GLENNMarch 24, 2017

Glenn Talks With Megan Phelps-Roper, Former Westboro Baptist Church Member

Megan Phelps-Roper joined Glenn on radio this week for an enlightening discussion about her conversion from Westboro Baptist Church member to someone focused on understanding and inclusion. Like Glenn, Phelps-Roper is a hopeful advocate for bringing people together through honest, civil conversations --- and she's laid out a four-step plan to do just that.

Enjoy the complimentary clip or read the transcript for details.

Welcome to the program, Megan, how are you?

MEGAN: I'm wonderful. How are you?

GLENN: I'm good. It's really an honor to talk to you. We're big fans of what you said in your TED talk, especially from where you started, you know, in a church that is more than a little tough.

MEGAN: Yes. Absolutely.

I grew up at the Westboro Baptist Church. And my family -- the church is almost entirely my family. So around 80 percent -- there's only 80 or so people in the church. And about 80 percent are people -- my grandfather is the one who founded the church. And my mother was the de facto spokesperson for a long time. So, yeah, I grew up on the picket line.

PAT: Yeah, you actually held those hate-filled signs at funerals and other places, right?

GLENN: When you were a kid.

MEGAN: Yes. Absolutely.

PAT: Yeah.

MEGAN: It started out as a protest at a local park, and it sort of really expanded from there. As soon as, you know -- my grandfather was very aggressive, kind of hostile personality. So when people started to come out to counterprotest, everybody who was against us became a target. And eventually -- what started out as it being a protest against gay people, became, you know, we were protesting against other Christians and Jews. It expanded rapidly, until literally everyone outside of our church became a target. And so it was basically a -- you know, I was marinating in this idealogy of everybody is against us. We are against everybody because they're all against the Scriptures. You know, memorizing chapter and verse why they're wrong and why they're headed for hell. And it's our duty to go out and warn them.

STU: I'm fascinated, Megan, because I think to my childhood, and I remember fun picnics and fun trips to amusement parks and things like that. Do you have those types of memories, or is it just -- is there a competition between that and you carrying some awful sign around during a protest?

MEGAN: No. I absolutely have those memories. My -- a lot of people have a hard time understanding that they -- other than these protests and that worldview, they're -- we were a very normal -- obviously there's a lot of kids in our family. There's 11 kids in my family. And -- but we played video games and read books. And we went to public school. And, yeah, we went to amusement parks. We did all of those things, but we also -- that was all sort of organized around this nationwide picketing campaign.

So I have -- I absolutely have both, but that -- that loving family -- the nature of that is part of what makes it so, so, so hard to leave or to even consider leaving. The idea of giving it all up.

GLENN: So I just had a guy in who we're going to interview on a program that I'm working on. He was a member of the Hitler Youth. Now, he's in his 80s now. But he came of age in the Hitler Youth, until I think World War II ended, when he was 20. And he still had -- he sees the world very differently. He thinks that Churchill is a war -- should be held for war crimes. A war criminal.

STU: Hmm.

GLENN: And he doesn't agree with Hitler. But he said, I never saw -- we never saw any of that. At least he said, I didn't. I was in the front row of the 36 Olympics. You know, I -- I saw all the good stuff. And the bad stuff that was thrown up, you just dismissed it because you thought it was somebody that was trying to tear us down. Is that kind of the way your childhood was in a way?

MEGAN: Well, I mean, I know -- I knew at the time -- so, for instance, the funeral picketing, I knew at the time that it was hurtful. But the way that it was framed in our church was, you know, these people don't understand that they're headed for hell, for eternal destruction. And it's a loving thing to go and warn them.

And so I saw it as a necessary evil, like we had to go do this because this was the truth and the only thing that mattered, more than anything else was the truth. And it didn't matter how we said it, where we said, or in what context, it was always a good thing. And -- and it was a point of pride for us not to consider people's feelings.

GLENN: And the people -- and the people that were coming against you, because they were screaming back in your face, it only reinforced that these are bad people.

MEGAN: Absolutely. Especially because -- I mean, there's all these passages. So, for instance, Jesus talks about blessed are ye when men shall hate you and revile you and persecute you, for my name sake. So for us, like we wanted that. It was -- we expected it. It was confirmation that we were doing the Lord's work.

STU: Wow.

GLENN: Now, take us to how someone finally broke through.

MEGAN: So Twitter -- Twitter was -- and I didn't realize it at first. I didn't realize that it was happening exactly. But Twitter was an empathy machine for me.

I really hate how it's gotten such a bad rap because that platform has done more to teach me good communication and how to engage with people than almost anything else in my life.

So on Twitter, people would -- would come at me with the same kind of, you know, hateful rhetoric and loud, you know, accusations and just very bitter. And, again, I expected it.

And I would respond, you know, in kind. And -- but then some people -- and I don't know exactly why or what motivated them. I think they -- they saw -- they say that they saw something in me that maybe I would listen or something. But in any case, they stopped yelling and stopped, you know, insulting me and started to ask questions. And they were like -- they seemed like they were actually listening to me.

GLENN: They were honest questions. They were honest questions.

PAT: Yes.

GLENN: They weren't questions of setup.

MEGAN: Right. Exactly.

And it made me feel -- and because, again, I thought I was doing a good thing. I thought that those words that we were preaching, I thought that was the absolute, unquestionable truth. So I wanted to share it with them. That's why I was on social media.

And so I would, you know, answer their questions and sort of -- we had these back-and-forths. But then because of Twitter, I'm also seeing the photos they post of their children and their friends. And it just became this -- this way for me to see people as human beings. And it was because of the way -- because of the fact that they stopped -- the way they engaged me.

STU: That's incredible, that that came from Twitter too. Someone tweeted the other day, Instagram, my life is a party. Snapchat, my life is a quirky TV show. Facebook, my life turned out great. Twitter, we're all going to die. When I go on Twitter, man, I just get so depressed. But it's amazing you were able to take that out of this.

MEGAN: Yeah. I know. But there's a couple of things about Twitter that were really helpful to me. So like, for instance, the character limit, it first made me give up insults. Because at Westboro, we would include these elaborate insults when we responded to questions that people sent us by email. But on Twitter, there just wasn't space for it.

And also, Twitter was just this immediate feedback loop. If I did insult somebody, I could watch the conversation just derail in realtime. I could see that I wasn't getting my point across because I was too busy indulging that vengeful little voice in my head that wanted to call people names. I mean, we all have this feedback loop.

GLENN: Megan, I will tell you, I've been doing these kinds of experiments myself over the last couple of years, where I've gotten in -- because I just stopped engaging for a while. About years ago, I decided, you know what, I'm just going to answer everybody and assume the best. And just answer the -- the worst with something kind and try to be humble and kind and nice to everybody. Really hard to do.

And it's amazing the results. It's truly remarkable. It doesn't cure everybody by any stretch. But it's remarkable.

And I've talked about it on the air. And so many people say, it's not going to make a difference. You can't engage with them. They're all crazy. They're all whatever. What would you say to that?

MEGAN: Man, I just disagree so -- so much with the idea of hopelessness when it comes to talking to people.

