RADIOAugust 19, 2024

Did a Secret Service agent plant the Jan. 6 pipe bomb at the DNC?

Newly released security footage from outside the DNC headquarters on January 6, 2021, has raised even more questions about the day's timeline. The footage shows a man with a bag getting out of a police vehicle and walking off camera in the direction where a pipe bomb was found just minutes later. So, did this man — possibly a Secret Service agent — plant the bomb? Glenn speaks with Blaze Media investigative journalist Steve Baker, who warns against jumping to conclusions too early. But he also explains how we can find out: "The FBI can solve this for us today if they will release the DNC's own security cameras." Steve also discusses why he believes the pipe bombs were planted in the first place.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: Okay. We didn't spend a lot of time on it. Because I thought, well, it might have been that. It might have been a lot of things.

You know, I'll wait for Steve Baker to pin this down. Then this weekend, I saw Darren Beattie of Revolver News come out. And he said, it is the police.

Okay. That's kind of a big deal. I mean, that's earth-shattering. Steve Baker joins us now from the Blaze. Steve, is this new information, or the same information that you had?

STEVE: Hey, this is exactly the information that we had, and we released early last week.

But I think that whether it's Darren or any other journalist, stepping out and saying that this is conclusively proved that the police planted that bomb, is getting a little bit ahead of themselves.

And I'll tell you why, we had the video of the -- what we believe to be a Secret Service agent, exiting a metropolitan police vehicle.

He steps out of frame. He's carrying a bag in his hand.

But he steps out of frame.

And then two minutes later, he steps back into the camera frame once again. That is not proof, that he set a bomb down. But it does make us ask questions. And it makes us question the FBI directly, once again, as we did in our article, which was our lead in that article. Was the FBI can solve this for us today, if they will release the DNC's own security cameras. Their own security cameras. Are aimed and focused on exactly that spot.

Where the bomb was placed. But they have never released that to the public.

GLENN: So it is -- I mean, I have to tell you, I mean, if you have to take a leap of faith.

You're force Todd take a leap of faith. And you look at you all of the evidence. It is circumstantial. But it is pretty good, especially when the DNC has that video, and won't release it.

Why wouldn't you release the video?

STEVE: That's the great question about this bomb, and that's what makes as you're saying there, this so -- such a -- it's such an easy thing to come to a conclusion on, when you have a bomb that was allegedly placed, 17 hours earlier, around -- 7:30, 8 o'clock, the night before.

And then it allegedly sat there, undetected, during all that time, with so much foot traffic, that morning. So many officers on that building. From various agencies. Two different bomb teams, facility.

We know that from the OIG report that came out, a couple weeks ago.

There is this mounting evidence, that there -- there just couldn't have been a bomb there for 17 hours.

But somehow, some way, 15 minutes before it was discovered.

We see a guy, getting out of a car. Bag in his hand. He walks over that direction into that -- you know, it's a blind spot in the camera coverage from the CCTV --

GLENN: Because they moved it, right?

STEVE: Well, this particular camera, we went back. We went back, eight days.

That camera had been fixed for eight full days, prior to this event.

And than a camera begins moving five minutes after the alleged discovery of the bomb. By a plane clothes police officer. So then suddenly. So that camera starts moving by remote control.

It focuses in, it zooms in to that location. Between the benches. You can kind of pick up a little bit of a visual of the bomb, when that camera moves.

And then it sweeps away, and then within 30 minutes. Whoever the operator was, turned that camera off of the investigative seen, full 90 degrees away from it, and it never returned the rest of the day.

GLENN: So this takes us into a whole new territory, if this is true. And this is why, as much as I believe this probably is what happened, you don't want to go there. You know. Unless it's absolutely true.

And I don't know how we would ever prove that.

But this, you say. Why do you say this was a Secret Service agent?

STEVE: Mainly because of the way he was dressed. It was a Secret Service detail, and the Secret Service were mainly with metropolitan police officers that day in that detail, which is not uncommon. They do assist -- the local police do assist the Secret Service. And there was, of course, the facts that we learned sometime. Well, a year later, after January 6th, that Kamala Harris was actually inside the building at that time.

GLENN: So what do you think, why was it planted?

