RADIOJuly 01, 2025

“General Lee” stuntman REVEALS ALL about the fountain jump

A stuntman took the internet by storm when he jumped a "Dukes of Hazzard" General Lee replica over a fountain in Somerset, Kentucky. The driver, Northeast Ohio Dukes founder Raymond Kohn, joins Glenn Beck to reveal what happened behind the scenes, why he did the jump, and where he wants to jump next (hint: it would involve President Trump)!

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: There was something just amazing that happened over the weekend in Somerset, Kentucky. It was like a Dukes of Hazzard Show.

Thirty-five thousand people gathered together, to line the streets of Somerset, as a very brave driver, who you're going to meet here in a second. Raymond Kohn. Raymond Kohn got into a car. Was an old Dodge Charger?

He jumped over the historic fountain, in the center of the town.

Can we play a little bit of this, if you happen to be watching?

GLENN: I mean, that is just crazy. It just makes me proud to be American, in a very strange sort of way. I don't even know why. It's just so satisfying. The world is on fire, and you're like, yes! We still got it. Raymond Kohn is on with us now. He is the founder and lead stuntman from the northeast Ohio dukes. And they -- they do this kind of stuff all the time. Raymond, welcome to the program.

How are you?

RAYMOND: Thank you for having me, Glenn. I am great.

I feel like a million bucks.

GLENN: Do you really?

When I saw you land, I thought, ow, my back. Ow, my back. It didn't hurt coming down?

RAYMOND: Well, you know what, we are thankful that the legendary stuntman who inspired me to do this. Like the late great Al White Jr. Ted Barba. Corrie Uvey. Jumping John Kid. (all phonetic)

These are the guys who risk everything, back in the '80s on the set of the Dukes of Hazzard, to figure out, how we can do this safely without killing ourselves.

GLENN: I've got to say -- I have to say, I saw a video from the -- from in front of you, as you landed.

And you hit a wall. And you're just tearing through this wall.

And there is a photographer, that is in front. Did you see him, and think, get out of the way, dude! Almost killed him.

RAYMOND: Yeah. So Centerville is our producer. His series that follows us in -- like a global episode, of what we do.

And Mike Cullvich (phonetic) is the -- the -- the executive producer, and that was him there.

And they carefully --

GLENN: Oh, my gosh.

RAYMOND: They know the risks. They know the risks.

He had a little -- just in case, if I go to the left or to the right, that he would be able to squeeze through.

And he did!

So all of the spectators. They were safe.

They were at a safe distance.

You know, we can't do the jump, if we're out there risking people's lives.

And with the help of the summer night crews, the city of Somerset, all the police and fire and EMS, everybody worked together with my team.
I have the best crew in the world.

And, yes, I am the driver that does the jump. And, you know what, we had to build that tarp.
We had to build that tarp, and there was a team of us. And my crew was so great.

They said, look at everything -- we'll get everything done.

Relax. They knew I was nervous.

You know, and they know that my team -- you couldn't ask for a better stunt team.

GLENN: I have so many questions for you.

But let me start here. Before we go too much further away from the town.

Who the hell is the mayor of the city council?

I love these guys.

I can't think of another city in America, that would be like, yeah. We got that historic you fountain, right downtown.

Yeah. Go ahead.

RAYMOND: America is back, baby. I'm telling you. You couldn't have been telling -- from the Dukes of Hazzard. Forty-five years. Forty-seven years after the show ended.

GLENN: Oh.

RAYMOND: I'm telling you, people love -- from all walks of life, people love the Dukes of Hazzard, they love the General Lee.

Listen, if there was -- if there was ever a non-racist TV show for all, it was the Dukes of Hazzard. And that's my main goal.

My pain goal is to get this TV show back on television, that way, we have our children. And our grandchildren. Watching a TV show that has family values good.

GLENN: Okay. So let me -- let me -- one more question on this, before I -- what the hell is wrong we?

When did you decide, this is what I want to do with my life?

RAYMOND: Okay. So I was always a fan. I was born in '77. The show came out in '79. And I loved that big orange car. I loved that car.

GLENN: So great. So great.

RAYMOND: So in 2005, I watched legendary stuntman Corey Spence jump over my roscoe cart. By my police car that I have.

They jumped over it, at the very first General Lee jump site, in Oxford College, in -- in Georgia.

And that's when I got bit by, what I called the stunt bug.

And I was like, I've got to do this. I've got to do -- if I on me do it once, I've got to do it.

And this was my 30th General Lee jump.

For our 30th -- Detroit. We jumped the General Lee downtown Detroit. And then for our 30th, we're jumping over the historic fountain in Somerset, Kentucky.