I had -- I had grown up, you know, being -- basically cultivating this mindset of us versus them, being wary -- like specifically being wary of people's kindness. And even though I consciously was aware and trying not to be persuaded by kindness, it was still a powerful thing.

It's really interesting because over the past few years, I've been thinking about this a lot obviously. Because it's only been four years since I left. So it's kind of been just this huge -- you know, huge event in my life. And what you're describing there, about, you know, assuming the best and, you know, changing the way you respond. So if somebody comes at you angry and you respond in kindness and angry, that's called like, non-complimentary behavior. And we as human beings are wired to respond in kind.

But like you said, it's incredibly difficult to do. But we can cultivate a more useful mindset. Like one thing you said -- well, my mom used to tell me, to make sure my behavior was appropriate, I should add the word "judge" on to the end of my sentence, as in, "Here's why I did it, Judge." And I still use that trick, except now I add the word "friend." If someone attacks me and I start to get riled up, I try to pause for a beat and add friend, as if I'm disagreeing with someone I love. And I don't do it to be a goody two-shoes. I do it because it works. It's just so much more effective than anger or insults or hostility.

GLENN: All right. I want to get to -- you say there are four steps. And I want to get to those here in a second. Let me just ask you one more question, and then I have to take a quick break.

Do you -- are you well aware of how appropriately timed your discovery and your story is for the rest of the world?

MEGAN: I -- I just -- I hope that -- I hope that I can be a voice or that the story can be something that will help other people see the value in engaging. Because honestly, my experience has -- has given me so much hope. I never thought I would leave. And at first, when I first left, I thought that my family, there was no hope for most of my family. I don't believe that anymore. And I'm still reaching out to them. I'm still trying to convince them to see things other ways. And if there's hope for me, if I changed, I think that there's a lot of hope.

You know, I know that the political climate is so polarized right now, but I can't help but feel so hopeful.

GLENN: Megan Phelps-Roper. She'll continue with us here in just a second. You need to hear what her solution is. It's really a four-step process. And it's really pretty easy. Left the Westboro Baptist Church because of kindness. You want to hear her whole story. Watch the TED video because it's quite amazing.

[break]

Megan Phelps-Roper is a former member of the Westboro Baptist Church, where people were kind to her and started to talk to her. And she says, this really works. And, you know, you could be in the cult of a political part. And I think this works. I think we need this across all lines in the world right now.

Megan, you did a TED talk. You said there are four tips on how to talk to people who you disagree with.

MEGAN: Yes. Exactly.

You want me to tell them to you?

GLENN: Yeah. Sure.

MEGAN: So the first one is -- I think it's really important -- don't assume bad intent. It's so easy to look at -- I mean, Westboro is such an easy example. They've got these neon signs. It was so clearly obvious to everyone that we were hateful and evil and awful people.

GLENN: Uh-huh.

MEGAN: But underneath it was well-intentioned people trying to do what they believed was right. So it's really easy to look at the surface and assume the worst of people, assume you understand where they're coming from. But that almost immediately cuts you off from really understanding what they're about.

GLENN: It's one of the reasons why -- I've tried to cut the word evil out of my lexicon because we use that to -- too often. And we use it about people. And I really think most people have great intent. You know, Donald Trump, Barack Obama, you can disagree with either one of them, but neither one of them think they're doing evil. They think they're doing the right thing. You just don't see it that way.

MEGAN: Exactly. I think very few -- maybe sociopaths or psychopaths. And even then --

GLENN: Right.

MEGAN: People who are deliberately doing wrong, I think they're very, very, very few and far between.

GLENN: Yes. Right. And that doesn't mean you have to go along with it, but if you say to them or their followers, you know, your guy is evil, they stop listening to you.

MEGAN: Right. Exactly. And you stop asking questions to get to the bottom of it, which is the second point. Asking questions helps you bridge the gap between your point of view and theirs. It helps you understand where they're coming from actually. And it also signals to the people that you're talking to, that you're actually listening to them.

And that is a huge benefit to the dialogue because they -- they no longer -- they don't want to yell at you. They see that you want to understand. So they're much more willing to engage. So the second point is ask questions.

GLENN: And it matters that they're honest questions, not setup questions. Not a question where I know you're going to say one thing so I can give you the Scripture quote or whatever to beat you.

MEGAN: Exactly.

GLENN: It has to be a question that's not designed for me to win. We're going to take a quick break. Come back with the last two with Megan Phelps-Roper, when we come back.

(OUT AT 10:32AM)

GLENN: Megan Phelps-Roper, somebody that we saw on TED talk, giving a great TED talk on how to bring people together. She was in the -- she's a Phelps. So she's part of the founding family of the Westboro Baptist Church. And she got online and started making friends with people who were friendly to her, not just yelling at her all the time. And she said there are four things that if you really want to change people's minds, four ways of engaging people so that real conversations can take place. The first one is don't assume bad intent. Instead, assume good or neutral intent. The second, ask questions, as opposed to accusing. Ask honest questions. It will help people let them know they've been heard. And quite often, this is all that people want.

The third is stay calm. Welcome back to the program, Megan. Explain stay calm.

MEGAN: So this one is really difficult because the natural inclination is always to respond the way that somebody is -- is speaking to you. So when somebody comes at you with hostility, the instinct is to be defensive and to respond with hostility. But that just brings the conversation to an end quickly. But if you can learn to step back, calm down and -- and try to diffuse the anger -- and you can do it in a few ways.

So, for instance, I actually ended up marrying -- my husband was one of these Twitter friends who started out as this angry, sort of insulting --

GLENN: Wow.

MEGAN: We just got married seven months ago.

GLENN: Congratulations.

MEGAN: Thank you. So what he would do, for instance, he would tell a joke or recommend a book or start talking about music. He would sort of turn away from the hostility for a minute and then come back to it -- come back to it later.

You don't necessarily -- I mean, that's -- that can be a last resort. A lot of times just staying calm and speaking as if you were addressing a friend and not somebody that you hate and that you despise that you can't -- you can't stand to hear their words. It helps so much to keep the conversation going.

GLENN: Step four.

MEGAN: Step four is make the argument.

And this one -- this one seems obvious. But there's this argument that seems to have taken hold on both the left and the right. And I think it stems from the hopelessness you mentioned earlier. Oh, they're just too far gone. They can't be reasoned with. But where does that lead us?

It leaves us at loggerheads. Deadlocked. And no one wants to be there. So you make the argument because they don't understand -- your opponent doesn't necessarily understand your thinking and the way that you're approaching the problem. And by making the argument -- if you fail to do that, you're definitely not going to change someone's mind. You actually have to articulate the reasoning and the thought process behind your position.

And there's actually a fifth point that I would have included if I had enough time -- should I tell you now?

GLENN: Yeah, go ahead.

STU: We're breaking news here. The fifth point in Megan Phelps' TED talk.

GLENN: Go ahead.

(chuckling)

MEGAN: It's take heart. Changing hearts and minds is incremental work, and it takes patience and persistence. And you're not going to see results necessarily immediately, not right away, but we can't give up. You know, and you might not be the person to persuade somebody else to turn away from a bad position, but every interaction is an opportunity to help turn the tide. So stay the course, trust the process, and take heart.