STEVE: This is no doubt. Now, I have no problem, going out, and declaring the reason for it, being planted. The reason for that bomb and the one for the RNC. The Capitol Hill club. Was diversionary. They were specifically planted, to divert resources from the Capitol. Bear in mind, that only five minutes, before the first breach of the West front there at the Capitol, on January 6th, that's when the first bomb was found at the RNC.

And then only two, three minutes before the breach, this particular -- what we think is a Secret Service agent, wearing a trench coat, carrying a bag, just two to three minutes before that barrier -- or, barricade breach at the Capitol, this guy disappeared, towards those benches. And then he's back, and then five minutes later -- or, 15 minutes later, some minutes after the barricade breach, the Capitol Police plainclothes officer found the bomb.

And that diverted resources from the Capitol that were needed.

GLENN: So do you think it was ever supposed to go off?

STEVE: No. The bombs were not viable. They were absolutely props.

And we know that beyond any shadow of a doubt. We have direct testimony from one of the agents, that worked on that bomb scene.

That worked on the investigation of the bomb. And he was told by his superiors, that these devices were not viable.

GLENN: What's your gut tell you on this?

STEVE: My -- my gut tells me, that we're going to learn who this man is.

That's the first thing. And that's one of the reasons why it would be reckless for us, to declare him -- that he had the bomb. That would be, there was probably some legal jeopardy to do that.

But it's suspicious. We will learn who he is.

We will also eventually going to learn after three and a half years, I hope why Kamala Harris was in that building. Why she was not in the Capitol, where she was being basically coronated as then vice president. She was a voting senator at the time. She was the VP Elect at the time.

And the debate for her ascendancy, to Vice Presidency -- certification of the electoral college vote was taking place at the Capitol at the time, when she had been scheduled according to this same OIG report, she had been scheduled according to the Secret Service logs, two days in advance, that she was going to be at the DNC from 11:30 to 3:30 during the scheduled debate and during the scheduled vote. She was not going to be there.

And this is -- I'm telling you, Glenn. That's a bigger mystery to me, than even the bombs. But if we do discover that these bombs were, in fact, planted by one of the agencies. Secret Service. FBI. NPT. Capitol Police. It doesn't heart. We discover that. It literally, no pun intended, blows this thing up.

GLENN: Tell me about what you know about the Secret Service, and the body of the would-be assassin of Donald Trump.

Being cremated before Congress had a chance to examine and investigate. And also, that they -- they cleaned up biological evidence, and that apparently doesn't happen. Is that true?

STEVE: It shouldn't have happened, as soon as it did. That's the first answer.

It is not 100 percent uncommon. That if a case is clearly solved, that they don't clean up. And they don't take the body away.

Or that they don't go ahead and turn the body back to the family for how they wish to take care of the body at that point.

It's not uncommon. But this is not a common case. And that's why this should not have been done so soon.

I think Representative Clay Aiken from Louisiana is absolutely correct in that.

Now, as the law enforcement officer himself, sheriff in Louisiana, he would have seen the disposal of all types, of all types of homicides.

And he would know, based on the significance of this, that it should have been preserved, the body of Thomas Crook should have been preserved to have other investigators, back up autopsies, other examinations from different agencies to confirm, validate findings. Because if you don't do that, all you do is open up the conspiracy theories.

And you let it ride, that there must be a cover up. Now, we -- we're pretty sure there is a cover-up.

We're just don't know if they're covering up their incompetence, or if they're covering up something, well, much more sinister.

GLENN: What's your gut tell you?

STEVE: In this case, I'm in the camp, solidly, Glenn, that this young man was groomed, that he had help.

GLENN: Wow.

STEVE: I do not believe for a second, that there was a second shooter on the scene. Those conspiracy theories are easily disproven.

GLENN: Right.

STEVE: But we have one of our absolute, most trusted sources. Is an individual, who for 30 years, did this very thing for our government, overseas. In Africa. Middle East. Asia. Central America.

He told me, and I'm quoting, he said, what disturbs him the most about this particular case and Thomas Crooks. Is he says, I recognize my own handiwork.

GLENN: Hmm. Are we going to find out who it is?

STEVE: I'll tell you what, you know that I'm looking. You know that Joe Hanneman, who wrote this article -- who I wrote this article with. We will be looking at this thing for a long time.

