind of stuff. There's not. And it's a difference that actually matters.

You know, our Founders fought for free speech because they believed as Jefferson said, that air can be tolerated where truth is left free to combat it.

So I have no problem with people disagreeing with me, at all. I don't think you do either. I hope you don't. Otherwise, you should go back to read the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. Error can be tolerated where truth is left to be free to combat it.

But when speech shifts from debating ideas to celebrating death, doesn't that cease to be the pursuit of truth and instead, just become a glorification of evil?

I know where I stand on that one. Where do you stand?

I mean, if you go back and you look at history, in colonial matter -- in colonial America, if you were to go against the parliament and against the king, those words were dangerous. They were called treason. But they were whys. They were arguments about liberty and taxation and the rights of man.

And the Founders risked their lives against the dictator to say those things.

Now, compare that to France in 1793.

You Thomas Paine, one of or -- one of our founder kind of. On the edges of our founders.

He thought that what was happening in France is exactly like the American Revolution.

Washington -- no. It wasn't.

There the crowds. They didn't gather to argue. Okay? They argued to cheer the guillotine they didn't want the battle of ideas.

They wanted blood. They wanted heads to roll.

And roll they did. You know, until the people who were screaming for the heads to roll, shouted for blood, found that their own heads were rolling.

Then they turned around on that one pretty quickly.

Think of Rome.

Cicero begged his countrymen to preserve the republic through reason, law, and debate. Then what happened?

The mob started cheering assassinations.

They rejoiced that enemies were slaughtered.

They were being fed to the lions.

And the republic fell into empire.

And liberty was lost!

Okay. So now let me bring this back to Charlie Kirk here for a second.

If there's a professor that says, I don't believe children should have surgeries before adulthood, is that cancel culture, when they're fired?

Yes! Yes, it is.

Because that is speech this pursuit of truth.

However imperfect, it is speech meant to protect children, not to harm them. You also cannot be fired for saying, I disagree with that.

If you are telling, I disagree with that. And I will do anything to shut you down including assassination! Well, then, that's a different story.

What I teacher says, I'm glad Charlie Kirk is dead, is that cancel culture, if they're fired?

Or is that just society saying, you know, I don't think I can trust my kid to -- to that guy.

Or that woman.

I know, that's not an enlightening mind.

Somebody who delights in political murder.

I don't want them around my children! Scripture weighs in here too.

Out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaketh. Matthew.

What does it reveal about the heart of a teacher who celebrates assassination?

To me, you go back to Scripture. Whoa unto them that call good evil -- evil good and good evil.

A society that will shrug on speech like this, say society that has lost its moral compass.

And I believe we still have a moral compass.

Now, our free speech law doesn't protect both. Absolutely. Under law. Absolutely.

Neither one of them should go to jail.

Neither should be silenced by the state.

But does trust survive both?

Can a parent trust their child to a teacher who is celebrating death?

I think no. I don't think a teacher can be trusted if they think that the children that it's right for children to see strippers in first grade!

I'm sorry. It's beyond reason. You should not be around my children!

But you shouldn't go to jail for that. Don't we, as a society have a right to demand virtue, in positions of authority?

Yes.

But the political class and honestly, the educational class, does everything they can to say, that doesn't matter.

But it does. And we're seeing it now. The line between cancel and culture, the -- the cancellation of people, and the accountability of people in our culture, it's not easy.

Except here. I think it is easy.

Cancel culture is about challenging the orthodoxy. Opinions about faith, morality, biology.
Accountability comes when speech reveals somebody's heart.

Accountability comes when you're like, you are a monster! You are celebrating violence. You're mocking life itself. One is an argument. The other is an abandonment of humanity. The Constitution, so you understand, protects both.

But we as a culture can decide, what kind of voices would shape our children? Heal our sick. Lead our communities?

I'm sorry, if you're in a position of trust, I think it's absolutely right for the culture to say, no!

No. You should not -- because this is not policy debate. This is celebrating death.

You know, our Founders gave us liberty.

And, you know, the big thing was, can you keep it?

Well, how do you keep it? Virtue. Virtue.

Liberty without virtue is suicide!

So if anybody is making this case to you, that this is cancel culture. I just want you to ask them this question.