GLENN: How many people -- how many people were like this to you?

MEGAN: Well, the ones who had the biggest impact -- I mean, a handful who were engaging me continually over the course of a couple of years, considering I had been in the church. I had been raised in this. And I was 24 when I got on Twitter. So I was, again, marinating in this ideology and this way of thinking. So the fact that it only took a couple of years to really affect me and how I saw things, I think that's pretty remarkable.

GLENN: So did your husband -- was there a time when your husband -- is now your husband --

MEGAN: Yeah.

GLENN: Was he falling in love with you at the time? Did that happen later? Did he say, I can't believe I'm saying this to you -- I mean, how did that happen?

MEGAN: Well, it's a -- it's a really strange -- it was a really strange dynamic because obviously I was at the church. And at Westboro, you could only marry somebody who was in the church. So we were having these discussions, and there was nothing -- it was like a Jane Austen novel, like nothing overt. Like we couldn't say how we were feeling to each other because it just wasn't acceptable. And he sensed that.

And -- but he also, again, saw that I was a human being. And he came to believe that I had a good heart.

GLENN: So would this have worked -- would this have worked without love?

MEGAN: Well, I think -- well, so here's the thing. I -- yes, I believe so. And the reason is that the very first interaction was with a friend. I mentioned him in the talk too. Jewlicious. His name is David Abitbol.

And so it was -- I think I was talking with him for a little over a year. And, again, he's asking these questions. And in the course of asking these questions, he was the one who found the first -- the first bit of internal inconsistency in Westboro's doctrines. And when I look back at how I responded to that -- so my husband -- I didn't actually start speaking to him until months after that. But when I think about how I responded to that first bit of internal inconsistency, that was when I first started to challenge, in my own mind, Westboro's doctrines.

GLENN: And you didn't let him know that.

MEGAN: No. For sure. As soon as he had made that point, I was actually terrified to speak to him again. I didn't even let on that I recognized that he was right. I just stopped speaking to him.

GLENN: Wow. What was the point, if you don't mind me asking?

MEGAN: Oh, yeah, no, not at all.

It was a sign that said "death penalty for fags."

GLENN: Oh, my gosh.

MEGAN: Yeah. So, of course -- we used, you know, the verses in Leviticus and also in Romans 1 that talk about how, you know, gays are worthy of death. And he brought up -- so he's Jewish. I was really surprised that he brought up Jesus, saying, "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."

And I didn't -- I just had never connected that that was talking about the death penalty. And we thought, we're not -- we're not casting stones. We're just preaching words.

And David said, "Yeah, but you're advocating that the government cast stones."

And so that -- when I brought that point to other members of the church, the response was just to double down. They never addressed the passage that -- you know, that contradicted us. They just reiterated the passages that supported us. And so that was the first time that -- and the way that I reconciled it in my own mind was I just stopped holding the sign because I didn't know how to defend it anymore. And I didn't believe in it.

GLENN: Did they tell you to stop talking to these people?

MEGAN: I don't think -- I don't think people quite realized how much -- I mean, they knew I was very active on Twitter, but I don't think they realized how much it was affecting the way that I was thinking. I honestly didn't -- didn't understand it either.

Because in my mind -- I think I was in denial about it because -- you are not supposed to be impacted by other people. You are not supposed to be anything, but preaching to them. You're not supposed to really, you know, care -- I was going to say care about them. It was a very strange dynamic. But I was in denial about it. And I think that definitely helped it seem to others as if it wasn't really having an impact on me also.

PAT: Is anybody in your family speaking with you? Do you have a relationship with anybody anymore in the family?

MEGAN: Not anybody in the church, no. But there has been over the last decade or so, about 20 or so people who have either left or have been kicked out of Westboro. And my brother actually, the morning of my high school graduation -- he's a year and a half older than me. We woke up and went downstairs, and all of his stuff was gone. And so I have -- I didn't get to speak with him for the eight and half years between when he left and when I left. But now we're really good friends. And he's wonderful.

PAT: What was he thrown out for?

MEGAN: No, he left actually.

PAT: Oh, he left on his own.

MEGAN: He left at 19. Yeah, he also had Scriptural objections to some things. And also the extreme -- he objected to the extreme level of control because everybody in the church -- we all lived within two blocks or so of one another and did everything together and were obviously not developing relationships with people outside. But the level of control is -- is really -- really, really extreme.

GLENN: Do they -- do you think this will just die out as the family dies out, or?

MEGAN: Actually, I thought about this. My sister and I would talk about this about how could the church end in a way that just wouldn't destroy everybody on the inside?

There's still about the same level of membership as there has been. Because a few people -- a few new converts have joined. And then, of course, my generation has now -- they're having kids. But there's not many.

GLENN: What kind of people would join -- what kind of people join this? They really believe -- the newcomers that come in --

STU: It's one thing to be raised in it, but to be converted as an adult.

GLENN: Decent people. Yeah.

MEGAN: So honestly, I've speculated about this too. So, for instance, my dad -- my dad joined the church long before the picketing started. He was only 16 at the time. And, you know, his family wasn't -- I mean, his mom had been divorced. I don't think he -- he was attracted to the love and unity and connection I think in my family. In the Phelps family, I think. And I think that's a draw for some people. And it really lends credence to the idea that they're doing what they're doing out of love, out of good intentions.

And, again, some people just, I think are drawn to that defense of the idea of having all the answers and knowing for sure what you believe and how you're supposed to live. Like, it's -- that was such a powerful thing. When I left and realized like, I don't -- I don't have that anymore. I don't have that sense of -- it's a very comforting sense of certainty. And, you know, nuance and questions and uncertainty are a lot more difficult to deal with. I think some people are attracted to that part of the church.

GLENN: Next time they're out protesting, what should people do?

MEGAN: I think engaging at protests is actually not a very effective thing because they're -- on picket lines, they're already in these attack/defend mindsets. I think the internet is a much -- you know, Twitter. There's a lot of them on Twitter now. I think that's a more effective way of engaging. But if you -- if you do see them and if you are moved to go and speak to them, just remember that -- that responding with, you know, yelling and name-calling, all those things, it just reinforces what they already believe. It's adding to, you know, their certainty that they're doing the right thing.

GLENN: It is really -- it's really great to talk to you. Megan Phelps-Roper. You can find her @MeganPhelps. That's her Twitter handle. @MeganPhelps.

Really great to talk to you. And thank you for sharing this. And I think you have an important voice that needs to be heard.

STU: And I will say, Megan, will you confirm this, because we got the fifth point out of you, we are 25 percent better than your TED talk.

MEGAN: Yeah, for sure.

GLENN: Megan, can we pay you an off-handed compliment. Stu wanted to say this, we said it during the break. And it's weird because it's exactly what we're talking about. We don't know each other. We don't talk to each other.

We look at people in the Westboro Baptist Church and think that their kids just must be dumb as a box of rocks. And just, oatmeal! Every answer is, oatmeal! (chuckling) And you're so articulate. I mean, it's amazing just to have that view shattered.