GLENN: I wish you luck. And I hope that -- thanks for being responsible on this. I'm not saying that the other reporters are not. They may know something that I don't know. Or we don't know.

But I don't want to rush to anything. And get it wrong.

This is way too important.

If that's true, then your Deep State is exposed.

And nobody is safe. Nobody is safe.

Thank you so much, appreciate it.

STEVE: Thank you, Glenn.

GLENN: You bet. Steve Baker from TheBlaze.

The Dark Truth Behind Queer Theory & Gender ‘Affirmation’ For Children | Liz Wheeler & Glenn Beck

In this explosive conversation, Glenn Beck and Liz Wheeler expose the disturbing roots of gender ideology and queer theory — and how these radical ideas are directly targeting children. From the shocking origins of queer theory, where pedophilia and child pornography were openly defended, to Planned Parenthood’s new role as one of the largest distributors of transgender hormone therapy, the truth is undeniable: this movement is not about freedom or equality, but about dismantling families, corrupting innocence, and profiting off of our children’s pain. What we are witnessing is nothing less than a satanic ideology dressed up as compassion — and it’s spreading like wildfire through schools, culture, and medicine. Parents, you need to hear this. The time to protect your children and fight back is NOW.

Watch the full episode HERE

Here’s how INTENSE JFK’s Presidential Fitness Test was

President Trump recently signed an executive order to reinstate the Presidential Fitness Test and the media is in a frenzy. But Glenn and Stu look back at the history of these tests, including JFK’s version of the Test that seems IMPOSSIBLE for modern Americans. But Glenn has a secret reason for why he’s confident in his pull-up abilities…

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: What is the -- what is the new physical -- the president's physical fitness, you know, plan?

STU: Well, the thing that RFK Jr and Hegseth were rolling out the other day. I don't know if it was the full test or anything, but they were issuing a challenge to America, to be able to do 100 pushups and 50 pullups within five minutes.

GLENN: That's crazy.

STU: Thank you! That struck you as also crazy.

I don't think there's ever been a time in my life, that I could do that. Let alone now with shoulder problems. And much too much weight.

GLENN: All right. But that was before I needed this walker.

STU: I don't think there was a time in my 20s or my teens, that I could do that. But that -- in five minutes? Fifty pullups?
GLENN: Both of them in 5 minutes.
STU: Yeah, both of them. So it's not like 100 pushups in five minutes. It's both tasks within five minutes.

GLENN: No. No. That's not true.

STU: RFK Jr. is just doing it in jeans.

GLENN: Yeah, well, RFK, he's -- he's a weirdo. I mean, he is. Come on. When it comes to fitness, he's a weirdo.
STU: Yes.
GLENN: I mean, he's done this his whole life. He's like 800 years old. He can still do it.

STU: Yes. Depressive, I will say.

GLENN: I don't know. He's a sex machine.

STU: Oh. That's been a problem for him. Yes, that's been an issue in his life. Yes.

GLENN: Okay. All right. Go ahead.

STU: Separate from the president's physical fitness test.

GLENN: Right.

STU: But, I mean, they don't, they don't really think we're going to do that, right?
Like, I mean, how long would that take you to do?

STU: I think for me, it would take a good month. I think a month, I could probably get two pullups a day. That would get me around, a little over 50. So I could do that. Plus, the pushups. A solid month, I could get that done.

GLENN: You could do more than two a day. You could do more than two a day.

STU: You know, Glenn, I've got to say. I think -- I will throw a number out there. No science behind this, so just as a guestimate.

I would say 40 percent of the population can't do any pullups. Maybe 30 percent. Thirty percent of the population can do exactly zero pullups. Precisely zero, so an infinite amount of time would be a correct answer for a third of the population.

GLENN: I think you're -- I think you're being -- I think you're being a little too optimistic. I think it's closer to 40 or 50. I think it's closer to 40 or 50. Maybe 60 percent.

STU: Right! Pushups are one thing. I mean, I think almost anyone can do a pushup. One --

GLENN: You can do a pushup. Yes. Yes.

STU: Singular pushup. And if you can do one, you can wait long enough, to do a second one.
And at some point, the hundred gets done. That's not the case with pullups. Pullups, you can sit there and think about how much you want to do a pullup for a really long time. But that doesn't make a pullup happen. If you've got a certain amount of weight on you. You're not doing a pullup. It's not occurring.