GLENN: I don't know. This is different. You know, downtown Detroit, you crash into buildings. There's nobody around.

Oh, well.

In Somerset, Kentucky, though. It's just a different thing.

Okay. Let me -- let me -- I think this is amazing.

In looking into you, while the jump is phenomenal. And makes you feel good. What you have gone through in the last few years, is even more amazing.

You had a -- a rare brain surgery, right?

A rare hormonal disorder, that you were like, living another classic TV show, the hulk!

You -- it was changing you, right?

Tell me about this!

JASON: Yeah. So in 2015, I started to feel a lot of pain in my knees, and my elbows.

I started noticing my voice was changing.

My face was changing. And then here comes, hey, Ray. You have to give up blood pressure medicine. You're prediabetic.

You're 335 pounds.

You know, I was always around 220 pounds.

And so nobody -- because -- it's over a long, long, long period of time.

The people that are in my life, every day, they couldn't see the changes.

You know, but the people I haven't seen Ray in a year or two years. You look different, Ray.

You know, and so I went to our local dermatologist, because I started getting these creases in my head. It's bad enough. I'm bald. What are these lines in my head now?

So the dermatologist, she said, let me see your hands. Yeah. You have big hands.

Yeah. Every time I shake somebody's hands. It's like shaking hands with a cinder block.

GLENN: Like banana hands.

JASON: Yeah. My feet went from a size ten to 12.

I had to get a 2X helmet. Because my helmet wouldn't fit.

GLENN: Wait. Wait. Wait pick up wait.

Did you think you were ideas just gaining weight. Or did you know it was something more?

You weren't starving yourself, were you?

RAYMOND: Yeah. Because heavy stunt drivers don't make good stunt drivers. You get hurt a lot easier. It's a lot more weight.

GLENN: Of course.

RAYMOND: All of my loved ones and my crew. It's the jumps are tearing you up.

I'm like, no. No. No. No. It's not the jumps. Don't blame the jumps.

So I said, okay.

So went to the doctor. They said, go give this blood work. You may have something serious going on.

The blood work came back. My growth hormone was 900. 900. Now, normally it was 70 to 270. I'm 47 years old, and I'm still a grown boy!

So that opted for me, to get the -- or, the -- yeah, the MRI of my brain. To scan. And say, I had a 9-millimeter tumor on my 10-millimeter pituitary gland.

And we can have it on my body. And the surgeon, up in the Cleveland Clinic said, Raymond, if we don't get this out of you, it's going to kill you.

And my wife is crying. My daughter is crying.

The first thing that came to my lips was, can I still jump the General Lee after the significant other?

And the doctor said, yes, yes. And I'm like, okay. Let's do does this surgery. Let's get the thing out of my head. And then as soon as I was okay, we went up to the radical speech board in Canada. Joe came up there. We did the first international General Lee jump in front of like 30,000 people up there. And it was awesome.

I'm telling you. I'm living the dream, man. I can't believe this is happening to me.

All because of a TV show, called the Dukes of Hazzard.

GLENN: I have to tell you, I have to put an event together, just because I want to invite you to jump the General Lee over something.

We have to do --

JASON: Glenn, we want. We want to build an American patriot be General Lee.

And we want to put like, you know, 47, 45 on the doors. Put a big old American flag on the roof.

And we will call it The Jump for Trump 2045, and we want to jump in front of the White House. That's what we want to do.

GLENN: That's fantastic.

I'll bring it up to him. If there's any president that will do it. It will be him. He told me a story. He will probably do it on the White House grounds.

RAYMOND: Again, that would be awesome. He would want to do that.

GLENN: He told me a story, he said, you know, about the flagpoles. And he said, you know, he was afraid that all of the -- you know, all of the paperwork and, you know, government everything.

And he wanted to build a ballroom, and put the flagpoles up.

And he went to the guy at the White House, who runs everything at the White House. The architect.

And he said, so what is the paperwork like? And he said, you know, Mr. President, the White House belongs to the president while he's there.

So there's no paperwork. You would have to be the one that would sign all of it. And he's like, this is great.

I bet he could build that jump!

I bet he could build that jump, without any permits.

That is so fantastic.

JASON: In a few weeks. My team --

GLENN: That's fantastic.

JASON: We can build a great American -- they'll give us the panels to make the car, red, white, and blue. Big old American flag theme.

GLENN: That's fantastic.

RAYMOND: We'll call it the jump for Trump. We love Trump! The jump for Trump, and we will rock the White House.

GLENN: It is so great. I will bring it up to him. I will make sure he sees it, okay?

That is fantastic.

But listen, if he takes you up. I have to be there. I have -- you have to get me invited.