MEGAN: Thank you.

I will say -- I mean, another thing that's not so well-known about the church, education was really important in my family. Most of the people there -- many lawyers, people who work in health care, and IT. And they're very well educated.

PAT: Wow.

GLENN: Wow.

MEGAN: Which is partly I think what makes it so much more difficult for them to see outside of it. This is like a psychological thing where, by -- by having these very strong mostly internally consistent arguments, they -- they think they're so certain that they don't even question the -- they don't even question it.

GLENN: Amazing.

MEGAN: But, yeah, anyway...

GLENN: Thank you so much. @MeganPhelps. Thank you so much, Megan. Appreciate it.

MEGAN: Thank you. Thank you for having me.

GLENN: You bet.

RADIO

China, ICE, and the shutdown: Everything Trump's "60 Minutes" interview revealed

President Trump gave a master class on negotiation in his recent “60 Minutes” interview with Norah O’Donnell. Glenn and Stu review Trump’s best comments on China and Taiwan, ICE raids, and the government shutdown.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

VOICE: I know you have said that Xi Jinping wouldn't dare move militarily on Taiwan while you're in office. But what if he does?
Would you order US forces to defend Taiwan?

DONALD: You'll find out if it happens. And he understands the answer to that.
VOICE: Why not say it?
DONALD: This never even came up yesterday.

STU: Why not say it? I don't know. Tough question!

DONALD: He never brought it up, because he understands it, and he understands it very well.

VOICE: Do you mind when I ask, he understands, why not communicate that publicly to the rest of us? What does he understand?

DONALD: I can't give away my secrets. I don't want to be one of these guys that tells you exactly what is going to happen, if something happens. The other side knows, but I'm not somebody that tells you everything, because you're asking me a question. But they understand what's going to happen, and he has openly said it, and his people have openly said it. He said, we will never do anything, while President Trump is president. Because they know the consequences.

GLENN: And they do.

Now, what's her name? Norah McDonald?

Or that Norah O'Donnell. I can't remember.

STU: It's Norah O'Donnell.

GLENN: One is a comedian, and one claims to be a journalist. I don't know remember the difference. But, you know, here she is. Why won't you just say it? I don't know!

Strategery!

I mean, why wouldn't you just say it?

Presidents never say that. They never say that. Can you imagine?

What a stupid question that is.

And if you think -- go ahead.

STU: I was going to say, you know, I think Trump sometimes does say stuff like that. Right? Like he does -- for example, with North Korea. Right?

He was like, hey. We're going to blow you up. And the fires of hell are going to rain down upon you.

GLENN: Because North Korea is not China.

STU: Right. He's making decisions based on strategy with different countries. And there's different decisions to make with each nation.

GLENN: Correct.

STU: And when you look at something like this.

What he's trying to, I think communicate is he has communicated to China that they will be involved.

But he does not want to escalate it publicly.

And honestly, all of that being said, I don't know what his actual answer is. My suspicion is, we won't be involved if that happens. Honestly, like I know we promised it. But my suspicion is, if China actually goes in there, there's a good chance, we are -- we come up a reason to not be involved in it.

GLENN: We can't. We can't.

We can't be involved in that.

We will be involved in covert ways.

My guess is, we blow up all those chip factories. That's my guess. And my guess is, we have given the ability to Taiwan to do that. Long ago. I don't know.

But that's what -- that's what I would do. Because we don't have -- we cannot -- we cannot support a supply line, that far away. We just tonight. We're not capable of it.

So we don't have the supply lines. We couldn't get things there, fast enough. And they're going to overwhelm with drones. That's what -- this is going to be the fastest war ever. If they go into Taiwan. It will be over, by the time we ever get a ship or an airplane there. It will be over. They will just overwhelm the island with swarms of drones, period. So here's what the president is actually doing.

He announced a deal on economic and trade relations with China.

So here's what he -- here's the Chinese actions. You ready?

Suspend new rare earth export controls. Issue general license for exports of rare earth. Listen to what he got: Take significant measures to end the flow of fentanyl to the US. Suspend all retaliatory tariffs since March 4th. Suspend all retaliatory nontariff measures since March 4th. Purchase at least 12 million metric tons of US soybeans, and we lowered our tariffs by ten points and extended the expiration of Section 301 tariff exclusions until November 2026. Do you see what we've got? See what we gave up?

Let me just say that again. Do you see what we got and what they gave up?

The president -- it's genius how he got us here. He didn't just engage with China directly. He embarked on a massive, massive campaign, securing the rare earth minerals in all of their allies. Multiple countries.

He built an -- an alternate system that cuts China out, entirely.

Then went after Venezuela, Russia, and Iran. All the three of their major allies.

This was the equivalent of the American president, putting his foot down on the neck of China and saying, you want up?

You want up?

And China blinked because at this point, they had no choice.

China is not used to being handled like this. And he just handled them.

This is a good win for America!

So when the president is has done negotiation. Why would he go on 60 Minutes?

And insult them even more.

Why would he go and say, what you know we'll do?

We'll vaporize Beijing. And I have on good authority, that's exactly what the president said. You know, you want to do that, and I'll make Beijing disappear.

And Xi laughed at first. And what? What?

The president didn't laugh and blink. And Xi left going, he might just do it!

That's how you negotiate. That's how get all of the rare earth minerals. That's how you get this giant concession with from China. The guy -- I have to tell you, I mean, we've known this forever. How long has everyone on the planet, you know, now, of course, the left won't say it. You know, the Democrats won't say it. But everybody has always said, I wish we just had a good negotiator on our side. Wouldn't it be nice if we had somebody that looked at the country like a business. And could just run it like a business. And knew how to negotiate?

We have the best negotiator, I think we've ever had.

I can't think of anybody who is better than that.

Here's what he said, yesterday on 60 Minutes on the ICE raids. Cut ten.

VOICE: More recently, Americans have been watching videos of ICE tackling a young mother, tear gas being used in a Chicago residential neighborhood. And the smashing of car windows. Have some of these raise gone too far?

DONALD: No. I don't think they've gone far enough. Because we've been held back by the judges, by the liberal judges, that were put in by Biden and by Obama.

VOICE: You're okay with those tactics?

DONALD: Yeah, because you have to get those people out. You have to look at the people. Many of them are murderers. Many of them are people that were thrown out of their countries because they were criminal.

GLENN: What do you think of that, Stu?

STU: Again, he's not going to back down from that policy, not a surprise.

GLENN: Uh-uh.

STU: Criminals, you know -- it is such a popular issue to get rid of people who are violent criminals in this country.

That he's going to lock into that, no matter what the tactics look like. As long as they don't look cruel to people who are innocent.

GLENN: Yes.

STU: Right? That's the type of stuff he would get beat up.

GLENN: Yes. Yes.

STU: These are people here illegally.

And it's not -- like, you know. He's beating a mom to -- these people are beating moms to death in the streets. Of course, it's going to be something different.

What we're seeing is, what? They're getting arrested on their way to work?

I don't think that's going to be controversial at all to the American people.