GLENN: I have no idea, how many pullups I can do.

STU: I have an exact number of pullups, you can do.

GLENN: Do you? You think so?

STU: Yeah. Yeah. I have the exact number. I have to calculate -- AI has been running a report on me. It came up with zero.

GLENN: Right. Right. Really?
I can do. I mean, this is so pathetic. Listen to this. I bet I could do three. You know, you could do three.

STU: In a row? Proper form.

GLENN: What do you mean in a row?

STU: I mean, holding on to the bar, without letting go, you're doing three. There's no way. I don't think so.

GLENN: I think I could do. Well, with proper form, I don't know about that. I don't know about that.

STU: I'm not saying it has to look pretty. You have to get your chin up above the bar. It can't be one of those things, where you're a quarter of the way up there.

GLENN: So I can do one and rest for ten minutes. I could do another one.

I think I can do that.

STU: If you -- I'm not saying, you jump up, and you pull yourself up as you're pulling up. Full hang --

GLENN: See, you may not know this.

But you know what, I've done the DNA test. Have you ever done the DNA test that tells you all about your genes and everything else? Mine came back with something remarkable, and I have to share. You might feel bad, next.
(laughter)

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STU: Coming up next, Glenn attempts live pullups on the air. Stay tuned!
(OUT AT 8:29 AM)

GLENN: You know no idea what who you're dealing with. No. You don't have any idea who you're dealing with here.

I got my DNA test back like 10 years ago. And we all -- we all took it, because we were looking for things. And so we all took it. My DNA test came back, and everybody in the family, their test made total sense. Like, oh, yeah. That makes...

Then we read mine. We have to find -- I have to find. See if Tania has it still. We should have had it framed. I swear to you, they -- they mixed me up with somebody else.

Somebody else is like, wait a minute. I'm this pathetic? Mine came out and said, you have the muscular structure of a -- of a -- something like a -- an elite athlete. You have the abilities and agility and everything else of an elite athlete. And I'm like, there's not a chance. I don't have any of that!

I don't even know if I have muscles. I have to check once in a while, and go, do I have muscles still?

Doctor is like, I don't know. Can I? Ask just press against my hand on the leg. I don't know.

You know, I don't know how to do that exactly. So --

STU: You sure it said elite athlete and not elephant? I mean, if they misspelled it.

GLENN: It was.

I was having eye problems at the time.

STU: No!

GLENN: I mean, we read it. And I was like Tania, I believe that for Tania.

Maybe they switched me and Tania. Because Tania is really strong. She'll kick your butt.

She works out every day. All of that. Me? Never. Never.

And it kind of makes me wonder, when I get to the other side, and the Lord went, okay.

So what did you do with your life again?

Because I gave this incredible body, and you wasted it the whole time.

And I'm like, you should have been more clear, okay?

You should have been more clear. I -- maybe I could have played basketball. But I tried once. And it was embarrassing. It was embarrassing. It was like sixth grade. And I'll never live -- I don't even want to think about my time on a basketball court. Okay? So don't -- don't start with me. You should have made it a little clearer. When I first started to do stuff. And I think that's fair. I think that's a fair argument. In my defense. In my defense, Your Honor, God, you should have made it a little more clear.

STU: Yeah. I mean, if they really wanted us to do this, then the 11th Commandment is 50 pushups, and -- or, 50 pullups and 100 pushups, right?

Like, put it in a commandment if you really want us to do it. You have to be more specific, we're Americans.

GLENN: Okay. So let me give you the top of the list for the JFK Presidential Fitness Test. Okay? This is what you had to do in high school. In high school.

Thirty-four pullups. Bar dips: Fifty-two. What's -- because I believe I did that. A long time. And I don't recommend it.

STU: It's not a barhop.

GLENN: Oh, it's -- oh, bar dips. Okay. Okay. All right.

Bar dips: 52. Handstand pushups: Fifty. What are handstands?

STU: Oh, my God. Handstands.

GLENN: I can't even stand on my hands. Is that I'm doing a handstand and a push up? Because that's not happening. You're not human.

STU: Yeah. You're balancing yourself on your hands. Your feet are above your hands on the wall. Like a wall. And you're doing --

GLENN: Oh, so you're balancing yourself. That makes it a little easier. Still impossible.