Which do you want to defend?

Cancel culture that silences debate. Or a culture that still knows the difference between debating ideas and celebrating death.

Which one?

RADIO

Shocking train video: Passengers wait while woman bleeds out

Surveillance footage of the murder of Ukrainian refugee Iryna Zarutska in Charlotte, NC, reveals that the other passengers on the train took a long time to help her. Glenn, Stu, and Jason debate whether they were right or wrong to do so.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: You know, I'm -- I'm torn on how I feel about the people on the train.

Because my first instinct is, they did nothing! They did nothing! Then my -- well, sit down and, you know -- you know, you're going to be judged. So be careful on judging others.

What would I have done? What would I want my wife to do in that situation?

STU: Yeah. Are those two different questions, by the way.

GLENN: Yeah, they are.

STU: I think they go far apart from each other. What would I want myself to do. I mean, it's tough to put yourself in a situation. It's very easy to watch a video on the internet and talk about your heroism. Everybody can do that very easily on Twitter. And everybody is.

You know, when you're in a vehicle that doesn't have an exit with a guy who just murdered somebody in front of you, and has a dripping blood off of a knife that's standing 10 feet away from you, 15 feet away from you.

There's probably a different standard there, that we should all kind of consider. And maybe give a little grace to what I saw at least was a woman, sitting across the -- the -- the aisle.

I think there is a difference there. But when you talk about that question. Those two questions are definitive.

You know, I know what I would want myself to do. I would hope I would act in a way that didn't completely embarrass myself afterward.

But I also think, when I'm thinking of my wife. My advice to my wife would not be to jump into the middle of that situation at all costs. She might do that anyway. She actually is a heck of a lot stronger than I am.

But she might do it anyway.

GLENN: How pathetic, but how true.

STU: Yes. But that would not be my advice to her.

GLENN: Uh-huh.

STU: Now, maybe once the guy has certainly -- is out of the area. And you don't think the moment you step into that situation. He will turn around and kill you too. Then, of course, obviously. Anything you can do to step in.

Not that there was much anyone on the train could do.

I mean, I don't think there was an outcome change, no matter what anyone on that train did.

Unfortunately.

But would I want her to step in?

Of course. If she felt she was safe, yes.

Think about, you said, your wife. Think about your daughter. Your daughter is on that train, just watching someone else getting murdered like that. Would you advise your daughter to jump into a situation like that?

That girl sitting across the aisle was somebody's daughter. I don't know, man.

JASON: I would. You know, as a dad, would I advise.

Hmm. No.

As a human being, would I hope that my daughter or my wife or that I would get up and at least comfort that woman while she's dying on the floor of a train?

Yeah.

I would hope that my daughter, my son, that I would -- and, you know, I have more confidence in my son or daughter or my wife doing something courageous more than I would.

But, you know, I think I have a more realistic picture of myself than anybody else.

And I'm not sure that -- I'm not sure what I would do in that situation. I know what I would hope I would do. But I also know what I fear I would do. But I would have hoped that I would have gotten up and at least tried to help her. You know, help her up off the floor. At least be there with her, as she's seeing her life, you know, spill out in under a minute.

And that's it other thing we have to keep in mind. This all happened so rapidly.

A minute is -- will seem like a very long period of time in that situation. But it's a very short period of time in real life.

STU: Yeah. You watch the video, Glenn. You know, I don't need the video to -- to change my -- my position on this.

But at his seem like there was a -- someone who did get there, eventually, to help, right? I saw someone seemingly trying to put pressure on her neck.

GLENN: Yeah. And tried to give her CPR.

STU: You know, no hope at that point. How long of a time period would you say that was?

Do you know off the top of your head?

GLENN: I don't know. I don't know. I know that we watched the video that I saw. I haven't seen past 30 seconds after she --

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: -- is down. And, you know, for 30 seconds nothing is happening. You know, that is -- that is not a very long period of time.

STU: Right.

GLENN: In reality.

STU: And especially, I saw the pace he was walking. He certainly can't be -- you know, he may have left the actual train car by 30 seconds to a minute. But he wasn't that far away. Like he was still in visual.

He could still turn around and look and see what's going on at that point. So certainly still a threat is my point. He has not, like, left the area. This is not that type of situation.