RAYMOND: Yeah. Glenn, I would be honored to put a passenger side seat in the car, and you can ride with me.

GLENN: No. No, no, no. No, no.

RAYMOND: Come on!

GLENN: I saw you come down, and my back -- I have a really bad back. And all I could really think of was, ow. Ow. That must have hurt.

RAYMOND: No. Last year, I hit the ramp at 72 miles an hour. I slide 200 at 17 feet. That's the longest General Lee jump in front of a large audience. And I landed a flat on all four wheels.

Had it not been for the safety equipment. That the legendary stuff that came up.

I would have either been killed or worse, paralyzed for the rest of my life.

And it's because of that safety equipment.

I'm not even sitting on the -- I'm painting from the ceiling with bungee cords.

GLENN: Unbelievable. Unbelievable.

I've got to meet you. I've got to meet you, Ray? Just --

RAYMOND: Let's jump in the White House. Let's jump in the White House.

GLENN: Thank you. Raymond. Northeast Ohio. Dukes founder and lead stuntman. You can find the website, north -- northeast Ohio.
Dukes.net.

Ray, we'll talk again. Thank you so much, God bless you, man.

RAYMOND: God bless you. God bless, America.

THE GLENN BECK PODCAST

"Everything is For Sale" — How the Cartels Control Mexico's Government

It is widely accepted that the cartels in Mexico not only control significant swaths of land, but they also have incredible influence over how the country's government operates. Border Expert Brandon Darby sits down with Glenn Beck to explain exactly why this is the case and what the Trump administration's strategy truly needs to be in order to crush these powerful cartels.

Watch Glenn Beck's FULL Interview with Brandon Darby HERE

We're being played. THIS is the REAL threat to America

Conservatives in America are being divided over the wrong things. Glenn Beck asks: Who’s the real threat to America: Sen. Mike Lee, who wants to sell 3% of federally-owned land to states and cities, or the rising radical communist wing of the Democratic Party, who recently chose Zohran Mamdani as their NYC mayoral candidate?

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: I want to talk to you about the enemy being clear. Crystal clear!

But I'm not sure to everybody.

I'm so sick and tired of us turning on each other.

We saw it with Elon Musk and Donald Trump. I like both men. Can we stop?

Thankfully, they did.

You're seeing it with Trump's bombing of Iran. Where you were either a Jew-loving Zionist or raging anti-Semite, or if you're me.

Both!

And then there's something that really caught me off-guard. The people who are turning on Utah Senator Mike Lee over a housing proposal, he's had this housing proposal since 2022.

But if you go on X, you're going to learn, apparently Mike Lee, one of the most Constitutional loving conservatives I know, wants to sell off our national parks and forest.

You know, he was probably in Coeur d'Alene lighting the matches, because he hates our forest so much. He wants to make sure you never get to hunt.

All he wants to do is take away your fishing and hunting rights. And build cheap housing complexes. Amazon warehouses. And whatever China and BlackRock want.

You know, I addressed this a few weeks ago. I invited Mike to clarify where he stands. Because some of my family are very concerned.

You can find the segments on my YouTube channel. Go and subscribe to my YouTube channel. Will you please? But since then, apparently, there's a crusade out to cancel Senator Lee.

There have been a few major updates. So today, let me just take a look at just the facts here, where we stand on this right now.

Over the weekend, Mike Lee decided to withdraw his federal land sale provision from the big, beautiful bill.

He said, quote, while this has been a tremendous amount of misinformation, and in some cases, outright lies about my bill. Many people brought forward sincere concerns.

Because of the strict constraints of the budget reconciliation process, I was unable to secure clear, enforceable safeguards to guarantee, these lands would never be sold.

Only to American families. Not to China. To not BlackRock.

And never to any foreign interests.

Wow! What a shill for the globalists, right?

Or maybe how it should work. Members of Congress propose something presented to the people. And then they listen to the community. Instead of just insisting, we have to pass it, to know what's in it.

And I didn't hear this kind of outcry for that!

Here's one of the bigger issues here. We're speaking two different languages.

A lot of criticism online is that Mike Lee wants to sell off our public lands!

Our public lands. Pragmatism to a lot of Americans, those lands are the lands we use for recreation. And hiking. And haunting. And fishing.

And things like that. That's whatnot he wanted to sell. And he promised to make that much clearer in the revised bill.

Now, let me remind you, on the public lands. President Biden, under his administration. The federal government was ordered to conserve 30 percent of our lands. And our waters by 2030. So apparently, our public lands are being gobbled up even more.

That's another, I think six percentage points. Another 6 percent of the entire land in the United States, going to be seized by the federal government, by 2030. And it falls directly in line with the UN's 30 by 30 plan.