But a little easier.

GLENN: Impossible. You could do precisely zero of those.

Aright. So you had to do 50 handstand pushups.

Or one arm -- 30 -- no, sir.

Twenty-six one-arm burpees in 30 seconds. Is that a one-armed push up?

STU: No. Well, you're bracing your yourself like you're about to begin a pushup in a burpee with only one arm, which that's not that difficult.

But then you're doing. Then you're like, you move your feet towards your hands. And then you jump up in the air basically. And then you do it repeatedly.

GLENN: No, no, no. That's ridiculous. No.

STU: There's a law of gravity. You're not supposed to violate it. If it was a recommendation of gravity, then maybe jumping would be appropriate. But it's not. Follow the law.

GLENN: In 48 seconds, you had to do a 3300-yard shuttle. Now, I've been to the airport. I think I've done a 3300-yard shuttle, but it depends on who is driving. You know.

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: Rope climb. Try this. Rope climb. Twenty feet, hands only! Sit start.

STU: That's what I remember from the president's physical fitness test. And I remember looking at that rope, like, no chance I could get up that thing.

GLENN: I remember looking up at that thing. Humiliation. Humiliation is coming my way. I'll never kiss a girl, because that ain't happening. I'll get maybe 10 feet up. Maybe. Maybe.

STU: And you were right for 24 years from that time, approximately.

GLENN: Agility run, 17 seconds. Extension pressups, what? What?

I'm sorry. Why am I so tired reading this?

Extension pressups. What's an extension pressup, 8-inch? You had to do 100 of them.

STU: Let's see. Exercise. An exercise for low-back pain involving lying on your stomach and pressing your upper body up with your arms while keeping your hips relaxed and down on the mat.

GLENN: Oh, I could do that know. 8 inches.

STU: The last part of it, relaxing down on the mat.
GLENN: That's what my doctor says I should be doing. What?

STU: I can do relaxed and down on the mat. That part of it --

GLENN: Yeah. I could do that -- I'm the only guy. I took yoga for a while, like three weeks. My wife is like, yoga. You could do yoga. Let's just do yoga together.

I did. And the yoga instructor said to me. Because we were doing a plank.

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: And she came and all I remember her waking me up. And saying, I think you're the only person I've ever -- ever taught that fell asleep in yoga. And I'm like, it's just so relaxing. Just let me sleep. Let me sleep.

STU: That's interesting, that you did yoga. Is there any footage of that? Any video that we could post? That would be good for --

GLENN: No. There's not. You had to do pegboard. Five trips of pegboard. And I think that's when you have the two pegs.

STU: Yes, it was a board.

GLENN: You have to take it out, and put it up, right?

STU: This is American Ninja Warrior. No way.

GLENN: There's no way. There's no way.

STU: This is amazing.

GLENN: Try this one: You had to do a 45-second handstand. I've never been able to do a handstand. Never!

STU: Never.

GLENN: And I'm an elite athlete. I'm an elite athlete. Try this one: A man carry, 5 miles.

STU: What? What do you mean a --

GLENN: Five-mile man carry.

STU: Is a man carry as obvious as it --

GLENN: I think it is.

STU: You're carrying --

GLENN: If I'm going to carry that man, you have to carry me that man for five miles.

I'm not sure, I can't carry any man for any miles. I mean, if I am -- if I am a firefighter, count on burning in the house. You're going to burn in the house. Because I can't carry you out. I can get in there and go, yeah, I will have to leave you.
I will have to leave you here. I can't help you, sorry.

It's also getting really hot in here. I have to go. You had to do a five-mile jog. An obstacle course.

You had to swim prone for a mile. You had to swim underwater for 50 yards, any strokes, two minutes. Deep waterfront, hang float, with arms. What? What is a deep water hang float with arms. Wait. Wait.

It's a deep waterfront hang float with arms and ankles tied for six minutes.

What kind of al-Qaeda PE class was this?

STU: Who has access to -- who has access -- like, you're in the middle of the country, you may not have a deep water body nearby. This is -- are you sure this is an actual test?

GLENN: This is the actual test. This is the actual -- what is a deep water front hang float with arms and ankles tied for six minutes? Can you look that up?

STU: A deep water hang float is an aquatic hang float done in the deep end of a pool with the aid of flotation device, such as a noodle or belt.