GLENN: Seventy percent of the American people agree with the ICE raids.

Seventy percent. No matter what the mainstream media makes it look. That's the latest poll. Have you read another poll? Stu, you're looking at me --

STU: I have seen more negative polling on the issue, generally.

It is -- I think --

GLENN: I just saw one yesterday or today, 70 percent.

STU: I'll have to --

GLENN: Is it in the show prep today?

STU: I did see that poll somewhere.

GLENN: Yeah.

STU: I wouldn't say -- his border policy is among his most popular policy. There have been some more negative reactions. Not on the right. But on the left. And the -- and the -- and independent voters, who are concerned about these tactics generally.

Now, of course, what they've received about this is basically, this is the gestapo. So you would understand, that their analysis of what they're hearing in the media, is that it's a negative.

I think though, when you look at these individual cases. People wind up realizing, okay. That's not what's actually going on.

You know, I do think that generally speaking, this is a positive issue from him.

Certainly, it's one of the issues that he cares about the most. And he's not going to back off of it. I think there's this idea that the media can try to corner him. And he will try to back down. When does this occur?

This is not -- the only time Trump has ever really backed down on anything is when, occasionally you'll get a situation where his base says no. We can remember cases of this, with the Second Amendment. He said something to the effect of, well, we'll go in there. We'll take the guns first, and then we'll have a trial. His base said, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. That's not the way it should work.

And he backed off of that. That does sort of happen occasionally. And you'll see occasionally, when it comes to economic consequences.

This is the -- you could argue, that, you know, he backs off on some of those stuff, when he sees the market crash or some of that sort. Really, with stuff like this. There's no sign of him backing down. He believes the policy is correct.

He believes these people should leave. And I think, at this point, most people who are border hawks, if they have any complaint about what's going on at the border, it's more than at that it's not enough. It's not been widespread enough.

It has been a situation where it's been focused on. You know, we have a lot of attention on the Maryland father who went to El Salvador.

When I think the issue is larger than a few of these cases. So that is probably the only complaint you would have from people who agree with him.

GLENN: One minute, ten seconds, and we're back to the show. Sometimes, sleep feels like a puzzle, you just can't solve, no matter how hard you try. You lay there, replaying the day. Your mind on a never-ending loop. And all of a sudden, morning is here. Comes too fast. Z Factor is a sleep supplement, designed to help you turn off that noise. Not with harsh sedation, but with a gentle, purposeful push toward real rest. It was created by the same team behind Relief Factor. And people understand how the body and the brain need different kinds of support. And Z Factor helps you quiet the rumbling thoughts so you fall asleep more easily, stay asleep more often, and awake feeling less fragile and more like yourself again.

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(music)
Ten seconds, back to the show.

So let me take on now what happened with the shutdown. Here's cut 11. Trump on 60 Minutes last night.

VOICE: And the shutdown.

DONALD: Well, what we're doing is we keep voting. The Republicans are voting almost unanimously to end it. And the Democrats keep voting against any -- you know, they've never had this.

This has happened like 18 times before. The Democrats always voted for an extension.

Always saying, give us an extension. We'll work it out. They've lost their way. They've become crazed lunatics. And all they have to do, nor a,is say, let's vote!

VOICE: Senate Democrats say, they will vote to reopen the government if Republicans agree to extend subsidies for over 20 million Americans who use Obamacare for their health insurance.

DONALD: Obamacare is terrible.

It's bad health care at far too high a price.

We should fix that! We should fix it. And we can fix it with the Democrats. All they have to do is let the country open, and we will fix it. We have to let the country open, and I will sit down with the Democrats, and we'll fix it. But they have to let the country -- and you know what they have to do? All they have to do is raise five hands. We don't need all of them.

GLENN: Notice, I mean, he is pissed about this.

He wants to fix this.

He wants -- I mean, he does not like Obamacare. But he also is probably -- leans more. See if you agree with this, Stu.

Leans more towards the Democrat kind of fixing of health care than where I would lean. I would lean, shut it all off. Shut it all off. Get all of the government regulation out of insurance and everything else.

Let all of this stuff just be a free market again. And I think you would fix a lot of this.

I don't think that's Donald Trump's point of view. Do you?

STU: No. I don't think so.

Again, we talked about how the border say real passion issue for him. I don't think the health care thing is.

I just don't think that's central to his -- you know, his belief structure long-term.

You saw what happened. He tried to -- he did try, I think, at the beginning to get rid of Obamacare. I think there was a legitimate effort made. It did not work.

DONALD: Yeah. I don't think the Republicans did.

STU: Certainly, many did. Many did. Obviously, it failed. John McCain, famously.

GLENN: Yeah. Right.

STU: Although, that's a little bit blown out of proportion, as the moment where it failed. If it had actually failed before that, regardless, it was something that he promised voters that he would try to do. It didn't work. And I think he's moved on from those sorts of real solutions, that I wouldn't favor. That you would favor.

GLENN: Right. Let me play one more. Cut 12, please.

VOICE: Government shutdowns in the past. And you did it by -- members of Congress, into the White House.

DONALD: I'm not going to do it by extortion. I'm not going to do it by being extorted by the Democrats who have lost their way. There's something wrong with these people.

VOICE: So then what happens on November 5th, when the troops --

DONALD: Schumer is a basket case, and he has nothing to lose. He's become -- I just like Japan. He's become a kamikaze pilot.

VOICE: Sounds like it's not going to get solved the shutdown.

DONALD: It's going to get solved. Oh, it will get solved.

VOICE: How?

DONALD: We'll get it solved. Eventually, they will have to vote.

GLENN: How?

Because I'm on the completely reasonable side, and you seem completely unreasonable.

How? How is this ever going to stop?

Because you won't give the Democrats what they want.

She is so -- she's so mainstream old-fashioned media. Just sickening.

THE GLENN BECK PODCAST

The Satanic Cult Fueling Mexico’s Cartels - 'Santa Muerte' Exposed

Mexico’s cartel war isn’t just about drugs or power — it’s about evil itself. Glenn Beck sits down with former federal agent Dave Franke to expose the satanic cult of Santa Muerte, the so-called “saint of death” worshiped by cartel members across Mexico. From ritual killings and demonic symbolism to deep government corruption and spiritual decay, Glenn and Dave reveal how Mexico’s violence is being fueled by a dark, religious devotion to death. This is the story the media won’t tell — and a warning for America about what happens when faith collapses and evil fills the void.

Watch Glenn Beck's FULL Interview with Dave Franke HERE

RADIO

This Reviewer Just DESTROYED Karine Jean-Pierre's New Book

In what might be a first in the program’s history, Glenn reads a book review in its entirety. What review is worthy of such an accomplishment? The most brutal book review of former White House Press Secretary Karine Jean-Pierre's new book, 'Independent: A Look Inside a Broken White House, Outside the Party Lines." Glenn reads through the scathing review written by Andrew Stiles of the Washington Free Beacon, as he and Stu look back at how bad Karine Jean-Pierre was at everything she did.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: I don't think I've ever read a book review, word-for-word on the air before. And I'm not sure I've ever even read a book review on the air before, more than a paragraph. But this book review is so good. It must be read verbatim. A book so bad, it has shattered liberal's faith in DEI. It is a Free Beacon review of Independent: A Look Inside A Broken White House, Outside the Party Lines, by Karine Jean-Pierre. Are you ready?