It's an initiative for governments to seize 30 percent of all land and water by 2030. Now, do you think the UN wants to give you more hunting and fishing land?

Do you think they're all for that? Or do you think these radical environmentalists want to restrict your access in the name of fighting climate change?

By the way, current -- currently, the US government owns 640 million acres of land. That's nearly a third of the country. So they've almost met that 30 by 30 goal.

And they will meet it, and then what's next? The 50 by 50 UN goal.

And in order to seize the rest of the land, there's the Sustains Act that passed. Do you know about this? I didn't hear about any outcry for this.

Where was the right on this one? It was enacted in 2023, allows the government to receive private funds to advance conservation programs.

So BlackRock, if they wanted to, could buy up the conservation lands! Does your property contribute to pollination, photosynthesis. The air we breathe. The water we drink?

Well, as I -- as I exposed, on a show back in September, the Sustains Act allows all of that to be monetized through the relationship of private investors like Bill Gates. And the government!

And it occurs without the landowners permission.

So they can take your land. Or tell you exactly what you want to do, or what they want you to do on that land, what you cannot do on that land, because photosynthesis happens.

Where was I?

Where were you on that?

This is the real seizing of American assets.

This is the real seizing of American assets, by the global corporations. That you were all so afraid of!

Mike Lee, oh, my gosh.

What about the Sustains Act?

In his revised bill. Which he's still working on.

Lee has promised to remove all forest land. Good. Significantly reduce the amount of BLM land in the bill.

Good. Only land within 5 miles of population centers is eligible.

Yeah. But when he gets that, then he'll build buildings there, and then he'll have another five.

And next thing you know, he will be putting a cap on -- on Old Faithful.

He'll establish freedom zones to ensure these lands benefit American families. Ranchers. Recreational users. But there's a lot of claims online.

Whatever.

Charlie Kirk said, the Democrats -- this is their war on single family housing.

Hmm.

Do you remember when we talked on the program about the globalist plan of 15-minute cities. That all of BlackRock and everything else is for.

Remember when BlackRock came in, and just started buying up whole neighborhoods. Just priced every regular citizen out of the neighborhood.

Why?

Because it's part of the plan to pack the majority of humanity into easily controllable cities where everything you need is just 15 minutes away. And you never need a car. But is that the American dream?

Currently, rural land is getting so expensive. Most Americans can't afford rural land!

I know. I'm living in a place that has a population of 400 -- I think it's 51. Might have had a baby, so maybe it's 452. And nobody can afford it.

How is it possible you're living in the middle of nowhere, with a population of 451 people, and you can't afford a house!

The elites don't need Mike Lee's proposal. But take more of your land.

They're already doing that. But here's my biggest issue.

This is not about Mike Lee's proposal. Okay?

It's not.

There is a much bigger issue.

And I'll share that when I come back.

GLENN: Welcome to the Glenn Beck Program. So I was talking about federal -- I want to get off that. I want to change to, instead, what the real problem here is.

What the real problem is. The real problem on the seizing of the federal lands. Is that we are so quick to turn on ourselves.

We are so quick, lately, to turn on our -- our allies.

See, that's -- the issue isn't Mike Lee's proposal.

It's how fast we turn on each other!

If you believe Mike Lee's proposal didn't go far enough to safeguard our land from adversaries. Great!

That's fine. And, you know what, you won!

He's revamping that.

He listened.

The government listened. Good!

But can you say that without calling him a traitorous shill for the elites?

I mean, I don't know what traitorous shill for the elites that actually listens.

Do you?

Donald Trump Jr. He was against my plan. He thanked him over the weekend for pulling the proposal saying, quote, Mike is a great friend. And we usually agree on almost everything. But this was a rare exemption of where we didn't! Hello!

We don't need to hear people tear each other down. Who is our real enemy?

Who is -- who is more dangerous?

Can we go to -- can we go?

I don't have number on these, unfortunately. Six.

Seven, eight, nine, ten. Let's go to cut ten, please, on whiter neighborhoods.

VOICE: I realized there's a policy proposal, and I'm going to quote it for folks to shift the tax burden from overtaxed homeowners in the outer bureaus toward expensive homes in richer and whiter neighborhoods.

Explain why you are bringing race into your tax proposal.

VOICE: That is just a description of what we see right now.

It's not driven by race.

It's more of an assessment of what neighborhoods are being undertaxed versus overtaxed. We've seen time and again, that this is a property tax system that is inequitable. It's one that actually Eric Adams ran on, saying that he would change in the first 100 days.

He since sought to defend it, and lost at every juncture in court.

VOICE: And I understand, you're saying, we're simply describing the types of neighborhood that would see these increases in taxes.