In this position, the flotation twice supports your upper body, while your legs and torso hang freely beneath you.

That can't be what it is.

GLENN: You can do that.

Deep-end of the pool.

STU: Can you bring a margarita?

GLENN: Man, this test is no big deal.

What! No way. No way!

Here's the last thing on the test.

A vertical tread in an 8-foot circle for two hours!

No way.

STU: Vertical tread in an 8-foot circle?

GLENN: So you're in the water and you're treading water in a circle for two hours. Two!

STU: This is not -- what?

This is not the test.

GLENN: It is. Now, I told you, this is the top of the test.

This is the top of the test.

So this is for the ones who could do all the other tests.

This was the top of the test. The bottom of the test is not that much better. Here's the entry, okay? Let's see. Pullups, 2/6/10. I don't know what that means. Pushups, 16, 24, 32. Bar dips, four, eight, and 12. Situps, 30, 45, and 60. Broad jump, 6-foot, 6, 6, 6. And 6, 9.

To jump 6 feet? I don't even know if --

STU: That one is possible, yes. Glenn, I know it sounds incredible. But, yes. That one is possible.

GLENN: Sounds incredible. You know, I think we should have the average person Olympics. I really do. I really do.

STU: Oh, I would watch that.

GLENN: I would watch that every time.

You see them coming. And you're like, hmm. That one -- three feet. I'm giving him 3 feet. 200-yard shuttle. Agility run. Rope climb, 18 feet, hands only. 880 yards in three minutes. A mile in seven minutes. Pegboard, six holes. A 50-yard swim. Forty -- 40, 50-yard swim in 36 seconds. Man carry, 880 yards. No, thank you! No, thank you!

Look at -- look at what we've gone down. That's the bottom of it. And I don't think most Americans could do that.

I couldn't. Well, I could. Because I'm an elite -- I have the body of an elite athlete.

STU: No. You could not. Now, of course -- let's just say, this is supposed to be for a high school kid. Right?

So this is the prime of your athletic life. Could you do some of these things? Probably.
GLENN: Go into high school.
Go into any high school, and ask them to do this. There's no way. And all of the kids would be.

STU: Well, that's kind of what the reaction would be.

GLENN: Don't get me wrong. I would have been there too. And my parents would have said, suck it up. Just do it.

So nothing has really changed.

STU: That's been the reaction to this proposal too, of bringing this back. Right? The media is covering this. Like, it's going to embarrass children.

You know, I mean, I do remember it being like, I can't do that. I'm not going to the top of that rope. That's not happening.

That's sort of life. Right? Sometimes you can do things. Sometimes you can't do other things.

GLENN: That's why you have to learn how to injure yourself.

You know, how many stairs can I throw myself down, to not do serious damage, but enough to get me out of PE.

STU: Yeah, you have to fake an why are. You have to learn from LeBron James. Act like you got hit in the eye. And fall down like you were just stabbed over and over again, like you were in an athletic competition.

GLENN: There's no way. There's no way.

THE GLENN BECK PODCAST

Whitney Webb: How You Can BREAK FREE of the Chains of the Elites

Are you truly free, or is your life quietly controlled by systems most Americans never question? In this eye-opening conversation, Glenn Beck speaks with investigative journalist Whitney Webb about how the Elites, banks, and global systems have created modern forms of enslavement, all while the public remains largely unaware. They discuss the urgent need for local self-reliance, alternative financial systems, and taking personal responsibility to protect yourself and your family. This is a wake-up call for anyone who believes freedom is guaranteed, and it’s time to see the truth and act before it’s too late.

Watch Glenn Beck's FULL Interview with Whitney Webb HERE

SHOCKING: Glenn Beck Interviews 'Detransitioner' Deceived by Doctors

Claire Abernathy was just 14-years-old when doctors told her parents she’d take her own life without hormones and surgery. They promised “gender care” would save her life. Instead, it left Claire with irreversible scars, broken trust, and a lifetime of regret. Her mom was told she was required to comply. No one ever addressed the bullying, or trauma Claire endured before being rushed into medical transition. Now, years later, both Claire and her mother are speaking out and exposing how families are misled, how doctors hide risks, and how children are left to pay the price. With federal investigations now underway, their story is a warning every parent needs to hear.