Stu, you're going to love this. Karine Jean-Pierre cannot stop making history. Earlier this year, the former White House Press Secretary became the highest ranking openly queer French-born black woman with a hyphenated surname to publicly renounce the Democratic Party for being mean to Joe Biden. She is the only black female lesbian immigrant to publish a book about her time in the Biden administration. And it is the worst political memoir ever written in the history of the English language!
(laughter)
This is not hyperbole. It is an especially vacuous genre and highly competitive to be sure. But imagine writing a book so bad, it could shame Democrats and liberals into second-guessing their cult-like devotion to DEI.

That is exactly what Jean-Pierre has done with her book, Independent. In 2022, Jean-Pierre's promotion to White House press secretary was hailed by Democrats and journalists, where to the extent there's a difference, as a triumph for diversity and representation. She is now wildly viewed in the words of a reporter who worked with her, as the most incompetent and irrelevant White House Press Secretary ever.

Former colleagues now describe her as ineffectual, unprepared, and kind of dumb. Jean-Pierre's book tour, if you can call it that, as now been described as a car crash, a non-stop cringe. She fumbles her way through interviews, repeatedly invoking her lived experience as awe trailblazing black woman and openly gay pioneer. The same people who pioneered her historic promotion and the first to denounce her critics as bigots are rolling their eyes. Every time she falls back on identity politics instead of actually answering a question, she reinforces the worst stereotype about Democrats says a former White House colleague. Her egregious performance in an interview with the New Yorker, one democratic strategist likened it to Mike Tyson. Mike Tyson is fighting a baby.
(laughter)
Jean-Pierre told the New Yorker, the broken White House, in reference to the subtitle. Remember, it's Independent. A look inside a broken White House, outside the party lines.

Okay? So she's in the interview, with the reporter from the New Yorker. The broken White House referenced in the subtitle, she said is actually a reference to Donald Trump's White House, not the one that she was writing about, or everyone assumed she was writing about.

It's a strange thing to lie about, and a clueless person might blurt out when they get flustered. But in the author's defense, even a semi-talented communicator would struggle to defend this drivel. Readers may be surprised to learn that Jean-Pierre became a professional spokesperson, because she was even less capable in a different field.

I wish I would have known this. Did you know this? Her parents, "Oh, God, help us!"

Her parents wanted her to become a doctor.

STU: Oh, my God.

GLENN: Imagine. But she flunked the medical school entrance exam. So she switched the Ivy League to Democratic Party pipeline, where talent barely matters, when there's history to be made with every promotion.

Maybe it's just a coincidence, but Jean-Pierre implies all of her jobs since have been plagued by disloyal leagues who question her competence. Love -- I love that. I love that.

At some point, you do -- if this is your experience time after time after time, eventually, you do have to ask, maybe it's me!

And I know this from experience. Because that was my experience.

I was so egotistical and full of myself when I was in my 20s.

That I couldn't work with anybody.

Because they're all incompetent.

They're all whatever.

You know, no!

Glenn, you're an ass.

That's what I finally came to the conclusion.

Why does everybody say, I'm an ass?

Well, probably because I was an ass, that's why.

STU: Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

GLENN: Independent, her book, which is both mercifully brief, 172 pages, and intolerably long.

STU: 172 pages?

GLENN: 172 pages.

STU: I had idea. That, I mean, that is a great description of it too. That is amazingly short for the -- the stuff she's talking about.

GLENN: It's like a bathroom reader. It's a bathroom reader.

STU: But I imagine reading it, it must feel eternal.

GLENN: Intolerably long.
(laughter)

I love this review.

I want to hug the person who wrote this review. Jean-Pierre claims, she never noticed Biden's cognitive decline, despite meeting with him at least once a day for two and a half years.

Her observations reflect an alarming disconnect with reality. She denounces the media for grilling the Democrats and soft-balling the Republicans.

She recounts her disbelief when days after that one, quoting, one wobbly debate, where Biden bragged about beating Medicare, blah, blah, blah.
Not a single -- I'm quoting from the book. Where Biden bragged about beating Medicare, blah, blah, blah. Not a single reporter asked a question about his landmark efforts to bring about social justice, end quote.

STU: Oh -- oh.

GLENN: Like her rambling press briefings, Jean-Pierre's proceeds is riddled with contradictions that boggle the mind. Democrats should have been more loyal to Biden.

That's why she left the party. She's an independent now, because no entity deserves blind loyalty. I want you to remember that. No entity remembers blind loyalty.

Multiple interviewers have noted the discrepancy. Pierre, who holds a Master's Degree from Columbia University doesn't follow.

STU: I mean, Columbia University has to -- is -- got to be ashamed of themselves for that.

I understand she didn't -- she just handed it to her. I get it. That is a disgrace. How could you act as if she could graduate something?

That is a completely ridiculous concept!

GLENN: Columbia university hosted Nazis, to speak the campus in the 1930s.

And then sheltered Nazis in the -- in the -- you know, in the campus.

And as teachers.

I mean, what -- if you're not embarrassed by that crap, what, you're embarrassed by her?

Not a chance. Not a chance.

For obvious reasons, she declines to note that Barack Obama was one of the party leader's most skeptical of Harris. She said, she never really believed that Kamala Harris could win, but any Democrat who argued with her or suggested Harris should compete for the nomination was insulting all black women. It's easy to see why Democrats are so annoyed. Her absurd retelling of the 2024 election, notwithstanding, Jean-Pierre has no useful suggestions to offer.

GLENN: This is her book.

Democrats should think creatively, move nimbly, and plan strategically, in pursuit of bolder solutions. Oh, my gosh.

STU: That's just nothing.

GLENN: Empathy is key.

STU: Hmm.

GLENN: Stop supporting the candidates who are elected, instead, backing the inspirational ones. Democrats should look -- Democrats should look to the Grammy Awards for inspiration because we all know how popular the Grammy awards are.

Watching all those Hollywood millionaires denouncing Trump reminded me that monumental change was possible. One of Jean-Pierre's boldest ideas, something Democrats should definitely consider is restarting the vigorous conversation about being antiracist.

STU: Hmm.

GLENN: Alas, Jean-Pierre is no longer a Democrat. Now, remember, she said, no blind loyalty, right?

She's no longer a Democrat because she does not believe in blind loyalty.

Okay. All right. She explains in -- in the pages that follow in so many words. She explains that leaving the party was a tantrum-like plea for attention. A deeply personal quest for new ways to be acknowledged. That's a quote.

Her leaving the party was a quest for new ways to be acknowledged. And it's also about self-care.

Now, she's left the party. Because nobody gets blind loyalty.

But she'll never vote for a Republican, or even a third party candidate.
(laughter)

STU: Well, then what?

GLENN: Wait.

Wait. If you'll rule those two out, I won't vote for a third party.