And yet by invoking race, do you run the risk of potentially alienating key constituents.

STU: I think I'm just naming things as they are. And ultimately, my -- the thing that motivates me in this, is to create a system of fairness.

It's not to work backwards from an original assessment of our neighborhood or our city. Rather, it's to ensure that we actually have an equal playing field.

And right now, what we see with the property tax system, is one that is overtaxing a number of New Yorkers and undertaxing others. And inability of political will to resolve that.

VOICE: So no plans to change that language on your website?

VOICE: The focus here is to actually ensure a fair property tax system, and the use of that language is an assessment of the neighborhood.

GLENN: Just want it to be fair. Just want it to be fair. Play the next cut. This is Mamdani, by the way, the candidate in New York, that looks like he might win, to become the next mayor of New York. Next cut.

VOICE: You are a self-described democratic socialist. Do you think that billionaires have a right to exist?
(laughter)

VOICE: I don't think that we should have billionaires, because frankly it is so much money, in a moment of such inequality.

And ultimately, what we need more of is equality across our city, and across our state, and across our country.

And I look forward to work with everyone. Including billionaires. To make a city that is fair for all of them.

GLENN: Wow!

That is fantastic.

We shouldn't have billionaires.

Hmm. So how would we get there?

What would be his ultimate goal?

Listen.

VOICE: Do you like capitalism?

VOICE: No. I have many critiques of capitalism.

And I think ultimately, the definition for me, of why I call myself a Democratic Socialist.

Is the words of Dr. King decades ago. He said, call it democracy, or call it democratic socialism.

There must be a better distribution of wealth for all of God's children in this country.

And that's what I'm focused on, is dignity and taking on income inequality. What the purpose is about, about this project, is not simply to raise much consciousness, to win socialism.

And obviously raise class consciousness. We were a part of that. But making sure that we have candidates that both understand that and are willing to put that forward, at every which moment they have.

Every which moment that they are given.

We have to continue to elect more socialists. And we have to ensure that we are unapologetic about our socialism. And there are also other issues that we firmly believe in.

Whether it's BS -- right? Or whether it's the end goal of seizing the means of production, where we don't have the same level --

GLENN: Wait. Can you say that again for me?

Whether it's the end goal of ceasing is the means of production.

Let me ask you the question: Which is more dangerous to our country, and our heritage?

Is it the -- the senator?

That controversial maybe. Says 3 percent of federal land should be transferred back to the states?

Or is it the politician standing at a modem declaring, you know, not in some offhanded gap, that he has a real problem with capitalism. That he wants to tax white neighborhoods. That he wants to get rid of billionaires. And seize the means of production.

Now, for those who studied history. I don't need to tell you why your blood has suddenly run cold. Seize the means of production, that's not economic theory.

That is a revolutionary war cry. It always has been. It's the heart of Lenin, of Marx, of Mao. Of Gulags. Of five-year plans. A food line. Total state control. It is the slogan, whispered in the barracks of all of the camps.

Printed on the walls of the Khmer Rouge Torture cells.

That's not American. That's not a goal any of us should look for. But let's take down Elon Musk.

Let's -- let's take down our FBI.

Let's -- let's take down Mike Lee. Let's take down Tucker Carlson. Let's take down at the scene. Because we don't have enough enemies. Riley rightfully, somebody on this program, asked around on this time, on Friday. Glenn, why did you have Steve Bannon on? This is why I had Steve Bannon. We have enough enemies, don't we?

Can we find people we generally agree with, maybe 80 percent. Even if that 20 percent is massive!

If I'm going to be friends with anybody, for the times I'm going to be friends with.

Then I have to say, I part with you here.

You will have to go on your own way. But when you come back to this, I'm with you.

We are -- we are being -- our college campuses, the floor of our own legislative bodies. As if it were another just regular day in paradise of America.

You know, let me -- we want to talk about highway funding and seizing the means of production.

Wait. What?

Meanwhile, the man who says, we should return a tiny sliver of public land. Land that Washington hoards like a miser. While local communities struggle to pay for schools and police.

Why you can't afford a house!

That's an extremist. A radical. A threat. But this guy, I don't see anybody on the right, really standing up against this guy. Where is the big movement against this guy? It's almost as if, that whole federal lands thing, was orchestrated. And so many of our side played right into it!

That man who says, let the states manage their own forests, their own minerals, their own resources.

Just give us 3 percent of our land, so we can actually have a tax base, so we can build some houses there that people can afford. Let's make sure that the land is controlled by the people, who are closest to that land.

Let them be the stewards of it. Not the bureaucrats 2,000 miles away, who have never set foot in a pine thicket, or a desert mesa.