You know, I -- look, as you point out, I think if I could be super duper sexist for a moment here, sort of my dividing line might just be men and women.

You know, I don't know if it's that a -- you're not supposed to say that, I suppose these days. But, like, there is a difference there. If I'm a man, you know, I would be -- I would want my son to jump in on that, I suppose. I don't know if he could do anything about it. But you would expect at least a grown man to be able to go in there and do something about it. A woman, you know, I don't know.

Maybe I'm -- I hope --

GLENN: Here's the thing I -- here's the thing that I -- that causes me to say, no. You should have jumped in.

And that is, you know, you've already killed one person on the train. So you've proven that you're a killer. And anybody who would have screamed and got up and was with her, she's dying. She's dying. Get him. Get him.

Then the whole train is responsible for stopping that guy. You know. And if you don't stop him, after he's killed one person, if you're not all as members of that train, if you're not stopping him, you know, the person at the side of that girl would be the least likely to be killed. It would be the ones that are standing you up and trying to stop him from getting back to your daughter or your wife or you.

JASON: There was a -- speaking of men and women and their roles in this. There was a video circling social media yesterday. In Sweden. There was a group of officials up on a stage. And one of the main. I think it was health official woman collapses on stage. Completely passes out.

All the men kind of look away. Or I don't know if they're looking away. Or pretending that they didn't know what was going on. There was another woman standing directly behind the woman passed out.

Immediately springs into action. Jumps on top. Grabs her pant leg. Grabs her shoulder. Spins her over and starts providing care.

What did she have that the other guys did not? Or women?

She was a sheepdog. There is a -- this is my issue. And I completely agree with Stu. I completely agree with you. There's some people that do not respond this way. My issue is the proportion of sheepdogs versus people that don't really know how to act. That is diminishing in western society. And American society.

We see it all the time in these critical actions. I mean, circumstances.

There are men and women, and it's actually a meme. That fantasize about hoards of people coming to attack their home and family. And they sit there and say, I've got it. You guys go. I'm staying behind, while I smoke my cigarette and wait for the hoards to come, because I will sacrifice myself. There are men and women that fantasize of block my highway. Go ahead. Block my highway. I'm going to do something about it. They fantasize about someone holding up -- not a liquor store. A convenience store or something. Because they will step in and do something. My issue now is that proportion of sheepdogs in society is disappearing. Just on statistical fact, there should be one within that train car, and there were none.

STU: Yeah. I mean --

JASON: They did not respond.

STU: We see what happens when they do, with Daniel Penny. Our society tries to vilify them and crush their existence. Now, there weren't that many people on that train. Right?

At least on that car. At least it's limited. I only saw three or four people there, there may have been more. I agree with you, though. Like, you see what happens when we actually do have a really recent example of someone doing exactly what Jason wants and what I would want a guy to do. Especially a marine to step up and stop this from happening. And the man was dragged by our legal system to a position where he nearly had to spend the rest of his life in prison.

I mean, I -- it's insanity. Thankfully, they came to their senses on that one.

GLENN: Well, the difference between that one and this one though is that the guy was threatening. This one, he killed somebody.

STU: Yeah. Right. Well, but -- I think -- but it's the opposite way. The debate with Penny, was should he have recognize that had this person might have just been crazy and not done anything?

Maybe. He hadn't actually acted yet. He was just saying things.

GLENN: Yeah. Well --

STU: He didn't wind up stabbing someone. This is a situation where these people have already seen what this man will do to you, even when you don't do anything to try to stop him. So if this woman, who is, again, looks to be an average American woman.

Across the aisle. Steps in and tries to do something. This guy could easily turn around and just make another pile of dead bodies next to the one that already exists.

And, you know, whether that is an optimal solution for our society, I don't know that that's helpful.

In that situation.

Glenn's Show Prep

How Innovators, Athletes and Warriors Hijack Their Senses for Off-The-Chart Productivity

Max Lucado & Glenn Beck: Finding unity in faith

Bill O'Reilly predicts THIS will be Charlie Kirk's legacy

Transcript

Should people CELEBRATING Charlie Kirk’s death be fired?

Transcript

Shocking train video: Passengers wait while woman bleeds out

Transcript