And I won't vote for a Republican. But I'm not going to vote.

But they don't get my blind loyalty.

STU: Gosh. She's an idiot.

GLENN: I mean, really.

STU: I would love to say, it's more complicated than that.

But she's just a vapid moron.

GLENN: No. Moron. Moron.

Jean-Pierre urges others to follow suit, to proclaim their independence and follow their own political compass. She doesn't have a political compass.

What is she saying? She's still going to vote the same way?

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: It's an incredibly brave thing to do. She says.

Listen to this. It's so important to carry around the talisman to remind you of the values you hold.

Like, a biography of a poet who spoke to a better world and spoke a better world into existence.

Yeah. I'm walking around all the time, with a -- with an old book of poetry.

Or a pebble from a peach, where you once dreamed and felt free. She says, she hopes the book will provoke a more nuanced political conversation. It certainly has provoked a conversation, shockingly nuanced in its context of the Democrat Party politics. It's just not the one she was expecting. That is fantastic.

STU: It's a great review.

And I fear it's -- maybe they went a little light on her, honestly.

GLENN: It's only 172 pages.

STU: Yes. So what can you do?

GLENN: Yeah.

STU: I will say, the part that's most frustrating about it. Talking about the interviews she's done on this book tour.

Which have been, among the worst interviews I've ever seen with someone, who is supposed to have an operating brain inside their skull.

And what's frustrating about that is all of those moments were readily available to every media member, the entire time she was White House press secretary.

GLENN: Yep. Yep.

STU: If anyone of them asked her any difficult questions the entire time she worked there, they would have learned all of this stuff before.

GLENN: All of it. All of it.

STU: Now they find it okay to actually press her on these issues. Because they don't care about her book sales.

GLENN: Right. And the same thing.

Look what's happening. I mean, her and Kamala Harris are exactly the same story.

It's DEI in action. They're exactly the same story.

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: Both vapid. One more so than other.

One is vapid. And I believe filled with so much helium, that she could float away to the sun.

But the same kind of stuff. Is happening with -- with Kamala. Once they are asked questions, you see, they can't handle it.

Any idea what they're talking about.

STU: Yes. I think that's true.

I think there's a comparison to be made there. I do think Kamala has proven herself to be an able back room warrior.

She is in multiple ways, some of which the back room, there's a bed in it.

And then other ways, it's also, that she is legitimately good.

And I mean this sincerely.

Legitimately good, at haranguing a bunch of donors to her side in a democratic scuffle.

She is -- has done that multiple times throughout her entire career.

Behind closed doors to be able to kind of pressure and harangue people into donating into her. Into supporting her over other Democrats. She really. The way she just wrestled. I mean, Barack Obama with his 96 percent approval rating among Democrats. Came out and said, I can't wait to see what process we have. To determine what the next nominee will be.

GLENN: Oh, I know.

STU: And hours, she had the nomination. She is legitimate am good at that one thing.

GLENN: Yes.

STU: Which is unlike Karine Jean-Pierre. Who is legitimately good at nothing.

GLENN: I understand, when you're talked about the gravity or the pull, you know, of the individual, you know, in comparison to the Pluto-like gravity of Jean-Pierre, okay?

STU: Yeah.

GLENN: Yes. She does make, you know, Kamala Harris look like the sun. Okay?

STU: Right.

GLENN: I do understand that. But comparatively speaking, they are -- they are both in a different universe entirely.

RADIO

“HORRIFIC”: Jamaica UNRECOGNIZABLE a week after Hurricane Melissa

Hurricane Melissa has devastated Jamaica and Mercury One is on the ground to help with recovery efforts. Glenn speaks with Jack Brewer, who just returned from Jamaica. Jack describes the tragedy, which he calls “one of the worst I have seen,” and explains how people like you can help get aid to people in regions where “NO ONE” has come to help, even 6 days after the storm.

Transcript

Below is a rush transcript that may contain errors

GLENN: I don't know if you've been paying attention at all to what happened with Hurricane Melissa. But, you know, it's been, what? Five days since Melissa pummeled Jamaica. I mean, pummeled it.

And not a lot of people are showing up. It's -- it's -- it's really not good.

At least 28 people have died, since the hurricane hit. Monster category five. 185-mile-an-hour winds. They say, trees are just piled up everywhere. 400 people in Jamaica. 400,000 people in Jamaica have zero power. They don't have cell phone service. They don't have Wi-Fi.

They don't have water.

And they don't -- and, again, like I said, nobody is coming. Mercury One was there, over the weekend, and Jack Brewer was there. Jack is -- Jack is an amazing guy. He's a three-time NFL team captain. He was -- he is a minister. Humanitarian civil rights commissioner on the US Commission for the social status of black men and boys. Vice chair of the Florida Department of Juvenile Justice Advisory Board.

Leads a national advocacy for fatherhood. Criminal justice reform. A really, really good guy.

In fact, he just won Mercury One's angel Bonhoeffer award. Which is really for very, very special people. He was down with us in Jamaica, just this weekend. He just got home. I wanted to get an update on what he saw. Jack, welcome to the program.

JACK: How are you doing, Glenn? Thanks for having me.

GLENN: You bet. What did you see down in Jamaica?

JACK: It was horrific. You know, I've been doing this organization, going on our 20th year. So I've seen disasters from across Africa and throughout the Caribbean, and obviously in the US. This is one of the worst that I've seen, just in regards to the devastation. Homes completely leveled. I mean, down to the foundation.

And, you know, the entire West side of Jamaica is without water. Without electricity. And, you know, it's hard -- it's tough terrain. Because a lot of these people kind of live up in the hills and the mountainous areas. And so as these trees have fallen down, you know, the infrastructure, electricity wattage is pretty old.

And so the electric wires are just twisted all in the trees. And it's -- you know, as you're driving around, you know, you're being whipped by electric wires and just a tough terrain. And unfortunately, everywhere that we were able to get to, we were the first there.

And this is -- now we're going on six days after the storm. And these people don't have water. They don't have electricity. You see, just piles and piles of -- of humans sitting next to each other. Trying to get water. They're washing their clothes with the saltwater. And, you know, they're -- they're -- the gas pumps have run out. You know, there are fights at the gas pumps. Because people are trying to desperately get enough fuel, you know, if they do have a generator to get fuel for it. Or cars to get places.

And the most heartbreaking thing is that folks haven't found their family members.

You know, there's no communication. You know, we brought several thousand Starlinks with us, we brought battery backs and start to give them to the people. But, you know, they haven't communicated with their people. They have -- there's still so many folks. When I was there, they had just found six more bodies in the area.

And they were asking us for cadaver dogs, and asking us if we could, you know, assist with them.

GLENN: Oh, my gosh.

JACK: It's terrible, it really is, Glenn.

GLENN: Oh, my gosh. Did you see any American forces?

I mean, did you see any -- who did you see there?

I keep hearing that nobody was there. But there has to be somebody.