Which one is more in line with the Constitution? Which one is our bigger enemy here? Which one echoes Jefferson's belief in a government closest to the people? Which upholds the vision of the Founders who feared centralized power, more than foreign armies. Which one is calling for the seizing of the -- of the production?

You know, not all ideas are morally equivalent.

We're not dealing here with difference of opinion on tax rates. Or zoning codes.

One wants to give power back to the states.

And, you know what?

People rose up, and said, I don't like that idea.

So that idea has to be closed and forfeited.

Great! But where are the people standing up saying, seizing the means of production?

This guy wants to take control of your factory. Your farm.

Your business, your labor.

One believes in federalism. The other believes in collectivism. One respects the individual as a moral agent of society. And the other sees the individual as a cog in the great machine of the state that's just going to make utopia. Because they always do!

As you just -- you just can't see it. Because you're behind the barbed wire fence!

When somebody shrugs and says, you know, both sides are really pretty extreme. You know, it's time we say, no, no, no, no.

It's that kind of false equivalence that got us into this mess. That's how the frog stays in the pot as the water slowly boils. You know what, they're both really kind of extreme, no, they're not. No, they're not.

If you believe in America, is a place where rights are granted by God, not government.

Where property is yours. It is sacred!

The fruits of your labor belong to you. That we cannot pretend these are equal threats.

Because they're not. Because one man questions how much land the federal government should own.

The other questions whether you should be allowed to own anything at all!

If the government should not own everything!

Which one is dangerous? Which one snuffs out your rights?

It's not about land. This is all about economics. It's about freedom. And history has already told us where these roads lead.

One road leads to liberty. One road leads us to having a discussion and a debate.

Without calling each other names and killing one another.

The other road doesn't allow debate. And if you try to debate, you're disappeared, or you're killed! One leads in liberty, one ends in chains!

What do you say, we -- we have enough enemies. Why do we need to turn on ourselves? And do you think there's a possibility that the communist, the socialist, the anarchist, the Islamist will all band together, to destabilize the Middle East. Europe, come America to destabilize that, to end the Western world. Do you think there's a chance you're being played?

Because I do. And I refuse to be played. I'm not a moron. And neither are you.

See, here's the thing. This is why, when Ben Shapiro says, facts don't care about your feelings. This is why that's so important.

Because they've hit an emotional spot with you. They've hit a spot of, they're going to take my right away to fish or to hunt.

And that's not what he was doing. But that's what it turned out to be. Our sacred public lands.

It's not what he was talking about.

And if it was, he's not talking about it now.

He wants to make it very, very clear. Exactly what he was talking about.

But see, the idea of going hunting and fishing and hiking. And these glorious places.

We all love that.

I mean, I don't like to actually -- I like to hunt. I don't like to fish.

I don't like to be outside, really.

But I love the lands. I love to be in an air-conditioned car, driving through Yellowstone, going, wow. Look at that. And look at that moron, trying to feed the car, to feed the buffalo.

That's going to be fun to watch.

Why are we so emotional, about that? When it's not really what the argument is about. And it's coming from our friends, when we really should have listened more and had a conversation.

And we're not emotional about someone who says, the end goal is to seize production.

Seize the means of production.

That's Karl Marx!

Why is that one not emotional for us?

Why is it we cannot see the actual enemy?

Introducing 'The Torch'

Tough news week. Tough news month. Always, it seems, another five-alarm fire, or the spotting of arsonists that no one will pay attention to.

The people who watch and support this show—you—are extraordinary.

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How close is Britain to an ISLAMIST takeover?

British columnist Melanie Phillips joins Glenn Beck to expose how close the UK may be to an Islamist takeover. She explains the key difference between Muslims and Islamists and why the UK government may soon crack down on so-called “Islamophobia.”

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: Melanie, we only had a couple of minutes yesterday. And I appreciate you coming back on today, on the podcast, and the radio podcast.

Melanie is with The Times of London. She's a columnist there. She's also the author of Builder's Stone. And we were talking about your battle with Islamism, last night. Thank you for coming on, Melanie.

MELANIE: My pleasure. Good to speak to you again, Glenn.

GLENN: So explain first, for anybody who doesn't understand, the difference between a Muslim and an Islamist.

MELANIE: Well, there are people who say, there is no difference. That Islam is one thing, and all Muslims are equally bad.

And I personally viewed the term, it sounded very helpful.

Because I think that there are plenty of Muslims, certainly in Britain, and elsewhere, who absolutely are fine, who have completely signed up to the Western values, that's why they have chosen to live in the West

They appreciate freedom of democracy and equality of women and so forth. But there's a very large number in the Muslim community, in Britain, and around the West, which is not fine.