JACK: Nobody. Well, I saw a couple helicopters in the air. You know, I saw a couple military helicopters in the air. But again, when you get up into these mountainous regions, the higher up you go, the worse the devastation. If you were just to go there, and you look down. Like a normal hurricane. You know, trees down. And, you know, it's a difficult place. But when you start to go up these mountains, just I'm talking about a quarter mile, everything is wiped out. Literally, Glenn, no one has come.

I went to village after village, town after town, no aid organization has come. I think they just started to try to get the West more -- because you have to take a helicopter to get in there. But if you start at Montego Bay and start to work your way down South. A small little town like Tucker, Westmoreland.

If you go down the Black River, in those areas, those areas are decimated. And so, you know, they're sleeping outside. And another thing, Glenn. That has been an issue. It hasn't stopped raining. It's been raining every day. So everything is mucky.

When we got there on Saturday, I mean, literally we had to divert from a flood. You know, the floodwaters started rising on our car. Got up to almost the window. We had to get out of there. I think, three days after the storm. And so they're still dealing with the water. And now they don't have any shelter. So we've been trying to deliver, as many tarps and tents and those type of things that we can, just for the short-term. Because obviously, they're going to start dealing with water-born diseases and mosquitoes. And so we've been trying to bring as much insect repellent for these people.

So it's a lot different. And it's a lot different in Haiti. I tell people, the people of Jamaica aren't used to this.

You know, they've lived their lives with electricity. And, you know, they're not -- they're not used to living in these type of conditions. So it's been really rough. You know, particularly on the children of those communities, and we saw households. You know, that they were -- they didn't have a place to go shelter in. You know, I talked to probably 25 different families that were inside of their homes, as they blew completely down!

I mean, all walls down, roofs, torn off their homes. And now all of their belongs are scattered around the neighborhood. It's depressing.

GLENN: I know we're trying to fill a plane. We -- we're sending a cargo plane on Wednesday, and we so desperately need your help.

One hundred percent of your donation to M1 right now, will go help the people of Jamaica. Can you compare this to what we saw in North Carolina?

JACK: No question. The difference between here and North Carolina, we have something called insurance. And we have helicopters. And, you know, we have actually -- you know, you know, our fellow Americans can get there. You know, in Jamaica, they don't have that option. And it's -- it's really depressing. Because you can tell the people were already, you know, living in poverty.

And now, you know, they're dealing with the reality.

And, I mean, but I will say one thing though, Glenn.

The love of God and the thankfulness and the -- the smiling and the worshiping, that was happening, in these towns I was in -- it motivated me. It lifted me up. It humbled me.

To see people that literally lost it all. But they were so thankful. And they said, you know what, we're living to see another take.

God has given us another chance to recover. We have our life. We have our children.

You know, many of them have lost loved ones and family members. And so they were just grateful to be alive.

And so it was a humbling experience. But, you know, to answer your question, yeah. From a destructive perspective, it's very similar to what we saw in the Carolinas.

It's just -- the -- the recovery. And the need now, where there's water and food, you know, it's -- desperate, at this time.

GLENN: Yeah. We have really good people drive from all over the country, to get there.

They just felt prompted to go do it.

And, you know, you're not driving to Jamaica.

That's really difficult.

JACK: That's right.

GLENN: Anyway, we have a cargo plane going out on Wednesday. We really need your help. You can go to MercuryOne.org and donate. We're still in North Carolina. We are rebuilding. We're still in the Texas Hill Country.

We're in Alaska, after the horrific -- the horrific typhoon that hit just a few weeks back. We're all over. And we're getting ready to go to Africa with the Nazarene Fund to rescue Christians.

We really need your help. And, again, I give you my word, 100 percent of it goes right directly to the cause. There's no funding that -- nothing comes off the top.

It will go right to the cause. So go to MercuryOne.org. And help us help people.

MercuryOne.org.

Jack, have you been over, and have you seen what's happening over in Africa?

JACK: So I've done extensive work in Africa. I have not directly in the northern portions of Nigeria. I do plan to go there very soon.

I have been -- I actually have a number of our partners there. You know, we run about 50 orphanages in Africa, so I'm used to that terrain.

But I can tell you, I've been telling a lot of folks on the ground, it's a really sad situation. You know, the people that are being persecuted, the Christians that are being persecuted are the poorest of the poor.

These people are living in conditions where, you know, they don't have running water.

Many of them. And they live in villages. You know, of little means. So these Islamic groups have really come in and taken advantage of them. And, you know, taken over their villages.

So I ask, how are you able to just take over a village?

How can you take over that many people?

How come they haven't fought back? Are these the most vulnerable people in the world. The people who Christ told us to protect as Christians. So I'm just, I'm so happy that President Trump stepped in.

GLENN: Me too.

JACK: The statement, backed up by our amazing Secretary of War Pete Hegseth.

But we have to do something about this.

The precedent that is set in, is one that is dangerous for the world.

You know, it's also happening in Sudan, running rampant now.

GLENN: I've -- I've heard Sudan is actually in some ways worse, and nobody is paying attention to Sudan.

I mean, barely anybody is paying attention to Nigeria.

But what I'm hearing coming out of Sudan is awful.

JACK: Yeah, it's awful. It really is awful.

And Sudan is a little bit different because you have more of a Muslim country. You know, Nigeria has had a really thriving Christian community --

GLENN: Right.

JACK: -- in the past.

And, you know, for some reason, I think this government that they have now has this Islamic influence over it that is really trying to -- and they're telling their people that it's propaganda. So if you ask a Nigerian, maybe they will tell you it's all propaganda. It's propaganda.

But, you know, the world is starting to see it. And so I think they'll have to really address these issues. And not be able to just use their media to distort the narrative for their -- for their people.

It's important for the Nigeria to (phone cuts out), I feel. And I just pray that, you know, President Trump and our administration continues to use our influence on the world, to protect our Christian brothers and sisters.

GLENN: Jack, it was good to see you the other night. Thank you so much. Appreciate all that you do.

JACK: Yeah. Thank you, Glenn. Just so you know and all your listeners, man, without Mercury One, we wouldn't be able to do any of this work. You know, the Bible tells us that we all -- we all need elders. And we need people who God has appointed to us.

I know our organization knows that God has appointed you to us. We have been able to affect the lives of so many people, man. I mean, the poorest of the poor and the forgotten because of the support of Mercury One. And I'm just humbled to be your partner and your friend and brother. And just, I pray, we will continue to lock our arms, to help those that are hurting around our world.

GLENN: You are one of the many Moses figures that we play into and hold our arms up. You're doing all the hard work, Jack. Thank you so much.

If you can help us, please, go to MercuryOne.org. That's MercuryOne.org.

You can donate. There's many things going on, our general fund will allow you -- will allow the money to go to many different things as it's needed.

But right now, we really need the help for Jamaica. We're filling a cargo plane on Wednesday to get it there. This is for the poorest of the poor. The people that are just completely left alone, as -- as Jack said. And I talked to Mercury One earlier today.

They're like, Glenn, nobody is there. Like, nobody is there.

Our governments, you know, their government. Our government failed us here.

Their government, I mean, it's just -- it's -- we have to help each other.

We have to help each other.

MercuryOne.org. That's MercuryOne.org.

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