These are what I would call Islamists. Or people who are offered to you, that Islam is a political project, which means that they have to impose Islam on the non-Islamic and not Islamic enough by their life world. And those are the people who are presenting the problem, which we are grappling with. And I do think it's important to make a distinction between the two.

GLENN: So the Islamist is somebody -- I would compare them to a communist for a fascist Nazi.

That it is their way or the how. And their goal is to spread this ideology, and make everybody uniform all around the world.

Is that too harsh of a comparison?

MELANIE: That's right. That's absolutely right. They divide the world into the realm of Islam, which is everything good. And under the realm of God, in their view. And the realm of the infidel. Non-Islam, where everything is bad. And everything is of the devil.

And the terrible thing is this: That this is a doctrine, of religious fanaticism.

They believe they have a -- literally a sacred butte.

A God-imposed duty. To convert the entire world to Islam.

And consequently, these are people who you cannot negotiate with. One of the problems with the west, is that it views these people like everybody else in the world, through the prism of the West. They think that -- people in the West think that people in the Islamic world are all like them. Governed by reason and self-interest. They really can't get their heads around in the West, the idea that religious fanaticism is something completely different.

Islamic suicide bombers blow themselves to smithereens. They're not doing it from despair. Which is what the West thinks. The West thinks, why on earth would they do that, if they weren't in despair? On the contrary, they are doing it because they are ecstatic that they are doing the work of God. You can also believe in the west. You know, why would Islamists want to hurt us in America? We have done nothing to hurt them.

That's not the way it works.

The Islamist thinks that it's their sacred duty to convert everybody, at the point of -- at the end of -- of -- to Islam. It's nothing to do with what the West have done to them.

It is how they see their sacred religious duty in the world. That's the terrifying thing which so many in the world, I think just don't appreciate.

GLENN: Well, let me play devil's advocate, and say what everybody in the media would say to you. While there are religious extremists that are Christians as well, and they are just as dangerous, and you know it.

MELANIE: No. They're not as dangerous. There are religious extremists, who are Christians. And some of them resort to violent acts.

But they don't have the view that the entire world has to be dominated by their point of view. And they are not setting out to dominate the world.

And even if they are, in their own minds, they are a tiny fringe. Revealing -- in the world of Islam. Although, as I said, we must be very careful, not to paint all Muslims with the same brush.

However, the dominant authority in the world of Islam are all committed to this jihadi outlook. This belief that the non-Islamic world has to be converted to Islam.

And that is the problem. You have a kind of institutional impetus, behind this terrible thing.

Whereas, extreme Christians.

You know, they appear. They do terrible things.

But nevertheless, it's well within our ability to control it.

When you're dealing with so many millions of people in the world of Islam, who are out to destroy the free world.

You're dealing with something completely different.

GLENN: And isn't that why the country -- ours, yours, Europe, are remaining silent and instead, silencing those who are speaking up and speaking the truth?

I mean, what's happening in England with the silencing of free speech is terrifying.

MELANIE: Yes, I think it's certainly a large part of it. And I followed this for many years, the attitude of the governing glass of Britain, to what I would call the steady of process of Islamization, which has been going on.

And I think that there's more than one reason for that.

Certainly a principle reason is fear. Because the numbers are so great, you know, in absolute terms, the numbers who are posing a direct threat to Britain are enormous. The security further says, that these are the people -- of the thousands of people on its books and a direct threat to Britain.

Although, it's comprised something like, important to officials. Something like 6 percent of the population of Britain.

The security service of MI5 says they compose 19 percent of those who are posing such a serious threat, that they're on their books. So this is a terrible problem for sure. And it's one that in terms of numbers, has spooked successive governments so that they run away from it. But there's another reason that successive governments run away from it.

Which is that the liberal world, by which I mean, not just people who are like the Labor Party, which is in the government now. But there's also the conservative party, that preceded it.

They all signed up to the overarching default liberal position. That the West cannot assert its superiority, over any other culture.

To do so is racist.

And therefore, you cannot criticize the world of Islam. Because that is racist. Or to use the other phrase, Islamophobic.

In other words, it's a kind of prejudice or bigotry, to criticize a minority group. One that is showed to be oppressed, by the West for centuries.

And consequently, it cannot bring itself to even name what it's up against. Because it tells itself what to say, that a very serious, and a unique problem in the Muslim community and Britain. In the Islamic world in general, that is a form of racism and Islamophobia.

And so the most we can agree to, is that there are a few crazies in that world. And then try to explain those away, in -- it would be comical, were it not so dangerous.

You know, when it comes to the Islamic extremism, well, there's nothing Islamic about it.

It's just extremism.

It just arrived out of a clear blue sky.
It's ludicrous what they got deeply tangled into.

JASON: Hi, Melanie, my name is Jason, I'm one of Glenn's researchers. And I've been fascinated, I guess horrified by watching some of this. And also, you cannot speak about any of this. You are merely shut down. In America, we have groups, that are partnering with the left. Groups like the counsel on Islamic -- American Islamic relations. Do you have something similar over in the UK, that's playing that role of pressuring people, pressuring lawmakers to where, you will go this way? Or you will not say something like no-go zones. Or there will be ramifications?

MELANIE: Well, we don't have something exactly parallel to CAIR. But we have Muslim Brotherhood-funded groups, of which --

GLENN: Close enough.

MELANIE: Right. The liberal council in Britain, which is the British home office and sort of security base of the government department has treated with great caution and disdain. And I think it has refused to negotiate or talk to it. I'm not sure that's still the case.

But there is -- there is a vast number of charities which are basically Muslim Brotherhood charities, which aren't touched, because the government refuse to see ban the Muslim Brotherhood. And I think this applies to America as well.

They refuse to ban the Muslim Brotherhood. Partly because it's very difficult to get a hold of -- it's a secretive organization, that hides behind apparently, legitimate charities. Voluntary groups. Nevertheless, it's very much there.

The people in those groups adhere to the teachings of the foundational characters of modern-day Islamism. Political Islam.

Jihadi Islam.

And there are a number of people in Britain, people who are very well-informed about this. Who said for years, Britain should outlaw the Muslim brotherhood, and got to the essential, to stop it from proselytizing and from radicalizing.

So many impressionable young Muslims. And I think that's true of Americans too.

You know, CAIR is regarded in a kind of legitimate partner, by -- by successive administrations. In various respects. Now, this is all disastrous. And that really has to stop.

GLENN: Okay. Let me take a one-minute break. And then come back with you, Melanie. I want to ask you, how close to the edge, are we? I feel like we're getting to a place where we're so complacent. And you first. We will lose our rights to speak out about this.

And then that will sow trouble on the streets, and eventually what happened to Iran, just happens.

How does this -- how does a great society, that is western, and open, and educated, all of a sudden, you know, start putting their women in burqas.

It happened where before. And it looks like it will happen to Europe and England. And could happen here in America.

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(music)

GLENN: You're hearing Melanie Phillips. She's a broadcaster on radio and TV, gives public presentations all across the English-speaking world.

She also writes a weekly column for the Times of London and has written a book called The Builder's Stone. Welcome back, Melanie.

How close to the edge is -- let's just say England?

To real civil unrest, or a possible, you know, 1979 Iran kind of thing?

Do you see that in the cards at all?

MELANIE: I think there's still sufficient people in Britain, who are authentically British, who have a sense of authentic British culture. Which is the culture which has never resulted to violence, unless its back is absolutely against the wall. It's pretty tolerant. It's pretty mild. And it prefers to deal with the democratic process. And I think that's kind of playing out now. I -- certainly, you can say, how close are we? In general, I think that the West, Europe in general, is extremely close to being submerged by all this.

So it's Britain. Look at the demographic projections. I forget now, by which year. But basically, in the next few decades, you know, various countries are going to have very, very significant Muslim minorities, and even a Muslim majority.

So that is clearly, you know, a difficulty.

Things could be done, and I have some hopes, that things will be done. Because although the elites, the political and cultural elites have their heads firmly turned the other direction, nevertheless, we've seen the lives of so-called populist parties in Britain and Europe.

Which are parties, whether you like them or not, is not the issue. Some of them are pretty obnoxious.

Basically, they're responding to the fact that millions and millions of ordinary, decent people, who want to live in a place that they feel is their homeland. They feel a connection to their nation.

They want to feel pride in their nation. They want to feel that their nation has historic value for being themselves. With people who share their common purpose.

Those people felt completely abandoned and betrayed by the entire political establishment. So we're seeing the rise of populism. And I think therefore, in the Democratic process, we are going to see the election of people who are going to be much more robust.

Now, what could they do? There are things they could do.

Because the Islamists have made the roads heavy, because they have correctly perceived, there's a vacuum. It's not happened so much in America.

But this Britain, in particular, have been the sort of western world leader, this the post-moral, post-religious, Britain is godless.

By and large, the church, unlike in America, has not maintained a defense against the erosion of Biblical -- it's lit the charge against it.

Amazing, as that may seem. And so if you have a vacuum, and you have a society which tells itself, it was born -- the original sins. Conquests. So there are very things that the west could do to defend itself.

GLENN: Melanie, I'm out of time. Thank you so much for talking to us again today.
You're -- you're a real beacon of light and courage. And I wish there were many more people like you. Melanie Phillips.